New Umnum today...very tight...

Chris Reeve Knives said:
A few comments for this discussion that I would have liked to have posted earlier but I just did not get a chance :

Gotsouthern – I have spoken with Charmaine, our customer service gal with whom you spoke yesterday, and she remembers the conversation. I apologize that she did not insist you send the knife back to us. That is our policy – if there is some circumstance where that is difficult (like the customer being out of the USA or some particular time constraint), then we offer the customer the option to try to remedy by himself. I would still encourage you to return the knife to us so please contact me to make arrangements crkinfo@chrisreeve.com or 208-375-0367. We inspect all knives leaving the shop thoroughly and if, for whatever reason, our customer gets a knife that is difficult to open or there is some other area of concern, we want to know about it. This is true for all customers so Komodor, please consider yourself included!


Please bear in mind that the Umnumzaan opens by pushing your thumb straight forward against the thumblug, parallel with the handle. This is different from the Sebenza that needs a sideways, sweeping motion.


To address other parts of the discussion concerning the supplying of the take down tool and Chris’s philosophy etc.

Chris’s philosophy about making knives that are well designed, perform exceptionally, are manufactured to the highest standards and are supported by outstanding customer service have not changed in the slightest. His philosophy about customers disassembling their knives has not changed either. What we all wonder about is why some of our customers receive brand new knives, in perfect condition, and within minutes have to them apart – but that is another discussion!

There is good reason why we don’t supply the take down kit with every Umnumzaan. The reality of our experience is that the number of customers who do not disassemble their knives is quite a bit higher than the number that do disassemble them. (While this might not be the case for Bladeforum participants who are a pretty fervent bunch, it is true for the rest of our customer base.) The allen wrench supplied with each Sebenza costs us 18 cents. The Umnumzaan take down kit contains two wrenches, two delrin tools, a container of Loctite and booklet with instructions on how to dis- and re-assemble. At our current retail price of $7.50, we have been losing money on the kit and are going to have to increase the price. However, recognizing that it the tool is a custom item and cannot be purchased elsewhere, we choose to keep the price very reasonable at $12.50.

Yes, we it did take us a while to get the kit to market. We were having the tools made by a local machine shop at a cost to us of $10.00 each. It took a few months for us to purchase the lathe, develop the process so the cost could be reduced......

Should we increase the price of every Umnumzaan for a kit that a majority of our customers don’t want and won’t use, or should we offer the kit as an accessory?

Anne
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Hi Anne, good to see you post here....Just curious if you will be taking care of the return shipping for the customer in a case like this ?

Would it not be cheaper for you to send him a tool rather than pay shipping both ways....just a thought.

I think from what i have seen ...everyone has a different idea of the resistance they like in opening there knife....i know i like mine looser than Chris would approve. :)
 
Anne (I take it lol)...

Charmaine was fine, no big deal. I kinda wanted the tools anyhow. If I can't get it right when those show up, I'll be in touch and we'll go from there. You guys build a mean knife, very impressed with the build quality. And whatever you do to sharpen these things, it works!! Thanks for chiming in.
 
IMO no knife should require a 'kit' merely to adjust the pivot.

Emerson use a simple flat head screw to secure the main pivot on their knives.

So the only 'kit' you need to adjust that is the loose change in your pocket. ;)
 
It's kinda funny...striders need a special tool for there pivot....i'm not sure if strider ever offered one.....i have seen the after market ones range from 30-100 bucks.
 
Very interesting thread here....Just had to pop in to see what was up. Seems my email has been down for awhile and in the last few days I have gotten a few requests for tools. Anyway...Interesting.
 
Buffalohump said:
IMO no knife should require a 'kit' merely to adjust the pivot.

Emerson use a simple flat head screw to secure the main pivot on their knives.

So the only 'kit' you need to adjust that is the loose change in your pocket. ;)
Click to expand...

First off, coming from the factory the Umnumzaan pivot doesn't need to be adjusted unless an anomalous situation exists. In such a rare case, a call to CRK and the problem will be resolved.

Regarding the need for custom parts requiring a special tool for maintenance: In any design, the designer needs to balance such areas as performance (strength, quality, reliability, etc), human factors (size, shape, feel, and other ease of use characteristics), serviceability, aesthetics, and product cost. With the Umnumzaan, it’s pretty clear that Chris went for performance and human factors, and the knife looks pretty hot as well. He could have used standard parts, but to do so, he would have sacrificed strength, reliability, look and feel of the knife, etc. Personally, I like Chris’s design priorities.

As for the take down tool kit, even if a special tool was not needed, CRK has placed in the kit everything else one needs to do a top shelf clean/lube job. For the few customers that really want to dive into this task, the kit solves a lot of the guess-work that clearly occurs (as witnessed by the many threads asking for advice on this topic, including the one going on today 20+ years after the Sebenza's intro). The kit being an extra doesn’t burden the product cost to the majority of customers that would never use it. A solution in the best interest of the majority, but insures that the minority is well taken care of – perfect.
 
Fooj said:
First off, coming from the factory the Umnumzaan pivot doesn't need to be adjusted unless an anomalous situation exists. In such a rare case, a call to CRK and the problem will be resolved.

Regarding the need for custom parts requiring a special tool for maintenance: In any design, the designer needs to balance such areas as performance (strength, quality, reliability, etc), human factors (size, shape, feel, and other ease of use characteristics), serviceability, aesthetics, and product cost. With the Umnumzaan, it’s pretty clear that Chris went for performance and human factors, and the knife looks pretty hot as well. He could have used standard parts, but to do so, he would have sacrificed strength, reliability, look and feel of the knife, etc. Personally, I like Chris’s design priorities.

As for the take down tool kit, even if a special tool was not needed, CRK has placed in the kit everything else one needs to do a top shelf clean/lube job. For the few customers that really want to dive into this task, the kit solves a lot of the guess-work that clearly occurs (as witnessed by the many threads asking for advice on this topic, including the one going on today 20+ years after the Sebenza's intro). The kit being an extra doesn’t burden the product cost to the majority of customers that would never use it. A solution in the best interest of the majority, but insures that the minority is well taken care of – perfect.
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As always, very insightful Fooj. I thought I might add a bit more to your post.

For the most part, we all have total freedom to purchase what we see fit. That is always a given. There are commonalities in design between a wide range of knives and their pivot mechanisms. Chris very well could have gone with the flow as it were and used another makers design for the pivot. Personally, I feel that the route he did take set his knives apart from the rest. He made the pivot "his" if that makes any sense. I am not talking about the design of the pivot, but the adjustment was a personalization that is uniquely "Reeve" to add to the aesthetic of the rest of the knife.

In the end, I love my Umnumzaan. It has been my constant companion for a year and I am lost without it. Spending $7-13 dollars on a tool to care for my $400.00 knife is the LEAST of my worries. After all, it is MY companion.
 
bigmark408 said:
It's kinda funny...striders need a special tool for there pivot....i'm not sure if strider ever offered one.....i have seen the after market ones range from 30-100 bucks.
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I recently bought a Parktool Chainring Nut Wrench at my local bike shop for 3 bucks. I spent about 3 minutes filing the Parktool with my Leatherman Charge for the perfect fit, and it works great as a Strider takedown tool. Not as "cool" as the expense ones like the Atwood tools, but you can not beat the price.
 
Buffalohump said:
IMO no knife should require a 'kit' merely to adjust the pivot.

Emerson use a simple flat head screw to secure the main pivot on their knives.

So the only 'kit' you need to adjust that is the loose change in your pocket. ;)
Click to expand...

Then don't buy the knife. It is a great thing choices are available. Be happy, buy a sebenza:)
 
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Chris Reeve Knives said:

Should we increase the price of every Umnumzaan for a kit that a majority of our customers don’t want and won’t use, or should we offer the kit as an accessory?

Anne
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Sell them separately - once I own more than one Umnu I wouldn't need but one takedown kit. :)
 
Harry Callahan said:
While it is BS to have to shell out a tenspot for the takedown tool, I'll tell you what's even WORSE. When I bought my Zaan from the Pharmacy they didn't have any takedown tools, so I said "no problem" I can score one online. Got home and fired up the internet only to find that the tool was unavailable anywhere. CRK was working on them but there were none on the market. I kept checking and eventually found a popular Canadian CRK dealer had them. Seems there was a "pecking order" on getting these from CRK and this dude was first in line. Here's the part that POed me...

He REQUIRED the purchase of a Zaan in order to qualify you to buy the takedown tool. That's right folks. You had to purchase that $400 folder all over again just to be "entitled" to get the takedown tool. That popular Canadian CRK dealer (he knows who he is) can go pound sand as far as I'm concerned. Like, from here on out. :mad:
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Good morning, Harry Callahan

I feel that you need some clarification regarding the Umnumzaan Tools that I am offering on my website store.

It does mention that the tools are only available with the purchase of a new knife, but the first word in that statement is "currently".
Here is that statement from the item description on the website;

INCLUDED ARE 2 AUTHENTIC TOOLS, 2 WRENCHES, RED LOCKTITE AND DETAILED INSTRUCTIONS HOW TO TAKE DOWN AND REASSEMBLE YOUR UMNUMZAAN.

.... CURRENTLY WE CAN ONLY OFFER THIS TOOL SET ALONG WITH A NEW PURCHASE OF ANY CHRIS REEVE UMNUMZAAN.

The reason is that although I may have been one of the first dealers to get the tools from CRK, I was certainly not the first. Actually, I got mine only on the second or third run of them. I had to wait my turn like everybody else.

In addition to the regular Umnumzaans that we sell, we are running a very popular exclusive Tanto version of this knife and sales have been very brisk and they continue to sell very well, along with the standard blade.

It was decided that in order to protect those folks who were acquiring Umnumzaans, including one of our exclusives, that we keep back enough tools to cover those orders.

So, that is what we had done and what we will continue to do for the time being. As it stands right now, we don't have enough tools to cover the orders that we get for the knives,
so it would be unfair to those wanting the tools not to be able to get them from us for the old price and with no shipping cost when they bought a new knife.

If I did not have the tool available to then in this manner, they may have gotten .....PO'ed.

And I feel that they are "entitled" to have a tool at time of purchase if they so wanted one.

I hope this clears it up for you and the others.

Best wishes to all,

Neil Ostroff / TNK
TrueNorthKnives.com EST 1999
www.truenorthknives.com
 
I would suggest that the take down tool be included with the knife working the additional $10 into the final price of the knife. Anyone who is willing to spend $400 on a knife shouldn't blink at the extra $10, besides, it would cost you more than $10 just to ship the knife to CRK for adjustments anyway. Including the tool may help to alleviate costs associated with shipping on both ends, for the customer as well as CRK, and may free up time at the shop from having to track returns for adjustment and the labor involved. Just a thought.
 
will Chris Reeve cover the to and fro shipping for customers outside of the US who have issues with the folder? for eg., overextended lockbar, stiff opening/closing etc? before purchasing (and seeing that there are teething issues), it would be good to know that CRK will cover such shipping. Otherwise, the cost of the Umnumzaan will be basically the $400 + $12.50 + shipping + (possibility) to and fro shipping for issues.

I hope CRK will help those of us outside the US where shipping costs are more substantial (and waiting time as well).
 
After several pages of discussion, thought I'd post the resolution. I did recieve my tool kit, and after adjustment it was just like it was supposed to be. Feels great, has a wonderful action to it. Think I might even carry this thing just to see how it feels lol. All's well that ends well, and it really is a heck of a knife.
 
I handled a friend's Umnumzaan and it does feel like a much bigger knife than the Sebenza. The only thing I noticed is that you press/push up on the thumbstud in a slightly different manner than the Sebenza. I'm sure that this won't keep me from buying one in the near future...:)
 
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