Opinion: The problem with most Chinese brands

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Etna

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Just wanted to get this off my chest, so I'm not exactly expecting anybody to respond (or even care).

We all know that the Chinese can make high quality knives at low prices across all levels. From the premium brands like WE, Kizer and Reate down to the budget brands like SanRenMu, Enlan and Harnds. As an example, iIt's very common to see a SanRenMu or Enlan using the same 8cr13MoV steel as the outsourced American brands selling for close to 1/5 of the American brand's price but having the same level of quality and finish.

And yet, after collecting large amounts of Chinese knives for about four years, I think I'm done with them for good this time. Simply because of one problem i think is characteristic of Chinese brands; they don't know when to stop.

Just about every Chinese brand has a huge catalog that changes multiple times a year. New designs and variants of existing designs are introduced so often that it becomes impossible to track the new stuff (or the stuff that gets quietly discontinued). And the funny thing about choice is that when there's way too much to choose from, even premium stuff starts to appear mundane and 'dead', like a body without a soul. Which IMO is what has happened to Chinese knives; they have dropped from being high quality, low-cost tools to high quality, low-cost 'stuff' with no distinct identity or uniqueness anymore. They just don't 'call out' to me anymore.

Even that cheap Taylor Schrade I bought last year still has some form of 'identity' and uniqueness, if you will, compared to the Real Steel knives I currently own. Maybe it's time the production knife companies start to look at putting some kind of cap on the number of new models they introduce each year? Less is sometimes more, and I don't think knife companies need to introduce that many new entries every year just to keep prices below the US$50 range.
 
The issue you are speaking of is not just with knife manufacturers and china. The issue is related to business and is widespread. Most of the problem centers around trying to give customers more and more choices. Sellers are basically trying to find and offer the buyer the deciding point that will make them buy the product.
Take a look at a item like toothpaste. It wasn't that many years ago that if you needed a tube of toothpaste, you had 2 choices. Colgate or Crest.
Now you have 10-20 different kinds of Crest alone. Paste. Gel. Whitening. Flouride. Sensitive. Striped. Acid protection. Anti-gingivitis. And then you get the combinations, specially tailored depending on your exact needs. Older, Smoker, Kid, Young adult, the list goes on and on. All of it basically tailored to fool the customer into believing they are selecting exactly what they need, the perfect solution, just for them.
All of which leads to the next inevitability, discontinue the ones that don't sell, and try to come out with something that will. The emphasis becomes flooding the market with choices, instead of meeting the direct need. Manufacturers are essentially playing lotto, putting out a ton of choices, hoping that enough will click with the market and allow them to make profits. On the one hand, it is better to place a lot of small bets hoping to get winners rather than betting the farm on 1-2 products and dying if the big bets don't pay off.
Used to be a company called Iomega (remember zip drives?) that made data storage devices and media in the 90's and PC tech boom. Their CEO bet the farm on one technology, guessed wrong, and the company went out of business in 6 months.
 
It isn’t necessarily just the Chinese doing this, but I do agree that they go to the extremes. All manufacturing companies are trying to innovate to keep up with the competition. It can be seen in cutlery, firearm, tool, automobile, etc manufacturers. If a cutlery company can pump out bigger and better deals for their consumers in a desperate attempt to outdo the competition, then that is good for all of us.
 
I can see where you are coming from. All of the Chinese brands that I am familiar don't have a "Sebenza" so to speak (a time tested icon with a history behind it). I completely agree that the individual knives have no identity, no story. Just cold, but excellently machined pieces of high end metal.

Like, what is a WE 601? Generic, boring, uninspiring name, no story behind the knife. However, it is undoubtedly excellently manufactured, and has good aesthetics.

I guess it depends on what the consumer wants. If you want something that is excellently manufactured alone, there is nothing wrong with Chinese high end knives. If you want something with a story, a history, as well as great manufacturing, you'd get something like Spyderco. That spydie super hole is ugly, but the development behind it is innovation, and it works damn well, which is very respectable.

PS: I checked the WE Knives "ABOUT US" page, they don't really have a history of anything truly innovative (game changing level, like the RIL or the super Spydie hole). They advertise based off of pure CNC machining prowess, for better or for worse depending on the buyer. Also, the origin for the company name gave me a chuckle; they came up with this name simply because it was easy to remember compared to their last name (Wayeahknife LOL).

Link to their about us page: http://www.weknife.com/plus/list.php?tid=1

(If this link violates ToS lemme know and I'll remove it, pretty sure its cool since they aren't a dealer directly)
 
It seems like We and Kizer flood the market with so many designs so fast that some of those models get lost in the shuffle. A lot of the designs become yesterdays news so fast they become forgotten. Also seems because of this, ive seen end of the year sales on these knives at over half off just to move some of them. The prices eventually crash it seems.If theres a model you like,you can be patient and get it at a bargain price. Example;the Stedemon deep sea monster was 265.00,it was on closeout in December for 99.00 shipped. that's a steal.Buyers at 265 probably kicked themselves seeing it....
 
Saturated market. Companies competing for the interest of the consumer.
 
goldie said:
It seems like We and Kizer flood the market with so many designs so fast that some of those models get lost in the shuffle. A lot of the designs become yesterdays news so fast they become forgotten. Also seems because of this, ive seen end of the year sales on these knives at over half off just to move some of them. The prices eventually crash it seems.If theres a model you like,you can be patient and get it at a bargain price. Example;the Stedemon deep sea monster was 265.00,it was on closeout in December for 99.00 shipped. that's a steal.Buyers at 265 probably kicked themselves seeing it....
Click to expand...

I see this as a real potential problem for these companies. They will be known for doing this and buyers will simply wait until the prices drop 50% before buying. All but the "Gotta have it now" or "I gotta get it before they're all sold out" buyers. But so many of their designs are only slightly different that people won't worry about "missing out".
 
The problem with consumers is that most have no idea what they want.
Yeah, everyone thinks that they want nothing but the best available.
But, here's the problem with "best".
Just who or how that something gains or deserves such a reputation
Is a matter of debate.
Most products in the free world are given a spin to help it on its way to popularity.
It's created through a media spin.
Fast forward the sporting cutlery industry of today,
And we see the PRC in the forefront of mass production.
They have the industrial might but they appear to forego
The act of disseminating product information via the traditional media
In countries they export to.
(The entire world just knows that PRC goods are incredibly low priced...)
Hence the sterile and faceless imports which leaves the consumer cold.
its almost appear as if their idea of global domination is via
A simplistic strategy of simply overwhelming the market.
Branding takes time and money, perhaps the old capitalistic ways
Of doing business have yet to appeal to their senses.
Meanwhile, we are dumbfounded by the sheer size of choice
As much as they are counting on a rather sadly misinformed expectation
Of the free world's legendary unlimited spending power for cheap goods...
 
I do not see it as a problem. It is a blessing to us customers so that we have tons of choices and at hugely discounted prices.

For those claiming Chinese made knives have HT problems, could you back it up with some evidence? That is a big brush.
 
GIRLYmann said:
Hence the sterile and faceless imports which leaves the consumer cold.
Click to expand...
Reate-K-1-marble-cf-ti-damasteel-BHQ-74965-er.jpg


This is neither sterile...nor faceless...and definitely not cheap. I understand your point but there's an entire family of Chinese knives that have been so "excellent" and innovative, they've priced themselves out of my comfortable buying range.

More and more US designers are reaching out to these Chinese knife makers to manufacture their designs. I agree that it seems like these knives come too fast to keep up with. I also agree that far too many come to market with only a number to designate them (e.g. Ki4203A3)...very un-sexy. But, in the long term, I think these knives are reshaping the industry as we know it. They're changing the way knives are made and marketed. The rest of the knife world will have to adapt to keep up.
 
I do like the execution, but as I said in a previous post, they are soulless, have no history, no meta. I am not interested by knives that does not have an history, whether it's the maker's or the knife's.
 
Choices? In my business, if I give too many choices, the job doesn't happen or I spend all my time explaining what all the choices mean and their impact on the job. Generally speaking, I provide one choice and sometimes two choices or options. So, relative to knives, I think fewer choices would increase the manufacturing efficiency, increase manufacturer's net, and still provide the customer with a good product.

As far as the Chinese overwhelming the market...... I don't see it (yet), because you have to be shopping with some knowledge or background before making a buy selection to even be aware of all the Chinese made choices. Even with the big river site, they limit the choices unless you really want to make an effort. My guess is that people will look at one physical page on their computer and make the choice. The problem at the big river site are clones.

The knife dealers should learn something from the big river site.... you click on a certain knife, it comes up, but what if 5 other ones are listed. Basically the selection would take two physical "clicks" or page openings to get to the details on a specific knife.

Most people just want a "good knife" priced as cheaply as possible and the Chinese knives fulfill that niche if you know how to search. Forget about warranties for the most part.

I do think the knife market is saturated now between the many manufacturers and handmade folks. So, what happens? Brand identification.... "I had a Buck that I liked 10 years ago, and I'm going to buy a Buck." Spyderco, ZT, Benchmade, Case... same deal.
 
LOL.

At this price point, these are tools not soul mates.

Every consumer appreciates quality, choice, and value. Country of origin is irrelevant under $400 IMO. In this price range, the higher end overseas manufactures are doing amazing work - Russia, Germany, and Italy included.

I have no issue spending $350 on a Reate or Rike. No problem spending $150 on a Kizer rather than a Boker Plus.

Collectors - now that's a different animal. If I'm spending $1000 on a knife it's not to open Amazon boxes. That's when the "my precious" factor kicks in.
 
Sounds a little like the Kershaw brand too.
I pretty much ignore a lot of brands that everyone is speaking of.
 
Hackenslash said:
This is neither sterile...nor faceless...
Click to expand...
Not sterile, no -- rather lovely, in fact -- but pretty faceless. I had to squint at my my computer screen to read "Reate." :) Though it occurs to me that establishing a clear brand identity, while definitely an issue for Chinese knifemakers, would be an issue for any new production outfit. Getting some "soul" from the Reate's of the world is probably just a matter of time.
 
Soul of a knife? :rolleyes: Unless your very Buck 110 is inherited from your grandpa or manufactured in 1963, it could be just like thousands of other Buck 110s that were mass produced a few month ago.
 
SpySmasher said:
Not sterile, no -- rather lovely, in fact -- but pretty faceless. I had to squint at my my computer screen to read "Reate." :) Though it occurs to me that establishing a clear brand identity, while definitely an issue for Chinese knifemakers, would be an issue for any new production outfit. Getting some "soul" from the Reate's of the world is probably just a matter of time.
Click to expand...
Honestly, I think WE has been the best about that and I think they're smart for doing it. They don't make anything I've fallen in love with, but just from my casual browsing I can almost invariably recognize a WE knife at first sight.
 
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