Nitro lacquer

jdm61

jdm61

itinerant metal pounder
Joined
Aug 12, 2005
Messages
47,357
has anyone out there ever tried using nitrocellulose lacquer as a "top coat" finish on a wood handle? It is the preferred finish for high end guitars and my neighbor uses it to refinish furniture. He just hides the cans when he sees the Fire Marshall coming...lol.
 
Think about those old Martin and Gibson guitars and how gorgeous they looked.....that's nitrocellulose. Now think about the most gorgeous super expensive classic cars. Same thing.
 
jdm61 said:
Think about those old Martin and Gibson guitars and how gorgeous they looked.....that's nitrocellulose. Now think about the most gorgeous super expensive classic cars. Same thing.
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I've got several "old" guitars, a 1967 Martin D18 included. It seems that nitro cellulose checks (small cracks) after years of going from one weather condition to another i.e. high to low humidity.
 
Nitrocellulose lacquer was the paint used on autos probably prior to 1950 or so. Superceded by acrylic lacquer.
 
I used to make kayaks with the canvas hardened with airplane dope (nitrate dope). I bought it at the aviation supply.It was used to do the skin on Piper Cub Airplanes. It held up well, but where it covered exposed wood, it seemed to check and haze with time. Spar varnish worked better on the wood, due to the UV blockers.
I switched to Butyrate Dope, as it was tougher.
The model airplane dope used to be nitrate, but now is acrylic I believe.
I don't know how it would hold up to hand wear on a handle.
Stacy
 
Nitocellulose lacquers tend to check after a couple of years. The rags used must be disposed of in a fireproof container, they tend to self ignite. Many a cabinet or refinishing shop has burned to the ground because of that stuff. When I was in the cabinet industry, the plant I was at used a nitrocellulose based filler coat. :D The filler coat booth would catch on fire at least once a year lol just from static sparks, no matter how clean we tried to keep it. Had to use non-sparking scrapers and stuff around it.
 
I've been playing using clear laquer for "stabilizing". I try to use wood that I harvest from the back yard and "heat soak" (put in a mason jar with a 50/50 laquer/thiner solution - heat contents using double boiler method till good sizzle of bubbles noted from wood ends - seal and allow to cool - leave sealed for about a week).

This doesn't make the wood any harder, but it does bring out beautiful colors from "spalted" oak. It kills the worms too. :D:D

Jim L.
 
wikipedia said:
These lacquers are also used on wooden products, furniture primarily, and on musical instruments and other objects. The nitrocellulose and other resins and plasticizers are dissolved in the solvent, and each coat of lacquer dissolves some of the previous coat. These lacquers were a huge improvement over earlier automobile and furniture finishes, both in ease of application, and in colour retention. The preferred method of applying quick-drying lacquers is by spraying, and the development of nitrocellulose lacquers led to the first extensive use of spray guns. Nitrocellulose lacquers produce a very hard yet flexible, durable finish that can be polished to a high sheen. Drawbacks of these lacquers include the hazardous nature of the solvent, which is flammable, volatile and toxic; and the handling hazards of nitrocellulose in the lacquer manufacturing process. Lacquer grade of soluble nitrocellulose is closely related to the more highly nitrated form which is used to make explosives.
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I don't have any firsthand info, just posting up an overview from wikipedia.
 
I have refinished a couple of guitars with nitro. It is a very thin finish and you need to build it up with multiple coats. Surface prep is critical, open grain wood needs to be filled. The best way to apply is by spray gun. Once it is buffed out it looks like glass. It will look amazing but it isn't very durable and it will craze/crack with age. Guitar Reranch www.reranch.com has lots of good info and sells small quantities of nitro in spray cans.

Lon
 
If you wanted a high gloss finish like that you could try a "frenching pad" finish. Use french lac and some cheesecloth to build up layers. It's a bit tiring but leaves an awesome glasslike finish. I did some furniture for the owners of the cabinet shop with this stuff. You can also use some rubbing compound over a thick clear coat buffed in with a sponge or frenching pad to get a nice glass finish.
 
im new here and cant really give advice on knife making but i do know alot about painting if you really would like a high gloss durable finish an acrylic urethane is the way to go we use it on all aircraft cabinetry it makes the wood look like its a mile deep its also the same clear we put over out stripes on the exterior. and it will hold up in the most brutal conditions. we use acryglo by sherwin williams its an aircraft clear but there are high solid auto brands that are comparable. lac is kinda an out dated coating compared to whats out there its beautiful but lacks in durability just thought i would throw in my two cents
 
Spraying lacquer is nice because it dries almost on contact, leveling itself as it does. It leaves a lovely smooth finish.
Penatrol can be added to most any oil based product. It is a flow agent and makes the finish extremely smooth, even when applied with a brush.

Most any handle material I use will be stabilized; I use stabilized, not just because of its stability factor. If you take the time to finish the surface of the handle by proper sanding and burnishing, you don't need to put a finish coat on.

Fred
 
paintitred said:
im new here and cant really give advice on knife making but i do know alot about painting if you really would like a high gloss durable finish an acrylic urethane is the way to go we use it on all aircraft cabinetry it makes the wood look like its a mile deep its also the same clear we put over out stripes on the exterior. and it will hold up in the most brutal conditions. we use acryglo by sherwin williams its an aircraft clear but there are high solid auto brands that are comparable. lac is kinda an out dated coating compared to whats out there its beautiful but lacks in durability just thought i would throw in my two cents
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Thats more than two cents, thanks
OK if you were to make a wooden knife handle..how would you finish it, or better yet how do you suggest I finish it for those results? What should I ask for exactly? Can I buy small a small quanity and how do I apply it? Remember its just a small knife handle so spraying seems overkill.
 
paintitred said:
im new here and cant really give advice on knife making but i do know alot about painting if you really would like a high gloss durable finish an acrylic urethane is the way to go we use it on all aircraft cabinetry it makes the wood look like its a mile deep its also the same clear we put over out stripes on the exterior. and it will hold up in the most brutal conditions. we use acryglo by sherwin williams its an aircraft clear but there are high solid auto brands that are comparable. lac is kinda an out dated coating compared to whats out there its beautiful but lacks in durability just thought i would throw in my two cents
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They use the same stuff for aircraft and boat cabinetry, I do believe. To my eyes, the trade off for the durability is a slightly plastic look to the finish anytime you use anything with the word urethane in the name.
 
Bruce Bump said:
Thats more than two cents, thanks
OK if you were to make a wooden knife handle..how would you finish it, or better yet how do you suggest I finish it for those results? What should I ask for exactly? Can I buy small a small quanity and how do I apply it? Remember its just a small knife handle so spraying seems overkill.
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i guess its five cents then and agreed spraying would be overkill tho i would spray overkill or not you would ask for an automotive high solids clear or acryglo as stated before and you would ask it in kit form. you can also dip it and sand between dipping like they used to do to wooden golf clubs and buff in the same manner you would any other finish . as far as small qauntity you can buy anywhere from a pint to gal.
 
jdm61 said:
They use the same stuff for aircraft and boat cabinetry, I do believe. To my eyes, the trade off for the durability is a slightly plastic look to the finish anytime you use anything with the word urethane in the name.
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i agree when you get a real thick layer of any clear be it laq or urethane tends to give it a plastic look but they also have different additives to go from gloss to satin to flat you can also apply only a thin coat you will not be able to tell the difference betwwen urethane or laq. it all about how much build you want wich give that look of depth or plastic like you said
 
This is personal preference, but I don't like a shiny, slick handle. Yes it looks pretty but if you use it all day it also raises blisters much worse than an oiled and waxed handle. I've never bought a knife with a shiny handle and the hand tools I but that have such a finish, I remove the finish and oil the handle.

ron
 
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