Norton India stone review w/ pics

I just picked one of these up and as usual i'm noticing strange things. First off the fine side is INSANELY coarse. Not able to get anything but the most basic of working edges off something like this.
Also contrary to what people are saying, my stone is not wear resistant at all. I ran my blade on the edge of the fine side just a bit, and the knife alone chamfered the edge on the stone...
I swear I can feel the grit particles releasing them selves as I sharpen. the stone gets all swarfy and the oil on the knife feels sandy.
Are there fakes out there? I bought from knifeworks, who is very legit but wow, this stone is not acting anything like people are saying on here!
 
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Gly5, It sounds like have the SIC stone as that material sloughs off more readily. Whereas Phy's stone is the Norton India. DM
 
No its an India... says right on the box. its an IB8 norton india oil stone combo.
Come on now i'm not that dumb : )
I notice something strange... when I use oil on the fine side, the stone sheds grit, and I get little micro pebbles under my edge. Feels like someone threw beech sand on the stone, but if I use it dry, or with water the fine side actually work really well, as in I can shave my arm off from it.

Again... are there fake Nortons out there? Also has anyone tried the alumina oxide stones that www.sharpensupplies.com makes? They have this combo that looks identical to the norton combo, but its USA made. They said its much higher quality on an email I sent to them... not sure if their just trying to sell me the stone or not:

http://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Traditional-Oil-Stone-Kit-P323.aspx

My nortin is made in mexico, I wonder if that stone there is any different?
 
That's a bit strange, the grit shedding thing. I have a Mexico build and an older US made, to be honest, they are both very similar. Neither side throws grit...

I'd have thought it would smooth out with only a bit of conditioning.
 
Calm yourself as we don't have to help you on this forum. St. Gobain does have a plant in Mexico and I have procured some Norton fine India stones from there with that stamping. They were a little more coarse but not anything like your stating. You could sand on it to take away some of it coarseness. Plus, I would agree with the sharpening supply folks that the U.S. made stones are a step up. As I have several of those and they are finer with little to no grit sloughing. Probably up around 400 grit. Still, I could get good edges from all of them. With the better more refined edge coming from the U.S. made stones. It's like they fired them different and used finer grit, resulting in higher quality. I rarely sharpen using water on this stone. I use mineral oil exclusively. Good luck, DM
 
Calm my self?
I did not realize I was being un-calm.
Anyhow thanks for the info on the stone from sharpening supplies.
By sand on it i'm guessing you mean grind it down and make it finer? I did that, issues are still there. The conditioning I did to the stone definitely helped the fine side become more workable, but the little pebbles are indeed strange. Under a 20x loupe they look like little tiny crystals from the stone, which you can see in bedded into the surface to make up the abrasive.
Oh well its only a 20 dollar stone anyway, no big loss.
Appreciate it dudes. I will try the USA made india style stone next!

PS: I have a REALLY old smith's 2 stone sharpening kit, has a little 1x3 medium india stone on top of a base, and then a little smaller hard arkansas pocket stone that sits under neath. They still make these now but this one is from like the 90s, and now days they have a soft arkansas on top, anyway
This medium oil stone on top is superb, doesn't shed a bit of grit, doesn't go out of flat and i'm able to get a good toothy edge, while still being able to set a bevel. After the hard arkansas stone i'm shaving hair no problem!
I ordered a medium India from sharpeningsupplies, hopefully it is something like this smith's stone, because they look identical!
 
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I would seriously consider sending a letter, email, phone call to St Gobain/ Norton just to see what they'll do for you. Those crystals are the Aluminum Oxide that make up the stone. The India, from what I can tell, has very little binder. After a reasonable break-in which you have exceeded by now, it should shed only small bits of those crystals, not entire particles. It would be a serious blow to their reputation if one could no longer recommend a combination India stone...
 
My U.S. made stones have good binding with very little or no sloughing of stone grit. Plus, they are like his older stones. Whereas I've noticed more shedding of grit with the Mexican made product. So, I think something changed in mfg. between the two. I wish there was a good email address for St. Gobain where a knowledgeable employee would answer our questions. Good luck, DM
 
I personally only see a slight difference between my US and Mexico made, US one is a bit finer, but then I also didn't boil the pre-oil out if it either. They are both super hard and tough. For a while I attempted to use reclaimed grit from the India as a hasty stropping compound, but the oil slurry is almost entirely swarf and not enough grit comes off either of my stones to make use of...

OWE had some success contacting Norton, I cannot remember the context well enough to do a search. He was tracking down the econo stone pedigree and did exchange with a live human being.

At the least I'd expect a replacement, maybe with an extra slip stone or other goodie tossed in.
 
hmmm, perhaps you are right. Maybe I can get Norton to let me try a different stone.
I did some more playing around with this today, I took a little paring knife and used the stone completely dry, with the factory oil still in it, but without adding any. The coarse side cut great, and the fine side left me with an edge I was more than happy with for a 20 dollar combo stone,
so I took out some Norton oil, and put some on the stone, literally within two strokes on the stone those crystals leaked out, and scratched/blasted the living hell out of my edge. Seems like the oil makes the stone shed. Perhaps I should just boil it out and use it as a dry stone. The only thing is I do not like how the stone loads up a bit when its dry.

I think this is why the Norton IM system have basically a little built in oil bath, to constantly wash away those little bits of grit. Just as Murray Carter said, oil stones work just like water stones, but you would literally need a bucket of oil to keep them cleaned off.
Thanks for the info. I'm going to try and Email Norton see what they say.
 
I purchased an 8" Norton India stone and had to return it...it was warped badly. I could set it on any flat surface and rock the stone from end to end. It was purchased from a place that sells "sharpening supplies" online. The second was fine. They also make that model in a larger version, which I have. I don't have it handy, but I think it's about 11" x 3" x 1" or something like that. I really like that stone.

Does it come in a US made version? My two were Mexico.
 
Glytch,

As has been stated, I think your stone has a manufacturing defect. India (aluminum oxide) stones aren't supposed to visibly shed grit. The fact that it happens when oil is applied makes me think that the binder in the stone isn't binding properly. Sounds like the oil is breaking it down. I wouldn't try boiling in out with this particular stone. You might end up with a pot full of stone bits!

Sorry to hear about you getting a bad stone. Hopefully Norton or your supplier can make it right for you.

Good luck.

Brian.
 
Your right dude, I just shot a 5 minute video showing it, i'm going to post it now and also make my new thread.
http://youtu.be/r1_vEc17HFk will be the youtube link, should be up in just under and hour! Thanks for everything guys, seeya!
 
Glytch5 said:
Your right dude, I just shot a 5 minute video showing it, i'm going to post it now and also make my new thread.
http://youtu.be/r1_vEc17HFk will be the youtube link, should be up in just under and hour! Thanks for everything guys, seeya!
Click to expand...


Holy cow. Mine does the same thing. I thought that was normal. I thought that it was simply a really coarse stone, so I'm usually just using it more for taking out chips in edges before moving on to higher grit water stones. Maybe I should try mine dry.
 
Agreed. My decades old USA made Norton Abrasives Behr-Manning Combination 8 inch coarse/fine India stone is the one stone that I would have to choose if limited to one stone (and I have over 50 various sharpening stones). It is my most used stone, is much quicker than the Arkansas stones. It gives a plenty fine edge with or without light stropping for most normal use. It has no apparent particle loss with even the hardest steels, and has remained flat for decades. (and I am a stickler for flat stones.)

My impression is that my old USA made Norton Abrasives Behr-Manning India stone is better than the newer USA made stones, and in a totally different class than the other newer stones made elsewhere. The stones made under that label were made from about to 1931 to the mid 1950s, but i think that the same product continued to be made by Norton after the Behr-Manning company was fully absorbed by Norton.
 
Ray, yes. I agree. It is still being made But at a different location (south across the border) and I think different grit is being used as well as a different firing process. Possibly with different binders as well. Now it is owned by St. Gobain. A French company. DM
 
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