One Multitool, or one Rescue Knife and one MT? Skeletool CX, E55B, Charge, Funxion...

[Nap]

Well, if the oxide can at least reduce rust, I am on it.
What I have read about black hands is only at first use and can be prevented by washing it with soap first.

Not to come back just to contradict you more, but the polished stainless versions are supposed to be much better with rust than the black oxide—the latter sacrificing the rust resistance for covertness, and meant for members of the military and people who dig "tacticool." As with any tool, though, just keep an eye out for rust and take care of it accordingly.

I have now to find a Surge with Nylon Sheat. In Germany most sellers sell all LM MT with Leder Sheat.
I hate it.

I'm not sure exactly what the forum rules are on this, but Knives and Tools has it in stock on their German site with the nylon sheath. The Surge is a good tool, and I'm pretty sure you'll be happy with it.

 

[Sir Joe]

Yes but they are expensive.
I bought it elsewhere.
I am anxious to receive it!!!
All black, also the clip and the bit extender!
I'll wait to see which Sheath comes, and if I do not like it the German distributor told me they will change it for free

 

[Gima Nord]

I am a gardener. And I have already too many things hanging from my belt. I am trying to find tools which I can use for more than one purpose. A rescue knife I can use it for many things. A cutter, for less things. Besides, Cutters do not last long in my job, they get full of ground, get rust, get stuck.
I do not like Victorinox Rescue
Actually I do not like Victorinox at all, but this comes from my experience with they red tools which many years ago had no locking system and I have cut my fingers badly in many occasions with blades which were closing while using them. And, I do not like the look of their tools, and the usability (dirty wet hands or gloves, with those "heavy metal guitarist's fingernails" kind of opening system... No, thanks).

Well maybe you should watch the video posted. The Vicorinox rescue tool is made to open with heavy rescue gloves. A big Spyderco style hole and has a strong liner lock. It is not a toy but a real purpose built tool for professional use. Very strong built and can saw glass.
It is ideal to keep in the console of the car and then you can focus on EDC tools on the Multitool you use everyday and hope you never need to use your rescue tool. But it's better built than you can imagine.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zApUSw0xsRY

 

[Sir Joe]

Thanks, I did not know that.
Well, I generally do not have gloves when I drive the car
Jokes apart, I kind of abandoned the idea of rescue tools for now.
The fact of using gloves was anyway during my job as gardener, where I need a MT but not a rescue tool (or I hope so).
And the Swisstool is DEFINITELY NOT gloves friendly.

Anyway, why should anybody want to saw a glass if with a carbide glass breaker you can easily break it?

 

[Gima Nord]

Thanks, I did not know that.
Well, I generally do not have gloves when I drive the car
Jokes apart, I kind of abandoned the idea of rescue tools for now.
The fact of using gloves was anyway during my job as gardener, where I need a MT but not a rescue tool (or I hope so).
And the Swisstool is DEFINITELY NOT gloves friendly.

Anyway, why should anybody want to saw a glass if with a carbide glass breaker you can easily break it?

You should put on gloves to rescue someone in another vehicle if you happen to arrive at or are involved in an accident to protect your hands.
Everone should have a rescue tool in the cars' glove compartment or console. You never know when you will be the first responder. The glass saw is useful to take out a whole windscreen on a car with a glued on screen (most cars). It's not enough to puncture the glass. You would need to hit it a lot of times and kick glass into the car or dig out piece by piece. Watch the video and youll understand about the wind screen.

 

[comis]

Thanks, I did not know that.
Well, I generally do not have gloves when I drive the car
Jokes apart, I kind of abandoned the idea of rescue tools for now.
The fact of using gloves was anyway during my job as gardener, where I need a MT but not a rescue tool (or I hope so).
And the Swisstool is DEFINITELY NOT gloves friendly.

Anyway, why should anybody want to saw a glass if with a carbide glass breaker you can easily break it?

The front windshield and side window is usually constructed differently. The front windshield will not shatter like the side window, in case of shattered glass flying towards passengers. So regular carbide window breaker may make a hole in it, but you will still need to enlarge the opening to get out from the front. One of the reason why Vic rescue tool has a large saw to cut thru glass.

The reason to saw glass is because more cars nowadays are equipped laminated glass(even for side windows), which will not shatter, and to get out you will may need to either kick it out or saw thru it. From a rescuer prospective, it is probably safer to saw thru it, since you won't want to kick the window into the passenger.

 

[Sir Joe]

Thanks, this was informative, I sincerely had no idea (I do not even own a car, never did, and do not understand much of cars. No I do not play with Barbie, I just am not interested in cars and motors that much But I like Audi eventually!)

The video is funny.

@Nap: I have reread your last post and got scared about my coming soon Black Oxide Surge rusting. I was about to write to stop the order (not yet shipped) and switch to Polished.
I have then researched a bit and found no evidence that the Black Oxide would rust more easier.
But I have understood following things:
1) high polished steel rust less
2) bead blasting can rust more

I suppose this means that the high polishing makes the metal less porous, no way for the rust to get it. A bit like plants, some fertilizers (like K and Mg) make their cells harder and can help preventing Fungi to get in.

So I am also supposing that in order to apply the Black Oxide finishing, the tool must not be high polished (after all, the black oxide is a form of controlled rust, so to say).
I think that till the black oxide is there, and supposing is well made and uniform, no rust will appear. But when the black oxide will wear out it will leave NOT POLISHED spots of metal free.
It is possible that those parts rust, because they are less polished (if at all) than the polished version.

I would like to know what are you guys your though about this.

I anyway understand that a good care and maintenance will prevent rust.
Which oil or other product do you use to prevent rust?
I understand that WD40 is not that good at that?

Cheers

 

[Nap]

What you wrote about the black oxide coating is indeed my understanding, and while it makes sense to me, I don't have any scientific data to back it up, and I don't think it's something to worry about. In fact, I now have a black oxide Surge of my own on its way.

I most certainly did not mean to dissuade you from buying the black version, so I apologize for giving you that impression. What I was trying to point out is that, like so many other factors you agonize about in both this thread and in the one you started for your knife choice, it's such a minor issue that one is just as good as the other—and, if there's any difference, it's sometimes the opposite of what you think.

The biggest part of keeping your tool free of rust, of course, is to make sure it stays clean and dry as much as possible. You can periodically wipe it down with light oil, but don't overdo it and be careful to wipe off any excess. Excess oil will collect dirt, which turns to grime, and then you have to de-gunk the whole mess. Also, black oxide Leatherman tools apparently come with a pretty good coating of black oxide residue out of the box, so I'd wipe that off (just the excess, so "until it stops coming off in your hands") before anything else.

There are tons of lubricants out there, and this is one you can feel free to research obsessively. WD40 is not a lubricant, however—it's a solvent and de-greaser, which makes it great for jobs like the grimy mess I talked about in the last paragraph, but it's not what you leave on your tool to prevent rust and keep things moving smoothly. I use a thin general-purpose lubricant for this, but opinions vary and it's a frequent issue of debate.

 

[Sir Joe]

What WD40 is not a lubricant, however—it's a solvent and de-greaser, which makes it great for jobs like the grimy mess I talked about in the last paragraph, but it's not what you leave on your tool to prevent rust and keep things moving smoothly. I use a thin general-purpose lubricant for this, but opinions vary and it's a frequent issue of debate.

Hmmm. I did not know that. I have always thought that WD40 was a lubricant too, besides being a "deblocker" able to free things which are stuck.
I will (not too obsessively, because I am getting tired) search for some real lubricant then.

 

[Sir Joe]

Just ordered the Sanrenmu 6050.
VERY nice little thing.