Obsolete Knives

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May 12, 2012
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[Note: I wasn't sure of what board would be better to put this on as the subject can and does encompass a wide range of cutting implements. And the boards are rather specific. So I defulted to what seems to be the general discussion. Perhaps a mod could sort it better if need be.]
It may be hard to think of something as simple and universally useful as a knife becoming obsolete. But Once in a while, just that happens. Sometimes a knife is so special built to purpose that it is only useful within a very specific context. Invented out of necessity. And when what is necessitated changes or something far superior comes along these tend to become forgotten. So I thought I would post a couple of these obsolete blades that I happen to know of (and talk about their former use and why they became largely obsolete). And perhaps others could do the same:

The Sugar Cleaver.
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In the Victorian era sugar came in large clumps or as cane (as apposed to the mostly loose bags of powder we see today). This knife was specifically for processing sugar in the kitchen or at the dining table. And of course when how sugar was distributed changed this fell out of use and production. too large to be a butter knife, and too bulky and short to be a bread knife or to find any other good repurposing in the kitchen or at the dining table which another implement doesn't simply do better. This little beauty has become largely forgotten. Today they are often mistaken for an herb chopper.

The Lightning Hay Knife
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After hay would be cut and grouped into hay stacks in a field, it would be transferred to a barn for longer term storage. When hay settles it becomes compressed. And in order to take what you need from a stack (this was before bailing became a process). One would need to cut out a block from a hay stack. For a long time this would have been done with improvisation. Using things like a flat shovel to cut it out. eventually implements like the hay hook and a small (relatively) knife were invented to get this job done. But the last incarnation of the exclusively hay removal tool was the larger Lighting Hay knife (this was an English invention that saw a bit of adaptation for the American market). This tool did the job well. But it was invented about the same time as the gas chain saw. Which cut hay a lot quicker and more easily (aside from it's main purpose of cutting wood, of course). So Hay Knives had a short period (about 10 years) of prolific use before they were mostly replaced by the advancement of technology. Today they are often mistaken for ice saws.

[Edit for Clarification]
Some have raised semantic arguments over my choice of wording in my title and OP. Specifically the word "Obsolete". Civil debate along these lines is pertinent to the topic, and permissible by me (unless a moderator/admin hereafter exercises their authority to override my OP prerogative). I would only like to remind any who are taking part in that side of the discussion of a few things:

1) Dictionary definitions are descriptive; Not prescriptive.
2) Being tolerated can only reasonably go as far as one is tolerant in return.
3) Someone being right does not automatically make you wrong (or vice-versa). Sometimes correctness is simply a matter of perspective, and measured in degrees.
 
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Cool thread Helleri! Before clicking I was thinking how does a knife become obsolete (like you mentioned) and you had my interest! Way cool examples - never even knew these super specialized knife tools existed. I do now. Learn something new everyday! Thanks brother!
 
I've seen a few hay knives listed in museums as ice saws.

I would think that there are several old pocket knife patterns that are near obsolete, like specific pipe knives, or tobacco knives.

The only other sharp thing that I can think of that is near fully obsolete would be wick scissors, as parafin candles rarely need trimming, and when was the last time you saw a tallow candle?

And of course any knife with a USB key in it, who thought those would get to be disposable so fast!
 
Great thread. I too was thinking to myself "how does a knife become obsolete?" Even if knife no longer has a purpose it often has a dedicated group of collectors. For example my main area of interest is swords. Functionally I can make a pretty good argument that they are obsolete on the modern battlefield various "tactical" swords and big choppers to the contrary. However there is a fairly significant community that collects them making them still desireable. I think you've found some good examples that aren't functional and aren't collectible. I'm going to submit this one:

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No longer used, and I'm not sure anyone collects them either... this is an 19th century civil war era doctor's chest. Yikes!
 
Folding knives (pocket knives) from 1905-1930 can be found with blades for turning the carbide gas lamps on automobiles on and off. Since they usually had other blades the knife would only be partially obsolete.
 
You could argue that many knives currently in production are technically obsolete in our society, which we buy either as collectibles or with intentions of finding uses for them that are not necessity but rather recreation. Not that there is anything wrong with that. I guess it depends on which way you are looking at the term "obsolete"; replaced by a better, more efficient design or not needed in modern life?

Knives for skinning/processing game, processing wood for fires, or large combat-based knives/swords... none of these are needed in our society. But many of us want them, and feel more satisfaction when we do things in an old-fashioned way. Do we need to hunt to get meat? No, I doubt anyone who can sit and browse an internet forum on a Sunday morning is in a position where they do not have a place to purchase pre-processed meat. Do we do it anyway? Yes, and for our own reasons which probably differ from person to person.

...and now I'm starting to get a little too philosophical for this thread ;P
 
How about the corkscrew blade attachment. I used to use the one on my SAK when I couldn't find one at home, but that was rare. With modern conveniences, is the corkscrew "blade" in danger of extinction. I bet hardly any of them are used in America, but it may be different in Europe.
 
^ in Europe the corkscrew is often needed, we always have wine bottles with corks, that's why it's popular on traditional knives like Laguiole's or SAK's...

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Great thread! While the knife blade on the pattern itself isn't obsolete, the pattern's original use sure is: the doctor knife. Some of the ones I have seen come with a spatula secondary blade. It would have been used in the preparing of compounds. I have heard, but don't know for sure, that the flat butt of the knife could be used for crushing pills and stuff.
 
The Lightning Hay Knife
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After hay would be cut and grouped into hay stacks in a field, it would be transferred to a barn for longer term storage. When hay settles it becomes compressed. And in order to take what you need from a stack (this was before bailing became a process). One would need to cut out a block from a hay stack. For a long time this would have been done with improvisation. Using things like a flat shovel to cut it out. eventually implements like the hay hook and a small (relatively) knife were invented to get this job done. But the last incarnation of the exclusively hay removal tool was the larger Lighting Hay knife (this was an English invention that saw a bit of adaptation for the American market). This tool did the job well. But it was invented about the same time as the gas chain saw. Which cut hay a lot quicker and more easily (aside from it's main purpose of cutting wood, of course). So Hay Knives had a short period (about 10 years) of prolific use before they were mostly replaced by the advancement of technology. Today they are often mistaken for ice saws.

Hay knives aren't obsolete in the slightest, but are no longer made. I use one every few days for cutting portions from round bales. If you think that a chainsaw works better then you haven't used one in good operating condition. They work fast and with little effort. The "Lightning" or "Weymouth pattern" hey knife was most emphatically not an English invention, but rather an American one--specifically that of a George F. Weymouth March 7, 1871, of Maine. They were first made by the Hiram Holt Mfg. Co. of East Wilton, ME. The English pattern hay knife looks rather different, with a single canted handle and a blade resembling an overgrown chef's knife of sorts.

Here's a scan from an 1893 illustrated David Wadsworth & Son (of Auburn, NY) that shows both a Weymouth pattern hay knife and a few sizes of English pattern hay knives.

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Hay knives were also often used for cutting straw, peat, and sod. The teeth of the Weymouth pattern were ground hollow on a grinding wheel and easily slice through even densely packed hay. It was not until roughly the 1980's that baling became the overwhelmingly dominant method of hay storage, and up until that point in time the hay knife remained in faithful service. Later on, hay knives were made with adjustable handles and replaceable blades, many of which used sickle bar mower blades for the purpose. They were still in manufacture at least up until the 1930's and references suggesting their use (in a non-historical perspective) abound up through the late 1950's and beyond. :)
 
The Sugar Beet knife is one that would almost certainly fall into this category. It was designed for cutting and snagging up clumps of beets in harvest, and thus has a relatively short blade and a large marlin-like spike at the end. I picked one up at an antique store some time ago, as I found it interesting, and it actually has something of an edge remaining. I unfortunately don't have a picture available of mine, but a quick Google search will yield a picture of the pattern.

Great thread idea!
 
How about the corkscrew blade attachment. I used to use the one on my SAK when I couldn't find one at home, but that was rare. With modern conveniences, is the corkscrew "blade" in danger of extinction. I bet hardly any of them are used in America, but it may be different in Europe.

Honestly, a corkscrew is one of the things I prioritize on a SAK as it's very difficult to open a bottle of wine without one. I'm not much of a wine drinker, but my fiancée is and nothing kills the romance like struggling to extract a cork with some makeshift silliness. I can open a can with the main blade and a bottle with a lighter, knife handle, spoon, or almost anything else I can get some leverage with, but a when you need a corkscrew nothing else will do.
 
How about knives with Marlin Spikes?

Still popular for those who own or work on a sailing vessel, and with thise who work with non-metal rope. They are great for getting tight knots out.
The marlin spike also cones in handy when splicing three strand rope/lines/halyards.
 
Folding box knives are obsolete and cool. The end was a little hammer head, and had a nail puller/prybar blade, and they were used to open and reclose the little wooden boxes cigars, sugar, chocolate, and cheese came in.
 
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