One step up the heat treat ladder..

C

cgdavid

Joined
Sep 12, 2005
Messages
85
I've been using a forge to heat treat O-1 with good success but I'd like to step up to a controlled furnace. My question is not about O-1 but about D2. Currently, I send all my 'complex' steels to Paul Bros and am completely happy with the result. But with my own furnace, I'm thinking I could treat my own D2 (and other steels) blades. Can anyone give me or point me to a set of steps for D2? I'm looking for an easy answer for my first try at complex steel.

(Search didn't turn up what I was looking for)

THanks all....Curt
 
i have also been thinking about buying an oven so that i could heat treat the air hardening steels. my only problem is that the oven i have in mind is about $1500...a little more than i can afford right now :rolleyes:

but when i get the dough i am thinking about this one in particular:
http://www.knifekits.com/vcom/product_info.php?cPath=49_172_173&products_id=945

i would love being able to go from start to finish on a knife in one day or one afternoon, instead of waiting several weeks or months until i have a large amount of blades ready to go out and then sending them and waiting two to three weeks to get them back.

my experiences with paul bos so far have been great, but i would love to be able to do it myself...someday soon hopefully.
 
Go to www.crucibleservice.com to get the basic HT steps for those steels. By far the most convenient is to wrap in foil ,austenitize, then plate quench with blade still in the foil. 3/4" to 1" aluminum plates work well for this. Cryo is optional. These complex steel rquire carefull attention to times and temperatures. A good temperature controlled furnace is needed. D2, CPM D2, 154CM, CPM154, ATS-34, 440C are all excellent blade steels and are HT'd in similar ways. For steels such as 154CM the suggested 1000 F temper is not needed , 400 F will work well.
 
Thanks Mete

That's what I'm looking for. But it complicates things at the same time. S30,60,90v look interesting now. Have you tried them? How about 154CM for kitchen knives? (see what I mean )
 
Curt,

If you haven't purchased one yet, we should get together. I'm currently using a paragon and you'd would be more than welcome to come down and try it out. I live in Diller Ne. Just south on west of Lincoln.

Dave
 
CPM154 is hard to beat as it has been used successfully for folders, fixed blade, fileting knives ,kitchen knives ..
 
cgdavid - how are you heat treating O1 in your forge? What is your method? Just wondering as I have tried the same, but have not gotten reliable results. I like working with O1, but need a reliable method to heat treat it myself in the forge. Thanks!
 
On your HT of D2 which I got from members here and it is also in spec sheets. I make a Stainless steel envelope with double folds for seals and squeeze those tight with pliers. I quit putting a piece of paper inside to burn up the last of the oxygen and they come out cleaner than with the paper. I heat them in my oven to 1850f and let them set for a good 30 minutes or longer at temp. I have 2 pieces of 2 aluminum about 12x12x1" (actually they are both 2 pieces of 1/2" bolted together to make them a 1" thick) I lay one of these on my anvil near the oven and have the second handy, I also have 2 pairs of the big welders vise grips, with the box type jaws, I have those adjusted so that when the foil packet is between the 2 plates they will squeeze everything tight (adjust before it goes in oven). When the time is up I remove the packet with tongs lay it on the bottom plate and then place the top plate and pick up the vise grips and clamp them over the plates where the ends of the knife are. Wait about a minute then I have a pair of heavy scissors ready and open the plates, cut the end off the envelope and slide out the blade. I wear welders gloves and can tweak the blade straight by hand or lay it on the aluminum on the anvil and tap with a brass hammer to make sure it is straight. Then I lay it between another set of plates and get ready to do the next packet. I try to do 5 at a time. The others are in the oven and as the door was only open a bit loss little temp and are back at 1850. On the straightening part I did a 15 inch D2 chopper (yea I know, but its mine) and it came out of the oven real crooked because it was so big it fell over. I clamped it, opened and flexed by hand then tapped as described and now have it to 400 grit and it is dead straight. Then when they are all cool I have a galvanized bucked wrapped in fiberglass insulation that I lay the blades in then cover with acetone and drop in about 4-5# of dry ice from the grocery store. It fizzes and smokes and I cover it with another piece of insulation and go screw off for a couple hours. Then I take the blades out with tongs. INSTANT FROSTBITE to touch them or acetone. Allow to warm to room temp and then into oven for 2 hours at 400-450, cool and then another 2 hours at 400-450f. They will take an edge and I have laid a 16 penny nail on a piece of aluminum and then set a shaving sharp edge on the nail and hammered on the spine to cut the nail in half. I have done this with a quite a few of my blades and the worst I have had happen is a tiny chip you need magnification to see. This might change with a very thin edge. These are not pry bars. I made my own oven for a couple hundred bucks. Jim
 
Big Smitty...I'll start with you...

My forge is nothing special. I got my burner parts and liner from Ellis. When heat treating, I put a length of 2X3 retangle tubing (with a couple stablizer legs welded to the side) in my forge then bring it up to heat. The tube makes the heat a lot more even. I use a temperature probe to monitor the temps. I vary my temps by sliding the soft fire bricks I use for a door back-and-forth to keep in/let out some heat. I can usually get a real steady 1450-1500 deg doing this. It takes a while to get things stable so I use a bit more propane than usual. Anyway, once the temps are stable, I mark where the bricks are setting, slide one aside and put my blade inside the rectangle tube, let things come back up to temp and start timing a 15 minute soak. Once the soak is done, into 130 deg. tough-quench, knock off any remaining satanite and into a 400deg toaster oven (with a bunch of fire bricks in it to even out temp swings of your typical toaster oven) for a couple hours.

(I recently moved and it looks like something got dropped on my forge. The liner is busted to he!! and about half of the bricks I use for the door are broken so now is a good time for the furnace)

Mete

I may have to try CMP154 cm first. Seems like a lot of the blades I make these days are for the kitchen and most want stainless. CPM154 really opens up possibilities.

dsloan

I'd really like to see what you have. I'm in a little bit of chaos at the moment (new job, new house, divorce) so I might not be able to drive down right away. If you would, send me your email and/or phone cgdavid@yahoo.com and we can get together after I get things settled. Thanks...
 
That's a procedure I can handle Thanks a lot!

Now I really need to get that furnace and start looking for a couple quench plates, stainless foil etc etc
 
PS, I save the acetone in a plastic gas can marked as Acetone. I reuse it. I think all the CO2 from the dry ice evaporates off anyway. I believe the acetone is just a medium to keep the temp even everywhere as opposed to just hunks of dry ice. I tried rubbing alcohol and it froze solid. lol.
 
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