Old Debate, Any New Thoughts? Big Knives vs Axes.....

Marion David Poff

Marion David Poff

Joined
Oct 8, 1998
Messages
5,403
OK,

I love these threads, because I usually end up learning from all your perspectives....

So, this is my starting point.

I carry a big knife, a chopper, unless I will need to procure LARGE amounts of wood.

I like axes, but I dislike hatchets/axettes, and really dislike the double bit.

This should be a great discussion.

Marion
 
My preference runs towards the big knife. Just more fun than an ax :) Unless I know I have a lot of big wood to cut like on an extended stay or logging with my Dad, I don't need to pack in the extra weight. A big blade(9-11in) will drop right in even the tightest of my packs. Also I find a large knife a little more useful than as just a chopper. An ax excells at the chop but ever try clearing vines and light brush with one? Big knife will do both jobs just fine for me. Course everyone will have their own reasons for their choice and they are probably right :)
 
I have the perfect answer.
It's the same for all of these type questions:

It depends. :p

If I'm just camping or hiking, then a big knife is the way to go. Usually this means a 20" kukri. It's faster than a saw or 3/4 axe going through most wood used for such endeavours. However, it is heavier than a 3/4 axe -- close to the weight of a full size axe with a 3.5# head -- and you will fatigue much sooner with it than with a two-handed tool. So if it's just for a campfire for a night or two, or making some trail lunch, the big knife works great.

If it's going to be a week long camp out, then it's worth dragging along a 3/4 axe, my preference being the Snow & Neally Hudson Bay. You can work longer with less fatigue with it, and it does split better. If there's a lot of clearing of light vegetation to be done at the same time, I'll take a machete as well.

For heavy work, taking down/apart large trees, then a full size axe is called for. I could use a chainsaw, but this way I get to play in the outdoors and get some exercise at the same time. Full-on maul for splitting if there's a lot to do.
 
For day hikes, I carry a big chopper on my belt, a Greco Explorer with 9.5" blade of 8670 steel. To that, I intend to add a Cold Steel shovel, strapped to my pack with one edge sharpened for heavier chopping.

For car camping trips, I bring along a full-size axe with 3.5lb head. Depending on where I'm going, I may also take a chain saw for ease of wood stockpiling. It's nice to leave a pile behind for the next campers.

For backpacking trips, I'm not yet certain. This is because I've not backpacked since my leg was crushed 7 years ago. However, I hope to rectify that this summer! I'l definitely be taking a big chopper to start with. I'm comfortable, capable and confident with it, especially when paired with a Leatherman Supertool 200 and reliable folder (such as D2 Griptilian) or small fixed blade.

There are no appreciable bodies of water near me, so I've yet to experience the pleasure of a canoe trip. I imagine the cutlery I'd take for that may vary slightly from other trips.

For survival skills trips, I take a host of tools! These are fun for experimenting with new items or combinations.
 
Living in the Pac Northwet where we generally have high humidity and lower temps or it is just plain soaking wet for weeks on end...or we can get high winds, blowing snow and sub zero temps in the high Cascades, we have to reduce a substantial amount of damp/soaking wet wood down in order to survival.

You didn't list your mission profile which would be a huge help in directing comments or commentary. Day hiking, hunting, camping, survival or what? You didn't say? Many have suggested a chopper for a day hike situation and that makes perfect sense. But since this section is about "survival" in general, I'll make the leap that is what you're preparing for...Since this is about survival, survival is about trying to live while consuming the least amount of calories in order to stay alive. In survival/emergency we generally don't have the luxury of easily inputting large doses of calories....so we don't have the luxury of burning any more calories than we absolutely need. If we need to burn them then we need to invest them wisely into appropriate tasks. We could invest them in battoning wood - but why? Other than the "wow-cool-fun" factor...if I need a fire to survive for a few days I don't want to burn calories splitting or chopping with a knife when a few wacks with an ax will reduce a large pile of wood in minutes.

It is my opinion using a knife to chop and slip wood in this damp forest will consume an enormous amount of precious calories trying to reduce enough wood to stay warm, build a shelter, and cook for several days in this wilderness. Whereas with an ax my efforts are significantly reduced. I can do many tasks in the woods with an ax besides chopping. A knife will work, an ax works better in my situation and with my mission profile. If I'm just going out to play for a few hours and have a small fire or whittle a whistle then a knife is fine. If I'm planning on spending a night or two out - I need an ax!

What I did was do both - I went out for two to three days in a cold, damp rainy forest and lived out of my pack. One trip with a chopper and one with a small ax. I convinced myself after the first night which route I chose to go.

If I have a knife I can survive...if I have an ax I'll live like a king in the woods!
 
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I use a NMFBM (11" blade). Works for me .:thumbup: I agree though that different areas/situations require different tools. I like the NMFBM because it weighs 1/2 the weight of an axe, is safer for me, and provides additional capabilities that would be more difficult with an axe.
 
I almost always carry a big knife (7” to 11” blade) on the trail, and often a folding saw (Corona); that’s all I really need for most trail clearing jobs or campfire duty. :cool:

I only carry an ax when I know I need it, like when I have to cut up a deadfall on the trail or at a camp location, and then it will be a double bit attached to a frame pack.





"If you're not living on the edge, …you're taking up too much space."

Big Mike

Forest & Stream
 
I carry a folding saw and a medium fixed blade. Never needed anything else.

If I did I would opt for an axe.
 
Like J Williams. I carry a small folding saw and a 4 inch fixed blade. I've never needed anything else. IMO the saw offers greater control over the eventual tiresome swing of the axe, this can lead to a bigger, nastier injury. Just my opinion of course. I thought it was all about doing more with less though.
 
I think I'm in the "it depends" camp. For daily in the field a large blade is on my pack. I have a folding Swedish saw in the toolbag in the Jeep, but I can't remember the last time I used it.

'Sides, it is just more fun to play with the knife! :D
 
cmgray said:
Like J Williams. I carry a small folding saw and a 4 inch fixed blade. I've never needed anything else. IMO the saw offers greater control over the eventual tiresome swing of the axe, this can lead to a bigger, nastier injury. Just my opinion of course. I thought it was all about doing more with less though.
Click to expand...

well said man. I like an axe, but just prefer the safety of a saw, and its lighter, and packs smaller. Just my preferance though...
 
Still got the same old thoughts, I'm a hatchet man myself. Never used a double bit, don't have that kind of money. Only new thing to add is that perhaps a hatchet seems less threatening to other hikers. I don't care what they think but at the same time I like to keep a low profile. Plus with a sharp hatchet and green wood all but trees over 8 inches are tough. I have cut down a 8 inch diameter eucalypt (live) with a hatchet (Gransfors Wildlife) on a friends land he was clearing to see how long it would take and I'd be surpised if it was more than 5-10 minutes.
 
For me a 7"-9" fixed blade plus a folding saw will work most of the time when I'm out tramping around. If I "know" I'll need to do some heavier cutting, then an axe goes with me and/or a bow saw!

Saws tend to do more with less effort EXCEPT when you need to split wood of substantial size, then the ax comes into play.

I have started looking at lightweight 'Hawks recently tho' for belt carry. I wouldn't mind having something that can chop and hammer, yet not be too large/heavy to get left behind. But I'd still have a saw and a large fixed blade too! ;)
 
Unless I have to procure a weeks worth of firewood, I've carry a big knife. I used one of Bill Siegle's big choppers the last few times I went camping and it handled logs up to 8" with ease. Maybe not as well as a full size axe, but better than a hatchet for sure. And as a straight plug for Bill:thubmup: I've sold off all my 10"+ Busses, this chopper works better for me! The thin edge, tall grind, and weight all combine to make a great chopper!!!
 
An axe simply works better on larger wood. If you are felling trees, a knife is a completely impractical. Yes it can be done, but not easily. Now, how often do you need to fell a tree? Rarely is the answer most likely. If you are going to do a lot of it for a specific task, you will have both an axe and a chainsaw on hand.

Clearing trails. You can do it with a large knife. Like this one we did for fun. The stress here is you are doing it for fun!

DSC_0017-26.jpg


However, if I were doing this for regular trail maintenance and knew for example I had a series of downed trees. I'd be bringing a full sized buck saw and an axe. Lets face it, in this get together we had a lot of big chopping knives. I even had my SOD which I consider a pretty good chopper in the knife world, what it lacks in length, it picks up in weight. But the axe cruised through this much faster. If I had to cut through three or four pieces of wood this sized, I wouldn't be so keen to be using my large knife.

DSC_0031-9.jpg


If I had a piece of wood to chop this size than using my big chopper knife is not a problem! If I didn't anticipate clearing trails but might come across something unexpectedly then the knife is good.

Finally, if the trails were mostly spring stuff - like vines, saplings and bushes. I'd really prefer a machete or a long bladed, thinner chopper like my koyote traditional leuku.

Like most here, I find a knife more fun to use than an axe. I don't know why, I just do.
 
I do long distance hiking so I don't use a large chopper or an axe. Just too heavy. I live on the coast so I am able to burn drift wood for fire, and can baton the biger pieces with my fixed blade (bravo 1). I also usually take a folder and my swiss tool
 
My go to chopper is my M-43 kukri. It chops far better than anaxe of the same size, plus can serve excellently as a drawknife, sickle etc.

For the smaller stuff I generaly carry a 4.5"-5" fixed blade as well.
 
It is the third element, the saw, that swings it for me. If I know chopping will be involved I take a 12” bow saw. That combined with a golok gives me nearly all the range I need. Sometimes I do need the sheer brute force of an ax and when I do the ax is peerless, but golok and the saw work best for me most of the year. In the absence of a saw I'd prefer the ax, but that aint going to happen.
 
I almost always prefer a hatchet to a big knife. To me, it is just more versatile.

When assembling my trio off tools, i do so with this in mind: If for some reason two of my tools get lost or broken, i would like to be able to survive with whichever i have left. If i loose my hatchet and fixed blade, i can get by pretty well with just the SAK. If i loose my axe and SAK, i can do fine with just my fixed blade. If i loose my SAK and Fixed blade, then i will be just fine with my axe. Looking at a large fixed blade as a singular tool, I dont see it as beeing all that usful.

I am pretty well versed in the usage of an axe, and feel that with it, i can do most things, including fuzz sticks, notching, whittling and such. but that is just me personally. plenty of people couldnt do any of those things with an axe, just as i can hardly do them with a big knife.

if weight is an issue, i would just opt for a saw. really, you never need to do much chopping or hewing unless you are doing some sort of timbercraft (yes, i just made that word up i think). a saw will get it done alot of the time, and, as jake said, it is usually safer and more compact.

in a differant enviroment though, other things might work better. in a jungle, a chopper would be rather cumbersome, as would an axe/hatchet. a machete is obviosly much more suited to this enviroment. An i dont really lump machetes into the chopper/big knife categorie.

so yea, it just depends.
 
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