OMG! Has anyone ever spent 3 hours sharpening a knife...

HeavyHanded said:
The only time I have come close to 3 hrs on a single knife was when I changed a TOPS C.A.T. from a saber grind to a full convex, by hand. Had to remove a ton of steel and then polish out the deeper gouges.

Are you doing the bevel work with a diamond bench stone, or diamond rods on the Sharpmaker?

I once spent over half an hour trying to lower the angle on 154cm using a Washita Arkansas stone. Switched to a SIC stone and had it done in under 10 minutes. Sometimes you just need to use a faster stone.
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The re profile took about 15-20 minutes tops on a diamond stone. Set it a little less than 30 inclusive and removed the burr. The rest of the time was spent obsessively on the sm trying to turn the knife into a razor blade. A lot of that three hours included shaving hair and cutting newspaper, napkins and coffee filters. Lol, I had me a full blown "episode" last night. :) There was a moment last night where I actually started going backwards (when I posted on here) I think I had a wire edge that I hadn't properly eliminated. Knife is extremely sharp now, but I can't help but feel frustrated that I can't get it to quite the same level as my bd1 blade. Oh well, might have to practice some acceptance. ;)
 
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Surfingringo said:
The re profile took about 15-20 minutes tops on a diamond stone. Set it a little less than 30 inclusive and removed the burr. The rest of the time was spent obsessively on the sm trying to turn the knife into a razor blade. A lot of that three hours included shaving hair and cutting newspaper, napkins and coffee filters. Lol, I had me a full blown "episode" last night. :) There was a moment last night where I actually started going backwards (when I posted on here) I think I had a wire edge that I hadn't properly eliminated. Knife is extremely sharp now, but I can't help but feel frustrated that I can't get it to quite the same level as my bd1 blade. Oh well, might have to practice some acceptance. ;)
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That makes a bit more sense in terms of time in. Three finger sticky, push cut newspaper, shear cut paper towel. I try not to use too many tests these days. If it performs in the neighborhood of what I've come to expect from a given finish, that's good enough (for now), especially if I just changed the bevel or gave it a first sharpening etc. When I go back to touch it up after some use I'll correct any other issues at that time. Not all steels respond the same to a given abrasive, or even the same steel from different makers, and of course changing the inclusive angle will make a difference too - acceptance is good, at least in the short term. IMHO, persistence is best combined with patience (and a touch of humor).
 
HeavyHanded said:
That makes a bit more sense in terms of time in. Three finger sticky, push cut newspaper, shear cut paper towel. I try not to use too many tests these days. If it performs in the neighborhood of what I've come to expect from a given finish, that's good enough (for now), especially if I just changed the bevel or gave it a first sharpening etc. When I go back to touch it up after some use I'll correct any other issues at that time. Not all steels respond the same to a given abrasive, or even the same steel from different makers, and of course changing the inclusive angle will make a difference too - acceptance is good, at least in the short term. IMHO, persistence is best combined with patience (and a touch of humor).
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Thank you. Words of wisdom. I think part of it too is I am still pretty new to sharpening. I am honestly pretty shocked by the level I have been able to achieve in just a few months. That's been fun, but that's part of the problem too though. I am still exploring the boundaries of what is possible and what I'm capable of. So it's harder for me to set a knife down knowing that it's as sharp as I can get it. I mean, maybe I can get it a little sharper right?? Hehehe. A couple of times (like last night) I've thought that and ended up dulling a perfectly good edge. I have always been able to bring them back to life and get them sharper than ever though. Part of the process of discovery I guess.


Btw, with a fresh mind and a cup of coffee I just spent another 5-10 minutes very carefully finishing the edge on the fine sm rods. The cts-204p paramilitary is now as sharp as it has ever been. Of course I still believe I can get it just a little sharper. Hehehehehehe
 
Surfingringo said:
Thank you. Words of wisdom. I think part of it too is I am still pretty new to sharpening. I am honestly pretty shocked by the level I have been able to achieve in just a few months. That's been fun, but that's part of the problem too though. I am still exploring the boundaries of what is possible and what I'm capable of. So it's harder for me to set a knife down knowing that it's as sharp as I can get it. I mean, maybe I can get it a little sharper right?? Hehehe. A couple of times (like last night) I've thought that and ended up dulling a perfectly good edge. I have always been able to bring them back to life and get them sharper than ever though. Part of the process of discovery I guess.


Btw, with a fresh mind and a cup of coffee I just spent another 5-10 minutes very carefully finishing the edge on the fine sm rods. The cts-204p paramilitary is now as sharp as it has ever been. Of course I still believe I can get it just a little sharper. Hehehehehehe
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Part of the issue, at least with me, was having a mindset that says every edge must reach some lofty level of refinement - sharper - or at least as sharp as this other knife over here. I went through a period of rediscovery where I began cut testing all my edges on a variety of materials as I went through a progression, and realized "sharp" is an elusive quality to really define without knowing what the intended role is of a given tool. As I began to tailor my edges, the whole process took on a different character. But, one needs to know how to make the edge they're shooting for, on the steel they're working on, with the cutting profile of the tool they're working on, and have a reasonable expectation of performance and the effort involved. I fear you will have a few more of those marathon sessions in your future, of tinkering and noodling an edge nearly to death and back again:) At some point, when things aren't working out the way you expect, it will have happened so many other times you'll know what the issue is right off the bat.

My current mindset is that edges can be coarse, medium, or fine, and can be pushed a bit one way or the other along this scale depending on the specifics of the tool in question (steel type, edge profile). As long as they function acceptably within the range of what I expect from an edge at whatever level I'm shooting for, all is good.

It helps to have a consistent testing protocol, trying to figure out why a given knife cannot perform the same as another edge on one test, but performs the same on another, maybe, on this go-around, but when tested just a few minutes ago it seemed to behave a bit differently, must be time for a new testing media....you will loose your mind:)

That's why I go with the three finger sticky and how does it cut newsprint? If I put in extra effort I might pull a hair from my head, or roll up a pant leg to check tree-topping ability, but with enough practice you can almost tell if you're there just from the 3 finger and newspaper. In all reality you can get a real good notion of what an edge is good for with just a three finger test and close visual inspection.
 
Excellent post HH! Many of us (yep, me too) try to get all knives as sharp as the one that we were most proud of with our efforts and technique. I finally realized after much agony and experimentation that there was definitely a large difference in results with different steels, and even heat treat of the same steel from knife to knife from maker to maker. Even with the basic same edge profile. My sharpness test is much like yours, three finger feel, how it cuts newsprint, and for me, how it "snags" on the hair on the back of my head.:eek: If it passes these tests, then it will surely do its intended job to the best of its ability. I am satisfied, so my "customers" should be also. (They always are.) When we learn the limitations of each knife/steel and think in terms of practical use for said knife, then our results should be satisfactory. Not withstanding our "bragging blades" that we all strive for. Well, maybe not ALL, but most of us that are into sharpening as part of our knife hobby.

Blessings,

Omar
 
Martin, Omar,

I'm still chasing that elusive hair splitting edge on some of my knives :o :p so Lance, I'm with you there :D

Maybe one day I can be where both of you are:cool:
 
Chris, from what I read from your posts, you should already be there.:D When you get there, let me know where the market is for hair splitting edges, and their intended use. Would like to be a part of that splitting edge market.:cool:

Blessings,

Omar
 
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Chris "Anagarika";12687082 said:
Martin, Omar,

I'm still chasing that elusive hair splitting edge on some of my knives :o :p so Lance, I'm with you there :D

Maybe one day I can be where both of you are:cool:
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Chris, I was about to say "Oh don't bother, I haven't gotten a hair splitting edge on all my knives either" but then started thinking about which ones that might be. I ended that reverie with a memory of whittling a hair off my Fiskar's hatchet...OK, but some of my kitchen knives have never split a hair, and I don't normally maintain any of my tools at a whittling edge. Tree-topping is about the most, but more important they be catchy and functionally sharp.

The most important test is how well it does what I actually need it to do - I am not a barber or beautician, and shave with a cheap disposable most of the time...
 
me, with zdp. but a lot of that is resting between grits. so my eyes and hands are fresh for each new grit.
 
I think the longest ive spent on a knife was 5 1/2 hours.

Reprofile with all 4 Atomas
Sharpen with all the Shaptons
Strop with Several different Nanocloth Strops

On a hollow ground Paradox , during the reprofiled I knocked the angle down by 1/2 , even now months later its still easily whittling hairs both ways. To do something like that right takes a lot of work , you need some overlap when you come off the atomas and go to the waterstones otherwise the diamond scratches are a PITA to remove , and then checking your work often so your not raising too big of a burr. Then when it comes time to strop washing the blade and my hands in between every strop to keep them contaminate free. It all adds up , I can do it in significantly less time now.
 
I remember when I used to spend absurd time sharpening. Now I do everything but reprofiles on a 1k Chosera freehand. Sometimes I use a 220 or 320 SiC. I'm all about speed now. Cleanly slicing TP or shaving arm hair in one pass and I'm good to go. I guess I've lost my "edge". Yuck. Now I just want a toothy working edge or better.
 
TriviaMonster said:
I remember when I used to spend absurd time sharpening. Now I do everything but reprofiles on a 1k Chosera freehand. Sometimes I use a 220 or 320 SiC. I'm all about speed now. Cleanly slicing TP or shaving arm hair in one pass and I'm good to go. I guess I've lost my "edge". Yuck. Now I just want a toothy working edge or better.
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Yeah, me too...but it's that "or better" that gets me in trouble sometimes. ;)
 
My wife's knives are not touched until she says they need sharpening. When I get to them I can tell usually they have passed my 'sharp' criteria for a while.

My own knives get the 'obsessive' treatment. I guess I'm beyond help :).

Omar, I'm totally not there, because I know my knives usually are considered 'sharp' by non knife nuts, but I keep wanting it 'better'. I'm yet can let go the desire ;). On the hair splitting market, can't tell you how it is as it's mostly bragging rights :p

Martin, I shave with my knives, including the huge 52100 SU Bluntcut sent me. So my excuse is to reduce disposable use (environment friendly). The WB is very helpful here (3 layers, with autosol) :cool:

Lance, the longest I spent was couple of days, few hours each when reprofiling my Navy K631 and it was still not there ;)
 
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Lance. I have (at least for now), attempted to manage my OCD. I have my "working knives", which are any combination of freehand C/F DMT's, or Diamond/Brown stones, on my SM. These knives will cut anything there is like hell, and hold and edge, and better yet, are easy to touch up.

I now also have gotten into the sickness, of "look at this shiny mofo". Yes, my polished edges are gorgeous, and cut like a straight razor. But I have had to make it enough is enough, so to speak, and limit this to a few blades.

Aaaaaaand now I am looking at a Edge Pro. I am more than sure, my sickness is about to get epic.
 
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