Niobium!!.......S35VN reveals it's secret ingredient

As far as I know, s35vn and s110v are the only 2 steels that have Niobium in them. 0.5% in s35vn and I believe 2% in s110v but I might be a lil of. S35vn is some pretty good stuff, takes a keen edge and holds it pretty well plus the addition of niobium gives it a higher hrc range thst I can be hardened to. From what I tested, s35vn does great in the 60 to 62 hrc with a microtech socom at around 60 hrc and a custom at 61 to 62 hrc. Butvmost companies still heat treat it to s30v range of 58 to 60 and while it does ok, its kind of a waste to run it that soft. Look at s110v, its range is 62 to 64 hrc and it does excellent at that hardness, its one of, if nit the most wear resistant stainless steels out there and its still failry tough at that high hardness. Id like to see sebenza ran in the 60 plus range, its not at all harder to sharpen s35vn at 61 hrc than it is at 58 to 59, most abrasives are much harder than that and a few hrc point make almost no difference in sharpen ability but they do make a difference in wear resistance.
 
d00mtr33 said:
As far as I know, s35vn and s110v are the only 2 steels that have Niobium in them. 0.5% in s35vn and I believe 2% in s110v but I might be a lil of. S35vn is some pretty good stuff, takes a keen edge and holds it pretty well plus the addition of niobium gives it a higher hrc range thst I can be hardened to. From what I tested, s35vn does great in the 60 to 62 hrc with a microtech socom at around 60 hrc and a custom at 61 to 62 hrc. Butvmost companies still heat treat it to s30v range of 58 to 60 and while it does ok, its kind of a waste to run it that soft. Look at s110v, its range is 62 to 64 hrc and it does excellent at that hardness, its one of, if nit the most wear resistant stainless steels out there and its still failry tough at that high hardness. Id like to see sebenza ran in the 60 plus range, its not at all harder to sharpen s35vn at 61 hrc than it is at 58 to 59, most abrasives are much harder than that and a few hrc point make almost no difference in sharpen ability but they do make a difference in wear resistance.
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I think there are some issues with your claims there - particularly the comment about S35VN not being more difficult to sharpen at 61 HRC than it is at 58 to 59. Obviously Chris Reeve knows what He is doing when he sets the hardness of his steel, and He would not have set it at 58 to 59 unless it demonstrated numerous advantages over a harder heat treat, just one of which is ease of sharpening. It's ridiculous to claim otherwise. What was that old adage, "If it ain't broke don't fix it". I think a new adage for CRK's S35VN is warranted here, "If it's already perfect, why change it?"
 
Have you noticed how many other makers are using S35VN, even high-end mid tech and customs lately? It seems that Chris was right (again) when he felt he could work with Crucible to improve S30V. Whether this was to benefit the end-user, or help with manufacturing is open to debate, but clearly the knife industry has adopted this steel as a prominent choice, and that is good for everyone.
 
Just wanted to resurrect the thread with some questions: how's the new HRC treating the folks who have recently made CRKs? I had no complaints at 58-59, but wonder what the 59-60 performance is like? Is it more chippy? Is the working edge as good? Edge retention better?

Within a doubt S35VN is proving itself a great steel, regardless of the early bad press. My Bark River Bravo 1 in S35VN is showing itself to be a great performer as well.
 
I don't have a requirement of long time edge holding* on my blades, but I like them to keep a shaving sharp edge a "reasonable" amount of time. The slightly harder blades ARE an improvement in what I like in a small blade.:)


* ie camping for the weekend without sharpening, not needed.
 
Thank you Kid for resurrecting this thread, I watched the videos and did some more research, it is indeed a fascinating topic; I used to work in the biotech industry and everything we touched was made of 316L SS, most of which was electropolished, (as some Spydercos made in Japan are), as well as 304, which as I understand now has Niobium in it, it is amazing what little it takes to make steel stronger, it is awesome. I really appreciate your posts man, you always cause me to learn something new, thank you.
 
Worth a bump for those feeling depressed about their lowly S35VN. The steel is great. For sure we are all bored by it, and I too would like another option, but there's no knocking S35VN.
 
kidcongo said:
Well fellas, you might as well melt your BG42 Regulars down for scrap metal ;).......after doing a little research, it's "Niobium or Nothing" for this guy. :D

Niobium. This element is the major difference between S30V and S35VN. It turns out that there is a lot to learn about Niobium and it's effect on stainless steel.


If you can ignore that required "mad scientist" get-up, this guys presents some very interesting history, but the important info is at 3:00 where the effect of Niobium on strengthening the steel crystal matrix is discussed:


And this Niobium steel strength test is interesting. Not quite one of those goofy rope-cut tests, but an interesting display of what is achieved by adding Niobium to steel.


And if you are truly bored (talks a bit about how Niobium increases corrosion resistance and toughness):


There you go..........
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I have posted that exact first video before. I lovr that youtube channel! Niobium is just cool, even the name. I might be mistaken but I believe Vanadium in small ammounts does the same thing. That is why some steels have very little vanadium or niobium. It is not enough to form carbides, just enough to reinforce the grain boundary. If you see a steel that has very small ammounts of these elements in the alloy then this is the effect they are going for.
 
d00mtr33 said:
As far as I know, s35vn and s110v are the only 2 steels that have Niobium in them. 0.5% in s35vn and I believe 2% in s110v but I might be a lil of. S35vn is some pretty good stuff, takes a keen edge and holds it pretty well plus the addition of niobium gives it a higher hrc range thst I can be hardened to. From what I tested, s35vn does great in the 60 to 62 hrc with a microtech socom at around 60 hrc and a custom at 61 to 62 hrc. Butvmost companies still heat treat it to s30v range of 58 to 60 and while it does ok, its kind of a waste to run it that soft. Look at s110v, its range is 62 to 64 hrc and it does excellent at that hardness, its one of, if nit the most wear resistant stainless steels out there and its still failry tough at that high hardness. Id like to see sebenza ran in the 60 plus range, its not at all harder to sharpen s35vn at 61 hrc than it is at 58 to 59, most abrasives are much harder than that and a few hrc point make almost no difference in sharpen ability but they do make a difference in wear resistance.
Click to expand...

Don't forget niolox euro steel. Might be another one or two with niobium.
 
Lapedog said:
I have posted that exact first video before. I lovr that youtube channel! Niobium is just cool, even the name. I might be mistaken but I believe Vanadium in small ammounts does the same thing. That is why some steels have very little vanadium or niobium. It is not enough to form carbides, just enough to reinforce the grain boundary. If you see a steel that has very small ammounts of these elements in the alloy then this is the effect they are going for.
Click to expand...

Perfect. That means that my Case Trapper in CV that should arrive tomorrow is right up town.
 
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