normalizing vs annealing

[Larrin]

Kevin, really informative. Sorry to dig up an old post for my first comment, but I have been curious/slightly confused about when to anneal or if it is necessary if you are normalizing.
When would annealing be necessary over normalizing, or could you do both? Would you normalize first, hit grain refinement cycle, and then anneal to soften it up even more before machining on it the next day? Or would you anneal after forging and normalize once that is cooled down?
I am mostly doing 1095 that the seller says is annealed before being sold.
My basic understanding of the process is:
1-Forge at proper temps
2-Normalize 2 or 3 times; getting to non-magnetic then air cooling to black
3-Grain refinement 2 times; bringing steel to non-magnetic and air cooling, then just below non-mag for the last
4-Machining/drilling/grinding etc.
5-Hardening/quenching via non-magnetic temps to an oil quench after the steel soaks 5 min per 1/4"
6-Tempering; 2 cycles of 2 hours each @450.

Thanks & I appreciate any info you or anyone else can provide.

Kevin hasn't been on the forum since 2016 so he may not reply.

Here is an article on normalizing and annealing: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2021/08/28/how-to-thermal-cycle-knife-steel/
And an article on the best structure for forge heat treating: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2021/09/23/how-to-heat-treat-knife-steel-in-a-forge/
This article on 80CrV2 also is useful for this topic: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2022/06/23/how-to-heat-treat-80crv2/

 

[Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith]

Welcome Gruntlife. As you pointed out this is a 14-year-old thread. Kevin hasn't been around here for 8 years.
It would be best to post your question in a new thread.
I'm going to close this old thread to new posts.

In the meantime, I highly recommend the Book Knife Engineering, by Larin Thomas. It is the current bible for knifemaking the modern metallurgical way.

https://knifesteelnerds.com/2020/07/22/new-book-knife-engineering-steel-heat-treating-and-geometry/
(links to order your copy are near the bottom)