Normalcy is only relative.
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"Non knife people" threads, and their implications
- Thread starter Comeuppance
- Start date
Normalcy is only relative.
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2013
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- 2,466
- Is it fair to mock people for not owning, using, or understanding knives? Realistically, most people rarely need anything more than scissors. If they're doing work around the house, maybe a utility knife.
NO
- How does an entire industry, millions if not billions of dollars, sustain itself when clearly such a small fraction of the population even knows such an industry exists?
Because we buy EXPENSIVE knives!
- How could we combat the prevailing perception of pocket knives being primarily weapons? Entertainment media basically always displays them in a negative light, and your average knife owner isn't necessarily particiularly responsible with them - reinforcing the negative perception.
By not using large/scary knives around non-knife people, and opening them slowly.
NO
- How does an entire industry, millions if not billions of dollars, sustain itself when clearly such a small fraction of the population even knows such an industry exists?
Because we buy EXPENSIVE knives!
- How could we combat the prevailing perception of pocket knives being primarily weapons? Entertainment media basically always displays them in a negative light, and your average knife owner isn't necessarily particiularly responsible with them - reinforcing the negative perception.
By not using large/scary knives around non-knife people, and opening them slowly.
- Joined
- Aug 28, 2013
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- 1,678
I am not sure if we are quite mocking them, but we do use it as humor more and it re-enforces that we have an addiction/illness. I find those threads entertaining. If I meet someone and they ask why would you spend lets say $250 for a knife? Then I try to explain to them what makes the knife worth that and why it is worth it to me. Do I expect the majority of people to buy nice knives? No I do not, because they may not have that much of an interest or do not care about quality or smoothness/materials. They may not care where their knife is made, which is all fine and dandy for them, but I have my own preferences and tasks which are rather expensive.
I use BladeForums as something like an AA meeting except we are all not trying to get cured usually. People on here not only share interests in knives and gear, but tend to have tastes really close to mine. That which is usually most members like high quality items, because they know value of them and those items tend to be more expensive.
I use BladeForums as something like an AA meeting except we are all not trying to get cured usually. People on here not only share interests in knives and gear, but tend to have tastes really close to mine. That which is usually most members like high quality items, because they know value of them and those items tend to be more expensive.
ive actually been stabbed quite badly by a scumbag with a knife about 6 years ago,he was just out of jail for stabbing another guy and clearly mentally ill but never pleaded this in court,I still collect knives,has not affected my opinion on knives except maybe my lack of respect for so called tactical knives and maybe more of a leaning towards traditional locking folders but the effect has been slight , its people im not fond of!
- Joined
- Sep 11, 2012
- Messages
- 456
Well said!
Every community dedicated to a particular interest has it's little "us vs. them" moments. I'm sure if you went to a cigar forum there'd be threads moaning or laughing about those "poor" souls who smoke cheap drugstore stogies. I'm also sure Timex wearers are sometimes similarly discussed at high end watch forums. That's the way it goes. I don't have a problem with this, as long as it isn't done in a truly mean-spirited manner. I don't mind someone chuckling over a clerk stepping away from him when he whips out his edc to open a box, but I could do without comments about how the clerk is a loser or feminized wuss because of the manner in which he reacted.
+1
Thanks also to the OP for this thread, and for all the thoughtful responses. I was beginning to become rather disillusioned by the prevalence of such derogatory speech. I understand the inclination to poke fun at those who do not share one's obsessions, but it isn't just in humor-oriented threads. There are others where people are quite earnest about equating a lack of interest in or knowledge of knives with effeminacy or sexual deviance. What I carry in my pocket or on my belt doesn't make me better than anyone else.
That being said, it is undeniably unfortunate that carrying a simple tool can elicit panic and over-reaction. The best thing to do is know and respect local law and custom, but even more to always remember that knives are serious tools, to be treated with respect. Every injury I ever experienced is when I lost respect for the tool and cut myself doing something careless or stupid. They are not toys and must never be flaunted, but always carried and used with discipline.
Easy to say. Easy to forget.
Thanks also to the OP for this thread, and for all the thoughtful responses. I was beginning to become rather disillusioned by the prevalence of such derogatory speech. I understand the inclination to poke fun at those who do not share one's obsessions, but it isn't just in humor-oriented threads. There are others where people are quite earnest about equating a lack of interest in or knowledge of knives with effeminacy or sexual deviance. What I carry in my pocket or on my belt doesn't make me better than anyone else.
That being said, it is undeniably unfortunate that carrying a simple tool can elicit panic and over-reaction. The best thing to do is know and respect local law and custom, but even more to always remember that knives are serious tools, to be treated with respect. Every injury I ever experienced is when I lost respect for the tool and cut myself doing something careless or stupid. They are not toys and must never be flaunted, but always carried and used with discipline.
Easy to say. Easy to forget.
kamagong
Gold Member
- Joined
- Jan 13, 2001
- Messages
- 10,941
I use the term sheeple and do so without any compunction. I don't use it to refer to all people who don't carry a knife, but rather specifically for those who bleat about my knife usage. I'm not in the habit of talking about, showing off, or brandishing my knives. Yet I've alarmed a couple of people in the past when I used my "Rambo" knife to cut up some food. Both these sheeple asked why I carried a weapon. The knife in question? A simple slipjoint, an elegant French Laguiole.
It seems that most people these days no longer carry knives. I have no problem with them. But there is a small number out there who have an irrational fear of things sharp and shiny and would restrict my ability to carry my treasured knives. I call them sheeple because that is what they are.
It seems that most people these days no longer carry knives. I have no problem with them. But there is a small number out there who have an irrational fear of things sharp and shiny and would restrict my ability to carry my treasured knives. I call them sheeple because that is what they are.
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The term tends to describe those using it at least as well as those it's directed at, because deep down, everyone on earth is a "sheeple".
9-11 made things ridiculous. I was at a rummage sale once and they had a set of steak knives wrapped in multi layers of plastic and wouldn't let me get in to inspect them because "they ARE knives".
Still, you are very right. As much as people ARE, well sheeple, that's how it is. Gettin' in their face won't help. I gravitate towards slipjoints now myself. First it was just easier. Then I reveled in being able to take a small slipjoint out where I would have been nervous to take a knife out before, almost anywhere in fact. Now, I kind of feel I'm educating or raising consciousness using my "grandpa knife" when needed. Plus, I loves them now my precious.
I like this thread, and what I have read here makes me feel good about being a member of this forum. I agree with much of what has already been said.
As for my personal point of view, having a good-natured laugh at the expense of someone who has what seems like a silly reaction to a knife being innocently carried or used is one thing, but expressing mean-spirited hostility towards people who have such a reaction, is something altogether different. I don't see anything wrong with a bit of good-natured joking, after all, we can't take ourselves too seriously, but mean-spiritedness is just that- mean-spiritedness. I don't think it's cool, or funny, or fair, to cast aspersions on peoples intelligence, or manliness, or upbringing, simply because they're different than us. In my opinion, that's the conduct of bullies and jerks.
That being said, I see a big difference between a person reacting to a knife, and a person over-reacting to a knife. If a person reacts to a knife with a joke, or a snide or ignorant comment, or with some amount of apprehension, I don't mind. I would likely consider such reactions to be silly and just ignore them. Or, if a person reacted with some amount of fear, I might consider why they were afraid, I might even ask them politely why they reacted in such a way.
On the other hand, if a person became hysterical at the sight of my knife, if they made a big scene ("OH MY GOD HE'S GOT A KNIFE!!! SOMEBODY CALL THE COPS!!!"), or if they did in fact call the police on me, or if they complained to a manager and the manager ordered me to leave as a result, or if they did anything else that had a negative impact on my life, then I would consider such behavior to be over-reactions, and I would have some very unkind things to say about those people. And believe me, I would call them names much worse than "sheeple".
As far as trying to "educate" others on the value, and inherent innocence, of knives, there are limits to how far I will go. I always use knives responsibly and I am always conscious of my environment and those around me when deciding if or how I will use a knife. If someone I know personally, whom I will be interacting with regularly, shows apprehension towards me because of my knives, I will make an effort to convince them that my knives are quite innocent and they have no reason to fear them, not to mention the value of possessing a cutting tool. And if someone I know, or a total stranger, asks me a reasonable question about my knives, or knives in general, I will be polite and try my best to inform them, even if their questions are a bit awkward.
My personal thanks to the OP and all who have shared their thoughts here.
As for my personal point of view, having a good-natured laugh at the expense of someone who has what seems like a silly reaction to a knife being innocently carried or used is one thing, but expressing mean-spirited hostility towards people who have such a reaction, is something altogether different. I don't see anything wrong with a bit of good-natured joking, after all, we can't take ourselves too seriously, but mean-spiritedness is just that- mean-spiritedness. I don't think it's cool, or funny, or fair, to cast aspersions on peoples intelligence, or manliness, or upbringing, simply because they're different than us. In my opinion, that's the conduct of bullies and jerks.
That being said, I see a big difference between a person reacting to a knife, and a person over-reacting to a knife. If a person reacts to a knife with a joke, or a snide or ignorant comment, or with some amount of apprehension, I don't mind. I would likely consider such reactions to be silly and just ignore them. Or, if a person reacted with some amount of fear, I might consider why they were afraid, I might even ask them politely why they reacted in such a way.
On the other hand, if a person became hysterical at the sight of my knife, if they made a big scene ("OH MY GOD HE'S GOT A KNIFE!!! SOMEBODY CALL THE COPS!!!"), or if they did in fact call the police on me, or if they complained to a manager and the manager ordered me to leave as a result, or if they did anything else that had a negative impact on my life, then I would consider such behavior to be over-reactions, and I would have some very unkind things to say about those people. And believe me, I would call them names much worse than "sheeple".
As far as trying to "educate" others on the value, and inherent innocence, of knives, there are limits to how far I will go. I always use knives responsibly and I am always conscious of my environment and those around me when deciding if or how I will use a knife. If someone I know personally, whom I will be interacting with regularly, shows apprehension towards me because of my knives, I will make an effort to convince them that my knives are quite innocent and they have no reason to fear them, not to mention the value of possessing a cutting tool. And if someone I know, or a total stranger, asks me a reasonable question about my knives, or knives in general, I will be polite and try my best to inform them, even if their questions are a bit awkward.
My personal thanks to the OP and all who have shared their thoughts here.
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- Aug 2, 2013
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- 132
I like non knife people threads until they go too far. Making a joke or two and sharing an experience is great. Just when we start judging people because they don't carry knives...thats crossing the line a bit. I carry my knives discreetly most days. If anyone asks why i have a weapon i simply explain to them it is not a weapon. I use it as a tool, therefore it is a tool. Guns are technically firearms, same as knives. Kill someone with a gun, then, and ONLY THEN, does it become a weapon. Thats what i was taught at least.
Good thread. I enjoyed reading all the posts.
Good thread. I enjoyed reading all the posts.
I like non knife people threads until they go too far. Making a joke or two and sharing an experience is great. Just when we start judging people because they don't carry knives...thats crossing the line a bit. I carry my knives discreetly most days. If anyone asks why i have a weapon i simply explain to them it is not a weapon. I use it as a tool, therefore it is a tool. Guns are technically firearms, same as knives. Kill someone with a gun, then, and ONLY THEN, does it become a weapon. Thats what i was taught at least.
Good thread. I enjoyed reading all the posts.
I don't really agree with that sentiment... A gun is most definitely a weapon. To say it is a tool questions the merit of it, which is for self-defense, which again classifies it as a weapon. If you were to say you use it to punch holes in paper at long range, I suppose you could call it a tool then, but otherwise its only purpose is to kill--whether that's in self-defense or not that's a weapon.
Knives can be called tools because they're useful for many other things than killing things. The actual mechanical properties of using a knife are useful for other tasks. A gun is only a tool if the mechanism you need is putting a hole into something...
In that respect, guns are excellent tools for sinking boats.
I've had people ask why I carry a fixed blade knife after doing something like cutting a small sappling out of the way moving a hot tub--this happened last week. It's nice to say, "Well, I couldn't have done that with a pocket knife," and have them say, "How often do you need to do that?" and I say "It's not about how often I need it, it's about having it when I do need it."
A couple of points:
--The big sales in knives come from the large mass production companies, not the firms we talk about. The average person who wants something sharp before they leave on a camping trip goes to a big box store and buys an sak or a Gerber. Maybe a Buck.
--All these threads criticizing non knife people are never read by them. I doubt if anybody with apprehensive feelings about knives ever goes to a site called "Bladeforums". You can say anything you like here; they'll never know.
--As long as it's confined to us, these threads are healthy because they let off steam over a legitimate issue.
--If anybody was watching, my big concern would not be these threads, but another kind entirely, and by a million-to-one margin. Everybody here claims knives are just tools, but we also carry regular threads that ask the best knife for self defense (I.e. using a knife to hurt another person, as a weapon, albeit in self defense), usually in the "General" section to boot. Not to mention what's in Practical Tactical. Much as I love this site so much, if I wanted to start a knife scare, quotes from some of the threads here would be Exhibit A. The fact that there's not a peep means nobody outside our world is watching. Much they way I like it.
--My guess is that long term trends in knife sales are primarily based on demographics. By 1920 we were moving from an agricultural sciety to a small town one. Fewer agricultural workers. By the 1950s we were moving to an urban-suburban society. A lot less open space to practice woodcraft. Even within the last eight years, where I live in SoCal, open space has moved from a 45 min drive to an hour and a half to two hour drive away. A world of people who work in offices have far, far less knife needs than a world of people who work in the fields, or even in factories.
Way down from thse societal changes I'd mention the movies. Although even here, while you have the crazies, if you watch closely, knives are used endlessly in a million and one ways in movies and on tv in quiet ways, sending a powerful, subliminal message that is positive.
Next would be knife companies efforts in the outdoors market,. through magazine ads and at shows.
Far, far below that would be anything we do.
--The big sales in knives come from the large mass production companies, not the firms we talk about. The average person who wants something sharp before they leave on a camping trip goes to a big box store and buys an sak or a Gerber. Maybe a Buck.
--All these threads criticizing non knife people are never read by them. I doubt if anybody with apprehensive feelings about knives ever goes to a site called "Bladeforums". You can say anything you like here; they'll never know.
--As long as it's confined to us, these threads are healthy because they let off steam over a legitimate issue.
--If anybody was watching, my big concern would not be these threads, but another kind entirely, and by a million-to-one margin. Everybody here claims knives are just tools, but we also carry regular threads that ask the best knife for self defense (I.e. using a knife to hurt another person, as a weapon, albeit in self defense), usually in the "General" section to boot. Not to mention what's in Practical Tactical. Much as I love this site so much, if I wanted to start a knife scare, quotes from some of the threads here would be Exhibit A. The fact that there's not a peep means nobody outside our world is watching. Much they way I like it.
--My guess is that long term trends in knife sales are primarily based on demographics. By 1920 we were moving from an agricultural sciety to a small town one. Fewer agricultural workers. By the 1950s we were moving to an urban-suburban society. A lot less open space to practice woodcraft. Even within the last eight years, where I live in SoCal, open space has moved from a 45 min drive to an hour and a half to two hour drive away. A world of people who work in offices have far, far less knife needs than a world of people who work in the fields, or even in factories.
Way down from thse societal changes I'd mention the movies. Although even here, while you have the crazies, if you watch closely, knives are used endlessly in a million and one ways in movies and on tv in quiet ways, sending a powerful, subliminal message that is positive.
Next would be knife companies efforts in the outdoors market,. through magazine ads and at shows.
Far, far below that would be anything we do.
JTR357
Gold Member
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2007
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- 14,154
I agree :thumbup:
And if any do stumble in here, maybe it'll serve as the awakening moment we all go through at one point. Maybe some of them will see what's being said about others of similar ideas and how such a mentality is a bad thing, and snap out of the haze of inherited helplessness and fear.
- Joined
- Sep 26, 2013
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I don't really agree with that sentiment... A gun is most definitely a weapon. To say it is a tool questions the merit of it, which is for self-defense, which again classifies it as a weapon. If you were to say you use it to punch holes in paper at long range, I suppose you could call it a tool then, but otherwise its only purpose is to kill--whether that's in self-defense or not that's a weapon.
Knives can be called tools because they're useful for many other things than killing things. The actual mechanical properties of using a knife are useful for other tasks. A gun is only a tool if the mechanism you need is putting a hole into something...
In that respect, guns are excellent tools for sinking boats.
I've had people ask why I carry a fixed blade knife after doing something like cutting a small sappling out of the way moving a hot tub--this happened last week. It's nice to say, "Well, I couldn't have done that with a pocket knife," and have them say, "How often do you need to do that?" and I say "It's not about how often I need it, it's about having it when I do need it."
YES!:thumbup:
