OOW hawk

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spikebot587

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Feb 8, 2013
Messages
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RMJ similaritys aside, what do you guys think?
Personally, I really like the looks of this hawk, and I'm really curious about what the price is gong to be
 
It's hard to judge something when it's such an blatant ripoff, I sure do love the original tho.
 
Only thing I can turn up on Google is a blog that won't let me view it. Anyone got pics?
 
I'm not trying to start an argument with this thread.. Yes there are some similarities but there are also differences. The original RMJ it's self has some similarities with other hawks. They took a good design and did what they thought would make it better, just like many people do in the knife industry.
 
spikebot587 said:
I'm not trying to start an argument with this thread.. Yes there are some similarities but there are also differences. The original RMJ it's self has some similarities with other hawks. They took a good design and did what they thought would make it better, just like many people do in the knife industry.
Click to expand...

I read a post somewhere recently, but I can't find it and can't remember where it was. In it, someone from RMJ wrote that OOW asked to be sent an RMJ hawk for free in order to "test" it. They declined, and shortly thereafter this was announced. Seems fishy to me. Maybe someone else can find it, because I have searched here, google and facebook with no results.

Show me one tomahawk that predates the RMJ that looks that similar.
 
scouter27 said:
I read a post somewhere recently, but I can't find it and can't remember where it was. In it, someone from RMJ wrote that OOW asked to be sent an RMJ hawk for free in order to "test" it. They declined, and shortly thereafter this was announced. Seems fishy to me. Maybe someone else can find it, because I have searched here, google and facebook with no results.

Show me one tomahawk that predates the RMJ that looks that similar.
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That was what RMJ claimed, yes, what OOW, had a different story is. Which one you want to believe is up to you but personally I'm siding with OOW. and the tomahawk is not a new idea, RMJ had original ideas, yes but they've also taken inspiration from other designs like most designers do.
http://blog.ohioordnanceworks.com/12/o-o-w-s-big-hairy-tomahawk-adventure/
 
That's a dead link. 404 Not Found.

Of course they had a different story. If you had stolen someone's idea, wouldn't you? No one said the tomahawk was a new idea. To suggest that the OOW is not a direct copy with a slight profile alteration, to the RMJ Talon is laughable.

Ryan Johnson has proven time and again to be a standup businessman. He and his company have earned my respect and many others. His reputation is well established, and lying to defame an upstart is not what we have seen from him in the past. Why would he start now, since you are saying he is?
 
scouter27 said:
That's a dead link. 404 Not Found.

Of course they had a different story. If you had stolen someone's idea, wouldn't you? No one said the tomahawk was a new idea. To suggest that the OOW is not a direct copy with a slight profile alteration, to the RMJ Talon is laughable.

Ryan Johnson has proven time and again to be a standup businessman. He and his company have earned my respect and many others. His reputation is well established, and lying to defame an upstart is not what we have seen from him in the past. Why would he start now, since you are saying he is?
Click to expand...

I'm not calling anybody a liar, I'm just choosing to believe a different side of the argument. I don't believe it is a direct copy, yes they did take a lot of the same elements, but what designer has at one point or another? Look at the knife industry, there are hundreds of knife designs that look extremely similar, and nobody cares, so why does this matter?

And again, I'm not looking for an argument, I'm just trying to get opinions on the hawk its self
 
Because it's not a similar look. It's a blatant copying of a design, and tossing a little cut out behind the bit to make it "original". The only other difference I can pick out is that the OOW version looks a little less refined, and angular in terms of the grind lines, which only points to laziness and/or cost cutting.

I am looking at both. I will not post it, but you can see the it on the ohio ordnance instagram site.

You didn't say the word liar, but you did state that you choose to not believe the statement of Ryan Johnson, which means to a reasonable person that it's a lie, and he is a liar.

To clarify, I don't care that he's doing it. I do not believe for one second that it will hurt RMJ Tactical's business. I just don't appreciate that people deny the link.
 
As far as I know RMJ was the first with that shape of spike and that beard geometry. They did not take ideas they stole e design and threw a lazy handle on it, instead of doing the work researching and testing they took an already proven design and slapped there logo on it. It's lazy and it's wrong.
 
Its a blatant copy, RMJ will not lose anything on this.
Off topic but my Dept is purchasing 10 Shrike s13s!!
 
So did they at least bother to use a different steel just to differentiate themselves? Probably not because they are in the gun biz and 4140 is a very common material in that industry and good for that application from all we have seen. If'n you're gonna swipe an existing design, while bother to go to the expense of reinventing stuff, right? LOL Realistically, it was only a matter of time before someone copied a popular design like the RMJ. Happens all the time in the cutlery biz. How many Loveless style knives have been made over the last few decades? Not addressing the issue of whether it is right or wrong and at what point it becomes okay. Just saying that it happens. Obviously, there are same makers that have history of defending their intellectual property and some that go above and beyond and try to say they invented everything and you guys stole it. I personally know of one incident about 17 or 18 years ago where a knife maker was contracted by a production designer to build a "movie prop" knife for what could generously be described as a B movie. He then started marketing the knife in at least one magazine without the designers permission and with no attempt to compensate him. Harsh letters were sent and the maker stopped producing the knife as far as I know. I will not mention the makers name even though he died a little while back, but my understanding was that he had "pushed the envelope" as far as copying features of others folks stuff in the past. In this instance, he made no changes whatsoever and even used the prop designer's "working name" of the design in his ads which was a variation on the title of the movie. My rather longwinded point being that it will be interesting to see how Mr, Johnson chooses to handle this. Unless the actual design and tis unique features like the "i beam" handle have been properly protected/registered, it would probably be a complicated and expensive process to go after OOW under some kind of "trade dress" theory. Once again, that does not make it right, just not easy to do anything about it. As we know, a lot of complaints and moral outrage might go out the window if OOW brings this thing to market for say $100 less. I have said for years that righteous indignation and a buck will get you a cup of coffee at McDonalds, but they still expect the you to give them the dollar. ;)
Also, the link above is dead, but there are some comments from OOW about the hawk. I did not see the comments about it on the RMJ blog. Any link to those?
 
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Police or fire department and what does your department see them primarily being used for?
WJC01 said:
Its a blatant copy, RMJ will not lose anything on this.
Off topic but my Dept is purchasing 10 Shrike s13s!!
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Its a blatant RMJ with a little finger groove cut in it (which I actually don't mind) That said, the RMJ crew aren't particularly happy about it on their facebook page, especially when OOH tagged RMJ in that pic.
 
Is this what we're talking about?
kUMTaCE.jpg
 
If it is, then the bevels on the cutting side look a fair bit different than the similar RMJ. The spike and the relief cutaways on the handle, however, not so.
Liberatus1 said:
Is this what we're talking about?
kUMTaCE.jpg
Click to expand...
 
Well, to be fair, Mr. Johnson has apparently said on more than one occasion that his design are inspired by time tested traditional hawk patterns so take that for what it is worth. I think the question becomes how close can you get before riffing/inpiration becomes outright theft of intellectual property? There may be a degree of shadiness in this situation that you may not see in other ones.
scouter27 said:
I read a post somewhere recently, but I can't find it and can't remember where it was. In it, someone from RMJ wrote that OOW asked to be sent an RMJ hawk for free in order to "test" it. They declined, and shortly thereafter this was announced. Seems fishy to me. Maybe someone else can find it, because I have searched here, google and facebook with no results.

Show me one tomahawk that predates the RMJ that looks that similar.
Click to expand...
 
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