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Nice knives cost too much?
- Thread starter dan oliver
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- Oct 6, 2006
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In general, I think, yes they are overpriced, and I base my opinion on the following analogy/anecdote:
A mechanic buddy of mine was telling me about a $100,000 BMW he was working on, and how impressed he was by the design, build, quality, etc. I asked him why he doesn't buy one for himself. He was quick to point out that while the BMW was better than say a $20,000 Honda, it was in no way, shape, or form "$80,000 better!" To be that much better in practical quality, he said the BMW would have to fly or run on cold fusion or something, and that would justify the extreme price difference. Basically, anyone paying over $40,000 for a car is not getting their money's worth in terms of real value. It is more about status.
I guess what I am saying is that a Sebenza, or any other high end knife, is no doubt better than my $50 Kershaw. BUT it is absolutely not hundereds of dollars worth better. My $50 knife probably performs 90% of what a high end knife can do, so their inflated price does not reflect actual practical value.
Now, a light saber would be worth a few hundred dollars, just because there is such a vast gap in performance between it and a regular knife. Anything made of steel has a hard time justifying a price of $150 or more, at least to me. Most of the price is marketing. A fool and his money...
Hand made? Big whooping deal! I got a decent hand-made knife in South America for about $40.
And, yes, I know some knives are made with exotic dinosaur-bone handles, and blades that contain uranium from Saturn, etc. Those are art knives, and as art, they fall in a different category. You can charge whatever you want for art!
A mechanic buddy of mine was telling me about a $100,000 BMW he was working on, and how impressed he was by the design, build, quality, etc. I asked him why he doesn't buy one for himself. He was quick to point out that while the BMW was better than say a $20,000 Honda, it was in no way, shape, or form "$80,000 better!" To be that much better in practical quality, he said the BMW would have to fly or run on cold fusion or something, and that would justify the extreme price difference. Basically, anyone paying over $40,000 for a car is not getting their money's worth in terms of real value. It is more about status.
I guess what I am saying is that a Sebenza, or any other high end knife, is no doubt better than my $50 Kershaw. BUT it is absolutely not hundereds of dollars worth better. My $50 knife probably performs 90% of what a high end knife can do, so their inflated price does not reflect actual practical value.
Now, a light saber would be worth a few hundred dollars, just because there is such a vast gap in performance between it and a regular knife. Anything made of steel has a hard time justifying a price of $150 or more, at least to me. Most of the price is marketing. A fool and his money...
Hand made? Big whooping deal! I got a decent hand-made knife in South America for about $40.
And, yes, I know some knives are made with exotic dinosaur-bone handles, and blades that contain uranium from Saturn, etc. Those are art knives, and as art, they fall in a different category. You can charge whatever you want for art!
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- Jul 4, 2009
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Knives made in Western industrialized countries are NOT overpriced. Your idea of what your dollar is worth is the thing that is off.
If you want cheap Indian or Chinese made crap for no money, just spend your money in Walmart.
If you want to support nations that care for and protect their own people, that use fair business practices and provide a living wage to their workers, spend accordingly.
If you want cheap Indian or Chinese made crap for no money, just spend your money in Walmart.
If you want to support nations that care for and protect their own people, that use fair business practices and provide a living wage to their workers, spend accordingly.
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- Nov 5, 2009
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In many cases yes, but there are exceptions.
There are good knives available at really good prices, even ones made in first world western industrialized countries. I am not saying that the dearer knives aren't worth their price, just that there are cheaper options available to those that can't/wont spend more.
Opinel Knives - good knives to own & use, cost very little - Made in France.
Mora Knives - also good - Made in Sweden.
Ontario RAT-1 - great knife, well made - Made in a 1st world democratic country (Taiwan).
KA-BAR Becker Knives - BK-7 & BK-9 cost about seventy bucks and a great knives - Made in USA.
Spyderco - Some great budget models available - Made in USA, Japan or Taiwan.
My ESEE Izula only cost fifty bucks, great knife - Made in USA.
Victorinox - fantastic range of knives at good prices - Made in Switzerland.
None of those listed above are made in 'poor' countries or ones with a poor record for human rights. None are expensive and some are downright cheap. Great value can be had for a fair price and great knives can be bought at medium and high prices too - it shouldn't be hard to find good quality at almost any budget.
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- Jan 30, 2010
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For a production knife with similar specs to the sebenza you will pay $250-$300 (s30v, ti frame lock, etc)
Sebenza fit and finish is much better, and the knife holds its value very well. an extra ~$85 for a sebenza is nothing, considering what you get.
Sebenza fit and finish is much better, and the knife holds its value very well. an extra ~$85 for a sebenza is nothing, considering what you get.
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- Oct 4, 2007
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I think Dan Oliver raises a good point when he wonders if it's worthwhile to spend a lot of money on a knife when a another, perfectly good knife, can be purchased for much less. It's a question that's tortured me for years. Case in point; my local knife store sells the Temperance 2 ,which really appeals to me, for $ 260.00 and the CS Kobun for $40.00 [which I've had for years and really like] Of course the Spyderco is made of more expensive materials but otherwise the knives are about the same size, and, in an SD and general utility situation, does anyone really think the Temperance is worth $220.00 more? Nevertheless I have a hankering for the Temperance and one day I just may be stupid enough to fork over all that cash for a knife I "need" like a hole in the head.
The advent of the G-clip has also made the knife more attractive to me as it can now be carried inside the waistband or in a front pocket almost as easily as a folder.
To slide off topic even more, the G-clip lets me carry knives as large as the Rock Salt, the CS Recon Tanto, the CS [7'' blade] Peacekeeper II, and the CS OSS [ with a 8.5 blade ] all in my front pants pocket. I may even cut the bottom off the front pocket of my out-door roughing it pants, allowing me to carry my 9" blade CS Oyabun in my pocket. In fact any knife,regardless of size, that has a kydex sheath that can be fitted to a G-clip, could be carried in this manner.
The G-clip has revolutionized fixed blade carry for me. In fact I think I will buy the Temperance as an act of gratitude to Spyderco for inventing the G-clip!
The advent of the G-clip has also made the knife more attractive to me as it can now be carried inside the waistband or in a front pocket almost as easily as a folder.
To slide off topic even more, the G-clip lets me carry knives as large as the Rock Salt, the CS Recon Tanto, the CS [7'' blade] Peacekeeper II, and the CS OSS [ with a 8.5 blade ] all in my front pants pocket. I may even cut the bottom off the front pocket of my out-door roughing it pants, allowing me to carry my 9" blade CS Oyabun in my pocket. In fact any knife,regardless of size, that has a kydex sheath that can be fitted to a G-clip, could be carried in this manner.
The G-clip has revolutionized fixed blade carry for me. In fact I think I will buy the Temperance as an act of gratitude to Spyderco for inventing the G-clip!
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I got a Spyderco Sage II which has been compared to a Sebenza by more than one person. It has S30V and ti frame lock and was about $140 if I remember correctly. Thats about $200 less than the sebenza which means you are spending quite a bit on a name and maybe a slight improvement on fit and finish.
Just saying...
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- Oct 6, 2009
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well i try to think that "you get what you pay for" now i own some cheapo knives, from when i was younger, now i dont like to buy them, i think that if you get a ~30 dollar knife it could be okay, it could work but i would rather pay for better steel, better F&F etc. now i own some high ticket steel, sebenza, nicer spydies, ESEE's etc. and i think that they are worth every penny more that you pay for. but that us just my stance, if you want to buy a cheap knife that will fall apart in a week go ahead, but you will probably have to buy it multiple times, and by the time you are done you would have spent as much on cheapos as could have spent on a nicer knife, also you can really only use one knife at a time, so you might as well have a nice one 
one thing people forget is that the vast majority of the cost of most manufactured items in the manufacturing, not the cost.
when you go out and spend $200 on a knife, there's only a few dollars worth of steel there, and what you're paying for is all the work needed to turn it from a chunk of steel into a knife. With knives especially, using better materials also increases the production cost, because harder and stronger steels need to be laser cut or milled instead of stamped out of a sheet, and they wear out grinding belts faster, and take more time and power to grind. There are also finishing steps that add to the cost, like polishing, chamfering the edges of the handle scales, making sure scales and liners line up, and making sure the tang is properly radiused on liner and frame lock knives.
higer build quality also means more skilled workers, who need to be paid more for their time.
Economy of scale plays a big part too. When you're making millions and millions of items, the cost of production is spread out across more items, so you end up paying a premium for a more limited product.
when you go out and spend $200 on a knife, there's only a few dollars worth of steel there, and what you're paying for is all the work needed to turn it from a chunk of steel into a knife. With knives especially, using better materials also increases the production cost, because harder and stronger steels need to be laser cut or milled instead of stamped out of a sheet, and they wear out grinding belts faster, and take more time and power to grind. There are also finishing steps that add to the cost, like polishing, chamfering the edges of the handle scales, making sure scales and liners line up, and making sure the tang is properly radiused on liner and frame lock knives.
higer build quality also means more skilled workers, who need to be paid more for their time.
Economy of scale plays a big part too. When you're making millions and millions of items, the cost of production is spread out across more items, so you end up paying a premium for a more limited product.
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well i try to think that "you get what you pay for" now i own some cheapo knives, from when i was younger, now i dont like to buy them, i think that if you get a ~30 dollar knife it could be okay, it could work but i would rather pay for better steel, better F&F etc. now i own some high ticket steel, sebenza, nicer spydies, ESEE's etc. and i think that they are worth every penny more that you pay for. but that us just my stance, if you want to buy a cheap knife that will fall apart in a week go ahead, but you will probably have to buy it multiple times, and by the time you are done you would have spent as much on cheapos as could have spent on a nicer knife, also you can really only use one knife at a time, so you might as well have a nice one
no one is arguing that luxury knives are worth to some individuals what they pay for it. However, their value to that person doesn't mean that premium knives can do so much more than a cheaper, decent quality knife. what you get with high end knives are better fit and finish, better materials, and maybe even better aesthetics. function however, is a whole different matter. Let's take a tenacious and an Snf. A Tenacious can maybe slice and apple or open a box just as well as a strider can. so where does the strider perform better than the tenacious? probably only in brute strength. Now unless you really do use your folder for prying, batoning, and chopping you won't really find a performance advantage that is worth 300 dollars more.
you get your value from the satisfaction and pride of owning a premium knife. this can be compared to an off the rack suit against an armani. both serve their function and both are probably just as durable with reasonable use. but people sure wouldn't turn to look at you if what you have on are just walmart bought clothes. all of us have this "my gun can kill you deader" mentality. we just want to have the best. however with the advantages we have now in manufacturing even the gulf of technology between the tenacious and the snf still makes them functional in the most basic definition of a knife. sometimes the "best" is not merely differentiated by function, but rather the price fo the item assumes an importance beyond the function.
most hobbyists proclaim that there is no price for quality but in fact what really has no price is pride and elitism. has the issue now become "I can afford this and you can't so I can hold my chin up higher than you"? for some this is undoubtedly true. there will always be people who push the envelope in their use of a knife but this will be the minority of knife users. it is these people who can make the most out of a knife like the snf. for the rest it is only desire, and not need that dictates owning a premium knife.
peace.
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I've loved knives my whole life and now that I can afford to own some custom knives, that's what I buy. Do they work better? Not really. Do I enjoy owning and using them? I sure do! There's something for everyone out there, and that's what's great about being a knife nut.
it's possible to spend US$15 and get a really good knife (Mora Clipper 860 for example).
it's possible to spend US$120 and get a really good knife (Fallkniven F1 or S1 for example).
it's possible to spend US$400 and get a really good knife (Chris Reeve Sebenza for example).
it's also possible to spend upwards of US$1,000 and get a really good knife (the damascus edition of the Fallkniven Idun for example).
there are some seriously nice knives that can be had for around US$50.
the bottom line is: you don't "have" to spend huge money to get a quality blade. but some people choose to spend big money on a nice blade. that's their decision and by no means does it dictate that one "must" drop US$500 on a nice knife. hell, US$500 is more money than most people on the planet will earn in six months.
it's possible to spend US$120 and get a really good knife (Fallkniven F1 or S1 for example).
it's possible to spend US$400 and get a really good knife (Chris Reeve Sebenza for example).
it's also possible to spend upwards of US$1,000 and get a really good knife (the damascus edition of the Fallkniven Idun for example).
there are some seriously nice knives that can be had for around US$50.
the bottom line is: you don't "have" to spend huge money to get a quality blade. but some people choose to spend big money on a nice blade. that's their decision and by no means does it dictate that one "must" drop US$500 on a nice knife. hell, US$500 is more money than most people on the planet will earn in six months.
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- Jan 28, 2010
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I only have three knives in my "collection": 2 Benchmade (Osborne 940 and a Mini Nitrous Stryker) and 1 Umnumzaan. They're all well built, razor sharp and feel solid in my hands.
I like them all but there's something about the Umnumzaan - I don't know if it's the heft, the thickness of the blade, the sound it makes when I close it or whatever - that makes me happy. I feel happy just in knowing I have it in my pocket and when I'm using it to cut something I feel even better.
Gosh, sometimes when I'm in bed and happen to think about my knife, I can't help but smile a little.
I can't put a price in that kind of happiness.
I like them all but there's something about the Umnumzaan - I don't know if it's the heft, the thickness of the blade, the sound it makes when I close it or whatever - that makes me happy. I feel happy just in knowing I have it in my pocket and when I'm using it to cut something I feel even better.
Gosh, sometimes when I'm in bed and happen to think about my knife, I can't help but smile a little.
I can't put a price in that kind of happiness.
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- Oct 23, 2006
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I just don't think that this is only worth (at $7.51) 2.275% of the real thing at $330:
7.51
at 330
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Hey, this one is simple, if you have a knife and you think it's nice, then no other opinion matters in the least. Knive are nice in different ways, price may well be one of the factors in nice. The nicest knife in the world to one guy is worthless to another if they can't afford it.
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that's soooo true....but it so helps in being nice when others go oooh and aaahh (especially when they find out how much it costs)
This is the intangible value beyond just mere function that makes expensive knives so cool. (for the majority who just use their sebenza or other what have you to cut food,open letters, fondling piece. desire is mostly what dictates the possession and not need. but if you desire enough it becomes a need. having said that, I "need" a strider.
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It's a hobby. Knives might cost $7.00 to make for a $400.00 knife, but in the end you're getting a hell of a knife. Some people pay $200.00 for a baseball card that costs probably $0.30 cents to make. It's what people like, used as a tool, or as a collectors item.