Old VS New (calling the "oldtimers")

Let me put something out to you here. I personally think height and arm length has more to do the length of Khukuri that will work best for you more so than your weight. Weight is going to be a linear equation.
I'm looking for a longish blade over 16" in the mid to upper 20oz range that is stout enough for me to swing hard and survive without being overbuilt and heavy and obtuse. I think the Kami's can and have done that I think we just need a better way to identify when we see it. That's why I think we are looking towards the older blades.
I omitted a monster stream of consciousness post on height/weight and khukuri selection and use to get to the above condense version. If anybody wants to I've saved it and I'll open another thread with it.
 
Let me put something out to you here. I personally think height and arm length has more to do the length of Khukuri that will work best for you more so than your weight. Weight is going to be a linear equation.
I'm looking for a longish blade over 16" in the mid to upper 20oz range that is stout enough for me to swing hard and survive without being overbuilt and heavy and obtuse.
Well if anyone wants to correlate data and generate a chart for picking the proper size Khuk; here are my specs. I'm 5'10" tall and my arm length from armpit to the tips of my fingers is approximately 29" - 30". So far my favorite Khuks have been 15" - 18" with weights ranging from 19 oz. - 25 oz. This may change as I get more exposure to different khuks; but I doubt if I would be comfortable with any khuk longer than 20".
 
Well if anyone wants to correlate data and generate a chart for picking the proper size Khuk; here are my specs. I'm 5'10" tall and my arm length from armpit to the tips of my fingers is approximately 29" - 30". So far my favorite Khuks have been 15" - 18" with weights ranging from 19 oz. - 25 oz. This may change as I get more exposure to different khuks; but I doubt if I would be comfortable with any khuk longer than 20".

Don't bother...you got it right.:D

Back on topic though...:)
Can anyone post the difference in performance between lighter and heavier designs provided lenght & model stay the same?
 
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Let’s try the condensed version.
I think that generally 2 things govern the optimal Khunkri for people or the Khukuri that picks them.
Heavier people can wield heavier khukuris without the Khukuri’s weight throwing them off of their center of gravity.
The relationship between arm Length and preferred Khukuri length is direct and linear. Longer arm = longer preferred Khukuri length.
I’m not looking to build an equation to find each person perfect Khukuri just trying to give people something to think about when picking their first or next Khukuri. hollowdweller nailed most of this but not in so basic terms.
Back to the light versus heavy discussion. I know I can hit very hard with a khukuri in the 18” range around 2.5pounds. What I want to know is if I take the same length but back the weight off 8 to 12 ounces but use more power on the swing. What will happen? Reduced chopping, equal chopping or increased chopping. Because if it is equal or increased chopping I can get a Khuk that will take care of springier vegetation and still chop like my M43.

Heinlein, I'm 5'11" inseam of 30" sleeve length between 32& 33" @ around 205 pounds.
DanSmithy, I think part of the big question here is going to be just how much weight difference is it going to take to make a significant difference in handling given the same length and model. I personally think that that threshold will be about 4ounces but its going to vary by user.
 
...I know I can hit very hard with a khukuri in the 18” range around 2.5pounds. What I want to know is if I take the same length but back the weight off 8 to 12 ounces but use more power on the swing. What will happen?...
DanSmithy, I think part of the big question here is going to be just how much weight difference is it going to take to make a significant difference in handling given the same length and model. I personally think that that threshold will be about 4ounces but its going to vary by user.

I'm hovering around the 25oz mark as a good balance between usable weight and comfortable carry...anything more will be overkill for me. Length wise..around 15"-18" max.OAL (this combo is somewhat hard to come by lately)
My DuiChirra is 32oz - 18" and it performs very well, but is a bit too heavy for all day carry.
You can very well use heavier model for "in the truck carry" or "motorized" camping...but what I'm looking for is "on person carry" optimal weight+length solution.
 
Hey gang,

Was gone last week and didn't see this until the weekend...and didn't want to post until I had my specs on hand. First; I'm 6' 1.5" tall, 33" sleeve, 34" inseam, 215 pounds, average to large hand and geezin' at 56. Being a new guy here myself (started buying in November '09) I wasn't sure exactly what to get as far as length and weight. I started with an 18" Chainpuri @ 25 oz. Shortly thereafter I snagged a 20" Sirupati at 32.3 oz. for a really good price. The Siru was good for practice on treating horn, filling cracks and practicing sharpening but the length and weight made it seem alien to my hand and it gets used for digging out weeds and other dirt related work.

It seemed that 18" was the length that suited me and is the mainstay of my purchases since. The 18" include the Chainpuri-25oz. by SherT, a Malla-26.4oz. by SherT, a Hanuman-33.5oz. by SherT, a Gelbu Special-23.4oz. by SherT, an 18th Century model-34.4oz., a "Baby" Ganga Ram Special-29.6oz. by Murali, the Ek Chirra Chitlangi-19 1/4oz, by Jag&Prem and an ASTK-24 1/4oz. by Lok. 18"ers that I returned (didn't fit my hand) include an M43-30.5oz. by young Sher, a Chitlangi-25oz. by Vim and a Foxy's Folly27.3oz. by Vim.

Non-18" models that I have include a Bura Pen Knife-12.5" & 11.9oz., a Sgt. 16.5" CAK-29.3oz., a 16.5" Kumar Chiruwa WWII-26oz., a Cobalt/Monk Cleaver-15" & 34.1oz. by Bura, a 25" Kobra-30.2oz. by Sanu, a 15.5" File Kobra-10.2oz. by Bura, a Salyan-15.5" & 23oz. by SherT, older true Villager-13 3/4" &18.4oz., a Katunje-15 3/4" & 20.6oz by Dil and the aforementioned 20" Sirupati by Vim. Shorter models that I had and gave away include a BDC-14" & 20.1oz by Vim, a Villager CAK-13 1/4" & 20.4oz. by SherT, an AK-15.5" & 23.4oz by Vim and a Boomerang-15" & 22.5oz. by SherT.

Nearly all of these got taken out back to chop on a 3-4" limb of seasoned Norway maple to get a feel for how they chopped and how they felt in hand. The 16.5" CAK was my best chopper with the M43 doing a little better than it until I got the Hanuman which became the leader of the pack for chopping. The "Baby" Ganga Ram Special is right behind the Hanuman too at this point...it did an excellent job of limbing some large pine branches.The 18th Century model is about on par with the 16.5" CAK, though I haven't sharpened it which may improve its performance. I was surprised at the Gelbu Special which almost chops as well as the 16.5" CAK. Of the shorter models the Boomerang and the BDC chopped well, along with the AKs.

The Hanuman is a little weighty to be swinging for too long and I'll keep it aside until there is something larger that needs attention. Its extra weight helps it to chop a little more deeply with less energy being put forth but I'm sure that after an extended period of usage my arm would be worn. The narrower edge of the GRS makes it a little more prone to stick in the wood but it is a little easier to handle than the Hanuman. The GS, being lighter, will require a little more time to get through the wood but is easier on the arm weightwise. The Foxy's chopped OK (on par with the M43) but I don't know about extended chopping with its 1/4" spine...seems kinda thin.

(I included the specs and kami with the various models in hope someone may benefit from them. Apart from the specs, the above is only my opinion and of course YMMV. I am still new and without extensive use on all of these models. I also haven't studied or perfected my technique. Questions are welcomed and if I don't know then I'll tell you so.)

I've also been watching the DOTD and remarking on the increased weights. I waited for a non-chiruwa ASTK just to find one that weighed in at less that two pounds. My readings through the Archives brought me through the production of the YCS and how highly it was praised. This got me thinking about getting one but all that was available weighed 30+ oz. I want to experience Yvsa's model as he designed it. It was supposed to be a lighter carry, fully curved working khuk and I personally can't see the same model in the two pound range fitting that bill. I have one on order that I would like to get as close to Yvsa's original specs as possible-3/8" spine & 24oz. but with a plain wooden non-chiruwa handle. One was made but it came in with the spine a little over 1/4" and the weight was 27oz. It got caught in the flooding and although the blade was refinished, the scabbard wasn't dried thoroughly and the blade was rusted on arrival to Reno. (Look for a blem coming soon.)

The M43s first made were a little over 1/4" thick and weighed in around 27oz. from three different kamis. An extra 1/2 pound on one would seem to make it a pretty awkward blade to handle. I know that the 18th Century takes some getting used to with its weight hanging out there. With no chiruwa handle to help offset the weight, it still, surprisingly, has a pretty good feel and balance.

The old group of kamis apparently weren't doing the best of jobs and the new ones are impressing with fit and finish in addition to new styles and artistic flair. As for the weight issue, we may have to wait around and see if anyone shines as far as bringing the weights down a bit. I will be checking out one of their heavier offerings soon with the Villager Farm Knife that is on its way here. At 34oz. with that blade, I don't think you'd need to swing it that hard.

Speaking of old kamis, its a shame that Sher(the Tiger) is gone. He was early on known for overbuilding his AKs but as can be seen from the weights listed above, he was capable of making model with a lighter weight while still keeping a 7/16-1/2" spine on it. But there were many others from the past that were also talented and I miss them all and wish them well. Seems like Murali is the last of them for now, though I'm still hoping that Bura's health will improve enough to at least let him be able to oversee the shop.

Don't know if all this rambling has helped or not but I thought that the weight issue deserved m2c. My best to all you Blade Brothers.

Rick
 
I hope I've done this right:
I'm 6' 1.5" tall, 33" sleeve, 34" inseam, 215 pounds, average to large hand
in order of best chopper:
18" Hanuman - 33.5oz
18" BGRS - 29.7oz
16.5" CAK - 29.3oz
18" M43 - 30.5oz

It seems like you're hovering around the 30oz mark 17"-18"

I'm 5 1/2' tall, 154 pounds, small to average hand, around 23" arm length
Yeah, I know, I'm a little bugger:o
I've chopped with my 18" DuiChirra @ 32oz for an full hour without complaints except for the handle geometry which I've since "fixed".
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=761019&highlight=dui+chirra+sneak+preview
However, carrying this beauty is another story.

If we take the magic number 7 as the weight ratio human / khuk (215pound / 30oz = 7) (22oz x 7 = 154pound)
then my khuks should weight around 22oz. for comfortable carry.
I wonder how much this blade weight will impair chopping ability.
I've long suspected that any knife over 25-28oz is too much for me for comfortable carry-round all day.

Thanks for the input. Keep it coming.
 
A lot of folks have already brought up most of the points I was planning on touching upon, but thought I might as well throw in my two-bit, so here goes ...

I know HI has a huge fan following for its "overbuilt", big, thick & heavy khukuris, but I too am wondering if HI would be willing to produce lighter versions of their popular models as well. Like many here, I feel a broader-bladed khukuri in the 16-18 inch overall range (ex: M43, AK, etc.) with a weight in the 24-28 ozs range would be ideal for me personally (stats = 5’10” 180lbs). For khukuris longer than that (20+ inch range) I would personally stick to the slimmer-bladed variety (Sirupate, Chainpure, etc.) to keep it in the same weight range, unless I was specifically going for a big, heavy khukuri.

Now to bring down the weight from what we usually see, perhaps some areas to consider would be:

BLADES: Slightly slimmer spine – doesn’t have to be super-slim like a “CS Kukri”, but shaving off a tenth of an inch or two should make a difference in weight. Also, perhaps deeper hollow-forged blades. I’ve handled some very nice, well-made older khukuris (as well as from another modern source) that strike a great balance between length and weight, and most of these have deeply hollow-forged blades with tapering spines (thicker at bolster, thinner at tip). They have a decent heft for good chopping power but also have a very lively, “fighter” feel to them that makes them a pleasure to swing around.

HANDLES: Non-Chiruwa handle options please! Stick tangs work very well, and have done so for centuries, and I’m pretty sure they weigh less than chiruwa-tangs too. Infact, as a number of you know, many older khukuris (as well as many current khukuris used in the villages in Nepal & the Himalayas) are partial tangs and serve(d) their owners very well – this is just an example, not saying we should have partial tangs, but definitely more stick-tangs going all the way through the handle. Of course, for models like M43 they should probably remain chiruwa-handle-only as the original WW2 ones were chiruwa-style, but even here, gradually tapering the spine of the tang in the handle from thicker by the bolster to thinner by the pommel should shave off some weight without hampering the khukuri’s performance.

Also, I wonder if making the handles less chunky might help too – those extra long, super-thick handles are not as aesthetically pleasing to my eyes, and I’m sure add to the weight too. Shorter handles should lower the weight too, but may not be popular with folks having bigger hands, but just throwing this in here as an option, perhaps shorten the handles just a tad bit?!

MISCELLANEOUS: I like some of the recent scabbards, as well as the fact that there seem to be more non-habaki bolsters being offered. Now, can we please bring down the kauri/cho closer to the bolster???!!! :D

The above are all my personal wish-list for alternate/lighter HI options besides its usual heavy-weight line-up. I’m certain loads of you will scoff at the idea of shaving down the spine thickness, handle size, etc., particularly with HI’s reputation for indestructible blades, and I’m fine with that. :) These are just my personal opinions based on the fact that I see a khukuri in its traditional role (as it’s usually seen in Nepal and other parts of the Himalayas) – as a fighting blade as well as an all purpose utility chopper, but not as an axe-substitute or a prybar with an edge!!! :D :D Here in the Himalayas, folks usually don’t try to chop down mid-sized trees with their khukuris – they find a bancharo (axe) for that. :D Also, food for thought: most Nepali are smaller than most average-sized Americans, but their khukuris also usually weigh in the 20oz-or-less range, so a 17-inch M43 weighing 26 ozs isn’t really a flimsy, lightweight blade ... umm ... don’t know where I’m going with this thought :confused: ... anyways, better end on this note as I'm starting to ramble.

Hope I haven’t offended anybody ... I’ll now go back and wait for an 18” 24oz M43 to show up with shorter, slimmer stag-horn (or neem) handle and tooled leather scabbard, or an 18” 25 ozs non-chiruwa-handle Shamsher, or ... :)
 
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I agree with most of what sta94 has said but will go one step futher specifically. The work done by kami Tirtha has been very impressive to say the least, I feel he's up to an old classic like the MKII / M43. I'd like to see it with two rivets preferably brass and countersunk, with the three rings / grooves in between. A few of the more recent M43's had the right blades but the three rivets prevented me from buying. I believe HI could sell as many of these classics as the kami's could make.
 
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I agree with most of what sta94 has said but will go one step futher specifically. The work done by kami Tirtha has been very impressive to say the least, I feel he's up to an old classic like the MKII / M43. I'd like to see it with two rivets preferably brass and countersunk, with the three rings / grooves in between. A few of the more recent M43's had the right blades but the three rivets prevented me from buying. I believe HI could sell as many of these classics as the kami's could make.

Great points, couldn't have said it better myself!!! :thumbup: :thumbup: Had thought about it but forgot to bring up the three rivets vs. two rivets issue in my post. As you can see lots of M43 fans around :D :D :D
 
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