Obsolete Knives

Hay knives aren't obsolete in the slightest, but are no longer made. I use one every few days for cutting portions from round bales. If you think that a chainsaw works better then you haven't used one in good operating condition. They work fast and with little effort. The "Lightning" or "Weymouth pattern" hey knife was most emphatically not an English invention, but rather an American one--specifically that of a George F. Weymouth March 7, 1871, of Maine. They were first made by the Hiram Holt Mfg. Co. of East Wilton, ME. The English pattern hay knife looks rather different, with a single canted handle and a blade resembling an overgrown chef's knife of sorts.

Here's a scan from an 1893 illustrated David Wadsworth & Son (of Auburn, NY) that shows both a Weymouth pattern hay knife and a few sizes of English pattern hay knives.

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Hay knives were also often used for cutting straw, peat, and sod. The teeth of the Weymouth pattern were ground hollow on a grinding wheel and easily slice through even densely packed hay. It was not until roughly the 1980's that baling became the overwhelmingly dominant method of hay storage, and up until that point in time the hay knife remained in faithful service. Later on, hay knives were made with adjustable handles and replaceable blades, many of which used sickle bar mower blades for the purpose. They were still in manufacture at least up until the 1930's and references suggesting their use (in a non-historical perspective) abound up through the late 1950's and beyond. :)

I guess my understanding of it was off (thanks for giving repair to that). I had bought a hay knife a few years back at a yard sale (along with a hog nose cant hook) and didn't know what it was. So I talked to the curator at our local museum (san lorenzo valley museum) to get my info. Either I got some inaccurate information or this long removed from when I learned about this my recollection of the information was bad (probably a bit of both). I did end up selling it for $40 dollars. As well as the cant hook I picked up with it for another $40 (the two I had bought from that yard sale for the grand total of $4).

Any way I think it still counts as an obsolete blade. You said yourself that they are no longer manufactured and that the process they were used in has changed to where it no longer requires them. And a lot of people probably have not seen one before. Even the farmer I sold it to as wall art even said he had never heard of it until he saw my listing. And that he wanted it as a conversation piece relevant to his living.
 
I've seen a few hay knives listed in museums as ice saws.

I would think that there are several old pocket knife patterns that are near obsolete, like specific pipe knives, or tobacco knives.

The only other sharp thing that I can think of that is near fully obsolete would be wick scissors, as parafin candles rarely need trimming, and when was the last time you saw a tallow candle?

And of course any knife with a USB key in it, who thought those would get to be disposable so fast!
I smoke pipe tobacco and don't even have a pipe knife. I am aware of them, but the stiff and bristled pipe cleaners from the local smoke shop work great in conjunction with a paper towel. I simply don't need one. I imagine that paper towels and the kind of pipe cleaners I use (along side the Surplus Society mentality of convenience through dispose-ability) probably didn't exist when Pipe knives were first made. And Tobacco pipe smoking - while still around - is far less popular then cigarette smoking. So there probably isn't that large of a market for a pipe knife. Found a picture of one as well to show here:

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If I were to get one at some point I would probably want that one.
 
I guess my understanding of it was off (thanks for giving repair to that). I had bought a hay knife a few years back at a yard sale (along with a hog nose cant hook) and didn't know what it was. So I talked to the curator at our local museum (san lorenzo valley museum) to get my info. Either I got some inaccurate information or this long removed from when I learned about this my recollection of the information was bad (probably a bit of both). I did end up selling it for $40 dollars. As well as the cant hook I picked up with it for another $40 (the two I had bought from that yard sale for the grand total of $4).

Any way I think it still counts as an obsolete blade. You said yourself that they are no longer manufactured and that the process they were used in has changed to where it no longer requires them. And a lot of people probably have not seen one before. Even the farmer I sold it to as wall art even said he had never heard of it until he saw my listing. And that he wanted it as a conversation piece relevant to his living.

Hay knives are still made, just not the Weymouth pattern. Spade-type ones are made by a few European manufacturers still. Müller of Austria had a Weymouth pattern in their catalog (though seemingly left-handed) in their catalog up until this year.
 
Also if memory serves correctly, Tyzack still makes an English pattern hay knife.
 
Hahaha--I'd honestly say that there are really very few knives that are truly obsolete. Rather that there are an abundance of them that are varying degrees of obscure. :D
 
I commend the OP for starting this thread. It's truly thought provoking and educational.
 
I suspect that all of the patterns still have users somewhere, a lot of the world farms without much mechanical equipment. But still something can be in use, but obsolete, or not even useless, but fallen from fashion for one reason or another.
 
How about a fleam (bloodletting blade) ?
 
Hahaha--I'd honestly say that there are really very few knives that are truly obsolete. Rather that there are an abundance of them that are varying degrees of obscure. :D

One could argue that the reason for obscurity could be a degree of obsolescence (Obsolete for practical and common use or relative to a task for which it was designed). I am sure if you tried you could find a use for just about any blade. But if a design really isn't used much any more it's probably because it isn't worth using over another design for most people. But this is getting pretty heavily into semantics I think. And missing the point for that reason. When it is easy enough to just amend the goal of what to show or discuss to obscure/relatively obsolete/forgotten knife designs and applications. That said, it is good to have the full info on it. Thanks for providing it.
 
We should add most of the traditional meat industry knives to our list of obsolete blades. Cleavers, splitters, along with most other large butcher knives, can still be found around homesteads and hunting camps; but the industry has moved on to using electric band saws in their place.

n2s
 
Going by the spirit of the thread (though, yes, I perhaps would quibble over the semantics) then ink erasers would fall under the category.
 
An argument could be made for this.
knife-image-darrel-ralph-straight-razor-2-1917.jpg


Because of this.
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I don't think I personally know any one who owns a strait razor. Or even any one who would know how to use one if they had one. It's just safer, easier, and quicker to click out an old head and pop in a new one. I know they are still made. But I have to wonder if the majority of sales are not just to people who want one for the sake of having one.
 
I have and use several--some new, some vintage. When not using a straight razor I use double-edged safety razors, which are still the standard in eastern Europe, India, and many other regions of the world. :)

Sorry to be the devil's advocate again. :D
 
I guess it may depend on the definition of "obsolete."
Does it mean something that is never used anymore, or just out of common usage?

fleams; button hooks; wick trimmers; and someday soon: keys?

 
Tableware in the 18th, 19th and early 20th centuries would have included silver fruit knives. They were nice so you could eat fruit without the carbon steel of other knives leaving a metal taste. Those would have been more common for wealthier homes and then less well to do depending on the going price for silver which varied.
 
I have and use several--some new, some vintage. When not using a straight razor I use double-edged safety razors, which are still the standard in eastern Europe, India, and many other regions of the world. :)

Sorry to be the devil's advocate again. :D

I only use DE now. Straights are great but they just take too long in the morning.
 
I only use DE now. Straights are great but they just take too long in the morning.

I generally shave in the evening and follow the 18th century definition of clean-shaven: within 3 days time. A 1950's gent would consider it unspeakable, but I don't mind the shadow as long as it doesn't become "established" in length.
 
I have and use several--some new, some vintage. When not using a straight razor I use double-edged safety razors, which are still the standard in eastern Europe, India, and many other regions of the world. :)

Sorry to be the devil's advocate again. :D

So you have and use them. But a large chunk of the world uses at least some form of a safety razor (as in not a strait razor) as it's standard... I think this kind of runs parallel to the last thing. Meaning just because someone out there still uses something (out of all those who don't) or there are isolated pockets of devotees and purists, doesn't mean that the thing in question can't be considered obsolete. A strait razor is objectively obsolete by the strictest senses of the word. There are simply faster, safer, more convenient, lighter, cheaper, less involved, and technologically superior options out there for shaving. That is what being outmoded is. Obsolescence doesn't have to mean useless. Just not worth it over "option b" for most people, most of the time. There are people who collect vinyl records and listen to them over modern options. But my phone will store or have instant access to more music, of an objectively higher fidelity, and long term non-degrade-ability then their entire garage will. Them choosing to go with the old fashioned thing doesn't mean that it is not obsolete. And the continued production of some obsolete items only means that we live in a such a surplus society that is so globalized, that even things which 100 years or so ago would have never been made again, because it wouldn't have been worth it at a certain point, still get made because you can always find a market for something if you look hard enough.
 
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