No Luck With Edge Pro Apex

BluegrassBrian

BluegrassBrian

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Apr 20, 2015
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Has anyone bought the EP Apex system and just had no luck at all with it?
 
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For over a week now I've read every how-to and watched every video I could find. I've used it to the best of my ability on numerous knives of all types. Somehow they all come out less sharp than when I started.
 
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BluegrassBrian said:
For over a week now I've read every how-to and watched every video I could find. I've used it to the best of my ability on numerous knives of all types. Somehow they all come out less sharp than when I started.
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Sounds like you are not apexing the edge. Make sure to form a burr along the entire edge (on both sides) with your coarsest stone before moving on to the next.
 
I mark the edge with sharpie and position it at just the right angle.
I hold the knife steady with the aid of the neod. magnet under the table..
I'm doing everything correctly as far as I can tell from the dozen or so videos I've watched.
 
I've used a Sharpmaker for years and I get good results with it. I'm fairly decent at free hand.

I figured the EPA would be a great mix of quality, speed, and ease of use. I'm not giving up just yet but it blows my mind a bit.
I've never seen any full on negative reviews of the device.
Seems most people get really good results with it. I'm hoping it will click eventually.
 
You still didn't answer if you're forming a burr. If you aren't all you're doing is wasting your time.
 
BluegrassBrian said:
I mark the edge with sharpie and position it at just the right angle.
I hold the knife steady with the aid of the neod. magnet under the table..
I'm doing everything correctly as far as I can tell from the dozen or so videos I've watched.
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I'm sorry man but you're not. Your results show that. You are missing something. Most probably what flame cycle said. If you are forming a burr along the entire length of the edge and correctly knocking it off properly, you can't help but be sharp.

The thing with the edge pro is that you have to be aware of what is going on at the edge while you are sharpening. You cannot just go through the motions and expect good and consistent results.

I suggest a loupe and frequent inspection of the edge while you are sharpening.
 
Freehand is different. Each stroke has a slightly different angle thus it's more likely you hit the apex a couple of times at least.
With the fixed angle of the device however it's possible that you never hit the apex even if you are just off by half a degree.
One solution would be to use a slightly steeper angle everytime but that only works so long. Or just pick the angle of choice and keep grinding until you hit the apex.
 
Jens Schuetz said:
Freehand is different. Each stroke has a slightly different angle thus it's more likely you hit the apex a couple of times at least.
With the fixed angle of the device however it's possible that you never hit the apex even if you are just off by half a degree.
One solution would be to use a slightly steeper angle everytime but that only works so long. Or just pick the angle of choice and keep grinding until you hit the apex.
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He needs something to check whether he has hit the apex or not.

As Sal Glesser says, loupe best teacher after him. Or something along those lines.
 
I have 8x, 10x, and 20x loupes. I check the edge after I knock off the sharpie to make sure I've hit the very apex of the edge.
 
Yes sir, the famous burr, I bought the lansky 5 stone angle system, got all excited and flew thru all 5 stones, ended up with a knife no sharper then a butter knife, went back and took my time, about an hour later shaving sharp after I figured out about the burr.
 
Hi Brian, frustrating huh? Talk to us, what kind of steel and knife are you using? Have you started with a coarser stone? List the type of stones and grits you are using and in what order? What liquid are you using on the stones? You haven't told us if you have gotten a uniform curl/burr with each stone? Have you stropped the edge after you've removed the burr? How have you removed the burr? Try stropping with news paper free hand after you're done and let us know if it will cut TP when lightly drawn across the roll?
Hey we've all been here, it will happen.
 
singularity35 said:
The OP never did answer whether he was seeing a burr or not...
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I agree. Burr formation when learning a jig is important. Try an axe or tomohawk on an ep sometime. It looks like you are there but takes forever to actually get that last 10%, apex and form an even fine burr along the entire length of the edge. Then you have to flip it over and do it again :p

Equally as important as forming the burr is removing it. Use extremely light edge leading strokes. It will actually feel extremly rough as you abrade through the burr and smooth out when you get down to the edge. Flip and repeat several times and finish off with extremely light alternating edge leading strokes. At this point you should be able to scrape off some armhair even with your coarsest stone if you have done this right. Even with something as coarse as a 24grit nubatama or 140 atoma.

Your knives will take forever to apex if you have been freehanding. Theres some inherent convexity assosciated that takes a LOOOOOOONG time to remove when converting to a V grind like a jig produces. Even skilled freehanders produce some convexity and it still takes a long time to remove.

Use lots of water and give it some pressure till you get a burr. Make sure your stones arent loading and slowing you down. An Atoma 140 is a really good investment if you dont have one already. Makes flattening a breeze and keeps wear and tear off your waterstones while you get everything converted to flat grinds.
 
To answer some questions..
I use a loupe to make sure I'm hitting the apex of the edge with sharpie but I've never been great at spotting a burr with one. I can feel the burr when using coarser stones though.

I have a wide variety of folders and fixed blades in every thing ranging from s30v, s35vn, vg10, 1095, d2, s90v, and n690.

I'm using shapton stones with the edge pro. 320, 500, 1k, 3k and 6k. It came with a horse hide strop for it, but I use my own strop with 1 micron spray typically. I've been using water with a tiny drop of dish soap in it like many people suggest.

Today before work I tried the 1k and 3k on my Shun Premier chefs knife and it actually dulled it a bit. I ran it over some fine and xfine ceramic rods and I was able to bring it back quickly. In the past week I've tried running knives through all of the grits.

Tomorrow I will pick a couple knives and work them from 500 through 3k, paying close attention to the burr formation.

Thanks for all the replies..
 
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When I first used the Edge Pro, I produced shiny edges that were not sharp. I then used the Sharpmaker on them, which produced sharp edges. I emailed Ben (owner/inventor of Edge Pro). He said that showed I was 'close.' He offered helpful advice. I'd suggest contacting him if you are still having troubles. You (obviously) wouldn't be the first person who needed advice. It can certainly produce extremely sharp edges!

Good sharpening,
Dave
 
I found that by using a nice fluffy microfiber (Costco) I can tell even the slightest Burr by dragging the edge against the microfiber, you can see the microfibers grabbing the Burr.
 
BluegrassBrian said:
To answer some questions..
I use a loupe to make sure I'm hitting the apex of the edge with sharpie but I've never been great at spotting a burr with one. I can feel the burr when using coarser stones though.

I have a wide variety of folders and fixed blades in every thing ranging from s30v, s35vn, vg10, 1095, d2, s90v, and n690.

I'm using shapton stones with the edge pro. 320, 500, 1k, 3k and 6k. It came with a horse hide strop for it, but I use my own strop with 1 micron spray typically. I've been using water with a tiny drop of dish soap in it like many people suggest.

Today before work I tried the 1k and 3k on my Shun Premier chefs knife and it actually dulled it a bit. I ran it over some fine and xfine ceramic rods and I was able to bring it back quickly. In the past week I've tried running knives through all of the grits.

Tomorrow I will pick a couple knives and work them from 500 through 3k, paying close attention to the burr formation.

Thanks for all the replies..
Click to expand...

One of the most important skills when using an edge pro is spotting a burr. With coarser stones, burrs should be visible to the naked eye.
 
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