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No luck with king 1000-6000 combo stone

Discussion in 'Maintenance, Tinkering & Embellishment' started by noob93, Jan 26, 2017.

  1. noob93

    noob93

    407
    Feb 6, 2016
    So for Xmas my mother was kind enough to get me a king 1000-6000 sharpening stone. I have been practicing my free hand sharpening for about a year now off and on. Before this stone I was just using cheap silicon carbide stones and having good luck. My edges weren't always perfect but I could always get them to shave if I wanted. Iv tried using this water stone a few time now and it's been terrible. It seems to take foreeever to abrade even low carbon steel like 1075 and as hard as I try the edge always ends up uneven. At this point I'm about ready to go back to silicon carbide and call it a day. Is the stone just low quality and perhaps slightly uneven or am i missing something here? To make matters worse I bought it at Lee Vallee tools and paid 90 bucks to find out it's a 40 dollar stone
     
  2. kn4wd

    kn4wd

    422
    Jan 20, 2014
    try the coarser sic stone to set the bevel and then use the 1000 -6000 to refine the already sharp edge. 1k and 6k are finishing not bevel setting stones.
     
  3. noob93

    noob93

    407
    Feb 6, 2016
    Yes I can set the bevel with my sic stone pretty decent and it cuts paper. When I take it to the 1000 grit king it just seems to ruin everything I worked for. Leaves my edge looking almost convex and no longer cutting paper
     
  4. HeavyHanded

    HeavyHanded

    Jun 4, 2010
    This ^

    And finish with some trailing passes as well, especially on the 6k, but is also good to do a few that way on the 1k to finish on that stone as well.

    Check out a few Murray Carter videos - he has great technique overall and uses the Kings.

    Edit:
    Soak the stones well and rinse them off as you are working. Move around on the stone so you don't get a groove.
     
  5. HeavyHanded

    HeavyHanded

    Jun 4, 2010
    Another factor, the finer the abrasive the smaller your margin of error when working. So technique that leaves a nice flat looking bevel at a lower grit might look uneven and multifaceted at higher finishes.

    And last, waterstones have a slightly longer learning curve compared to some other stone compositions, stay at it and you'll find your groove. They are not the greatest stones, but work plenty good on most steels - should be working the 1075 handily.
     
  6. noob93

    noob93

    407
    Feb 6, 2016
    okay thank you for the advice I will keep trying. Im sure eventually ill get the hang of it
     
  7. HSC ///

    HSC /// KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Nov 7, 2012
    I use these stones almost exclusively and they are certainly used exclusively at Carter Cutlery.
    I grind thin and I can set the bevels with a 1K stone, but it took my about 20 blades before I was any good at.

    Heavyhanded has given you good advice. go with that
    Invest in the Carter sharpening video
    keep the stones rinsed off as stated earlier, and on your last honing passes, the touch should be very light.

    If it doesn't work out for you, I'll buy your 1K stone :)
     
  8. noob93

    noob93

    407
    Feb 6, 2016
    Thanks guys I was up late last night working on an old kitchen knife and it's going better. I used a cheap 200 ish grit stone to clean up the bevels and I flattened the 1000 out a bit. Gonna have a go at her today and see what I can do. Is their one dvd in particular you could recommend as I think he has a few? Thanks for the kind offer harbeer.
     
  9. HSC ///

    HSC /// KnifeMaker / Craftsman / Service Provider Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider

    Nov 7, 2012
    you can start with the blade sharpening fundamentals DVD
     
  10. HeavyHanded

    HeavyHanded

    Jun 4, 2010
    Here's a couple, his technique and application are what you should be looking out for:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozZF2EgnYm0&t=418s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJdtCLIGQm8


    And some of mine, this one on an 800 grit Juuma waterstone:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DWdfhnpBe0

    The part where I use the paper for a strop can be replicated using paper over the coarse side of your silicon carbide stone (brush off any loose grit before wrapping with paper). The paper strop portion can also be done with the 6k stone pretty much exactly, just check for burrs and if you see any remove them with light leading passes and finish with a few trailing ones.

    And the preceding video explaining why I do what I do:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SuGwd9YZ8_g
     
  11. awestib

    awestib

    Dec 29, 2008
    All good advice. Finish with 20 or so edge trailing strokes on the 6000 (make sure you hit the apex, use sharpie!) and strop on paper or denim afterwards
     
  12. pjwoolw

    pjwoolw Sharpening guy

    407
    Nov 12, 2012
    Regardless of technique your going to need a way to flatten the stones going forward. Lighten up on pressure with the Kings.
     
  13. bgentry

    bgentry

    Aug 3, 2009
    Waterstones have a different feel. Especially soft waterstones like the Kings.

    I've achieved pretty darned nice results on a few blades with my waterstones (Nubatamas), but had rather poor results on others. I think that your angle control and pressure need to be much more precise on a waterstone than on a diamond plate (which is my normal go-to). Probably lighter and with more control than an SiC stone too.

    I think something about the soft substrate makes it harder to hold a consistent angle. On a very hard stone or plate, you can really press down and use the surface as a reference On waterstones when I do this, I have to concentrate much harder and slow my motions down. Otherwise I just get weird edges that don't seem sharp at all. I think I'm probably wobbling like crazy when this happens and thus rounding over my edge.

    I guess my advice would be summed up with:

    1. Concentrate more on your motions, keeping your angle constant.
    2. Slow down.
    3. Emphasize the pressure behind the edge a bit, as opposed to letting the edge "dig in".

    Good luck.

    Brian.
     
    Seesteel likes this.
  14. noob93

    noob93

    407
    Feb 6, 2016
    Ya it's definitely a different feeling for sure. Especially when I'm coming off the sic to profile the edge. However I did lighten my pressure and slow down and got decent results. The old carbon kitchen knife in question doesn't have the prettiest or most uniform looking edge but now cuts paper cleanly. The edge does appear multi faceted especially on the back side but the primary grind on that old knife is junk to begin with. I think I'll probably buy a couple sic stones or diamond stones for my good knives while I perfect my technique with the king stone. Any recommendations?
     
  15. Seesteel

    Seesteel Gold Member Gold Member

    48
    Jul 7, 2018




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    Last edited: Sep 17, 2018 at 9:43 AM

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