Original vs Modded

Pygmalion

Pygmalion

Joined
Oct 7, 2007
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I am curious about the value of some of the older Busse knives. Does modification affect the value of the older Busse knives, and by how much?Is a knife worth more or less if the finish has been reworked from its original state to, say, satin, or is it unchanged.
Other mods I am curious about are handle changes and edge reprofiling. Any help is appreciated.
 
I would think original would always be worth more, and for the most part increase in value more.

A modded Busse went today with sheath at a VERY good price. I got there a bit late after it was marked down.
Also don't think the factory would gaurantee a knife that has been thinned, swedge add'ed, etc...

That being said I sent a PM today about a mod on an AD. I plan to use it, so I'm not worried about it holding it's price.

edit- just read thread again...the change's you mention should not affect warranty, but think it could value
 
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Pygmalion said:
I am curious about the value of some of the older Busse knives. Does modification affect the value of the older Busse knives, and by how much?Is a knife worth more or less if the finish has been reworked from its original state to, say, satin, or is it unchanged.
Other mods I am curious about are handle changes and edge reprofiling. Any help is appreciated.
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depends entirely on who performed the modification. if it was ban, krein, seigle or some other well known maker whose quality is considered on par with busse's (fit and finish wise, as well as their working conditions (caring for the temper)), then the value is likely to stay roughly the same, or with a very small dip in price.

if you did it yourself, then it will probably go down from 50-200$ - but that depends entirely on how much you want to put it up and how long you want it to sit there. if your willing to potentially wait a while you might sell it for full market value to someone who just wants that model, not as the collectors piece.

it is fair to note in the sale that any large modifications will likely void any breakage in that area of the knife should it break. obviously such a side note will make the sale less likely to happen or happen fast, but I've never felt right letting something like that go unstated.
 
Last Visible Canary said:
depends entirely on who performed the modification. if it was ban, krein, seigle or some other well known maker whose quality is considered on par with busse's (fit and finish wise, as well as their working conditions (caring for the temper)), then the value is likely to stay roughly the same, or with a very small dip in price.

if you did it yourself, then it will probably go down from 50-200$ - but that depends entirely on how much you want to put it up and how long you want it to sit there. if your willing to potentially wait a while you might sell it for full market value to someone who just wants that model, not as the collectors piece.

it is fair to note in the sale that any large modifications will likely void any breakage in that area of the knife should it break. obviously such a side note will make the sale less likely to happen or happen fast, but I've never felt right letting something like that go unstated.
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I agree with most of this but I feel that some mods can really add value to a blade depending on what the mods are and who they were done by. I have an AK heavily modified by Ban and although the warranty is long gone my satisfaction has greatly improved, as has the performance, fit, and finish, of the blade. The mods he made really improved the blades performance and appearance. I would never sell it but if I ever had to I would not sell it for what a factory AK in the exchange currently goes for nor would I sell it for less. I would sell it with the costs of the mods to me in addition to the going rates for standard models because of the improvements in performance and finish. Heck I might even shoot for a profit since the AKs don't come around often and if someone wanted an AK to perform or look like that the cost they would incur keeping the warranty by sending it to the custom shop would be much more than what I paid. Why would I take any less? If they don't want to pay that they can search for a stock model without the custom work. The warranty issue is funny to me. Many people buy a Busse and beat the piss out of it without ever really needing to rely on the warranty. The steel, HT, warranty, all around production are just top quality and that good. That's why we pay so much for a stock model. I don't abuse my blades but I will work them hard sometimes. I have confidence that with good maintenance and proper use my AK will outlive me. I've had different blades of good quality with different warranties and I've never needed to rely on any warranty. If the SHTF a warranty won't save you but a quality blade just might. I'd like to think something like Ban's mods improved the quality of the blade greatly. Just my .02.
 
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I think you might be able to say that mods lower the value if you are talking about someone who stripped off a coating or ground the blade catch off a mojo and didn't do a good job. Also there are some weird mods, like removing a talon hole or changing a grip severely.

All of my modified knives are my favorites, I wouldn't sell them for less than my purchase price and the price of the mods and most of them I wouldn't sell for a lot more than that.

Of course they are the last knives I would want to sell but if I had to sell them and I got ripped off on the price I would be doubly pissed off. First I would be pissed that I was in such dire straits to need to sell them and second that someone was screwing me over because I didn't have time to wait for a better offer.
 
After rereading the original post I think that, in regards to a safe queen older model, you'd definitely get more than the same user modded blade (unless it had platinum handles or something just ridiculously expensive added). In the end it is not up to the seller to determine what the value of the blade is but it is up to the buyer by purchasing it for the asking price, bargaining the price down, or passing on the current BTT.
 
Thanks, guys. All of the input has helped me to better understand the effects of modifications on the value of a knife.
I thought that Murdok72605 made a good point in stating that ultimately, the value of a modded blade is determined by the buyer. As obvious as it may seem, I had not thought about it in that light.
 
I agree with it depends on who modded it, ie..........Gingrich, Hayes, Krein, Siegle, Ban, etc.
 
Murdok72605 said:
I agree with most of this but I feel that some mods can really add value to a blade depending on what the mods are and who they were done by.
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Roger that. I just bought a nice Active Duty for EDC because of the mods. :)

Mike
 
Bravado said:
I agree with it depends on who modded it, ie..........Gingrich, Hayes, Krein, Siegle, Ban, etc.
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I definitely agree, but in time all you will have is a modded Busse, with a story about a guy who made great mods to knives.
You might buy a knife modded by one of the greats, but 20 years down the road, it is very possible that many newer collectors will never have heard of that person. I suppose most of the mod work speaks for itself, the only exception being damage to the heat treatment. Just my opinion.
It also depends on your reason for purchasing the knife in the first place. If you buy a modded knife because the mods make it more suitable for your needs - to me it doesn't matter about the change in value, whether + or -.
I would be concerned about the purchase of a modded knife for a collectible piece, though. Again, just my opinion.
I also think the only time any of this would be an issue is with a high dollar knife (over a couple grand).
 
Ok,

Let's talk about modifications.

We will start with Finishes, a real nice mirror polish tends to increase value regardless of who did the mod, but can add more if done by the factory or by a known knifemaker.

Simple Satin, tends to even out compared to a factory coated in good condition, but adds a little if done by a known knife maker and can add quite a bit to the older knives if done by the factory.

Coating/recoating this seems to be entirely in the eye of the beholder, with the value going up or down depending on the individual point of view, a real crapshoot.

I have seen some great aftermarket coatings that I liked, and a few Factory recoats that I did not care for,

De-horning, this is something many of the Busse knives benefit from, the rounding off of sharp corners, specially where the little finger rides during a full power swing.

A great thing to do to a user and in a non-new condition knife not to be counted off for if done Tastefully.

I got to go now, but I will come back and add to this.
 
I agree with most everything said here. Except for self mods. Before I got smart, I use to remove coatings with fine sand paper by hand, it would take me over 20 hours to do some knives (SHBM's) I still have some of them, except for two, which TonyG has one and Pbubsy has the other. To me those are my most valuable knives because I hand rubbed that finish off, there was no heat involved and thus no possible way to damage that knife. Indeed, reducing the surface grain structure by hand rubbing with fine grit reduces the chances of stress risers and the possibility of corrosion getting into the steel.
 
mjswan said:
Roger that. I just bought a nice Active Duty for EDC because of the mods. :)

Mike
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That's the one I was talking about in early post. When I saw the marked down price I decided to get it, but you beat me to it...no regrets:thumbup:
I think you'll love it!

I'm sending Ban a Tiger AD in the morning.
 
Ken44 said:
That's the one I was talking about in early post. When I saw the marked down price I decided to get it, but you beat me to it...no regrets:thumbup:
I think you'll love it!

I'm sending Ban a Tiger AD in the morning.
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I thought that might be the knife you were talking about, Ken. Sorry about swooping down on the trough like that, but this little pig saw something yummy. :)

I'll be looking forward to seeing how your AD turns out. :cool:

Mike
 
Ok I am back for a few minutes, Let's talk about:

Handle modifications,

There are several pretty common handle mods, and for the most part they lower the value of the knife, sanding the micarta to fit your hand, smoothing to make the handle smaller, removing the factory handles and adding aftermarket, removing factory slotted screws and adding hole type fasteners.

On a few knives the handles have sharp edges thar make the handle uncomfortable to use and need to be De-horned to be much useable, this has a generally positive effect on the sale of the knife and for the most part is tough to notice as a modification.

On a Rare occasion some one will do a really good job of replacing the handles and the value will go up.

Then there are Knife makers that Polish the knife, put a great looking handle on it and the value rises pretty quick.

For the most part, done at home moding the handles hurts the value more than it helps.

More later
 
I am always messing with things. Sometimes, it goes well, sometimes not. They aren't Busses, but my well-used Scrap Yards have received a few mods. I had some extra users that had been stripped, convex edges done on them, or otherwise modded. The knives work well, and look about as good or better than new ones. But I have others in the size range of these that I prefer. I just wanted to get back close to what I had in them to help finance a couple of new Busses I have coming in. So I put three scrappers on the Busse/Swamp Rat/Scrap Yard sale forum today with pictures describing the mods and any imperfections. They all were sold in just a few hours. Maybe it was just beginner's luck.
 
I picked up a user SH-E that I plan to do a thin convex edge and either a very fine satin or mirror finish. This will definitly help the market price because of the rough shape the edge ad the coating are in though. I will have to do a great job to bring it back up to the value of a mint SH-E.

Another mod I like is smoothing and putting a polished finish on micarta. It does lose a little grip but is more comfortable. It suits smaller knives and particularly black micarta and satin finishes very well. A little oil helps to.

I would pay more for a AK done by Ban.

I think so long as the work is first rate it won't matter if the person who did it is still known because it is the quality that will sell the knife.

I doubt that was beginners luck HD. Your sharpening skills are also getting some name recognition. I had to stop checking the exchange as I was starving to death so I missed out.
 
I think it may be that most Scrap Yard knives are bought as intended users. Few are safe queens. Scrappers aren't made for looks as much as they are performance. Busses (most of them) are just plain beautiful and are terrific performers, so I don't know if I would do as well selling my modified Busses. I like them, though. :D I think some Busses are bought by collectors who keep them mint for collecting value and later resale, which is as valid a reason as any to buy one. They are like an investment which never loses value.
 
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Pygmalion said:
I definitely agree, but in time all you will have is a modded Busse, with a story about a guy who made great mods to knives.
You might buy a knife modded by one of the greats, but 20 years down the road, it is very possible that many newer collectors will never have heard of that person. I suppose most of the mod work speaks for itself, the only exception being damage to the heat treatment. Just my opinion.
It also depends on your reason for purchasing the knife in the first place. If you buy a modded knife because the mods make it more suitable for your needs - to me it doesn't matter about the change in value, whether + or -.
I would be concerned about the purchase of a modded knife for a collectible piece, though. Again, just my opinion.
I also think the only time any of this would be an issue is with a high dollar knife (over a couple grand).
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As far as heat treat goes I seriously doubt you'd have a problem with the people I've already mentioned. I've had a few Busse's customized and they all sold for more than what I had into them partially because of the maker who did the work. Now, I consider mods more for use like a more useful grind than what comes stock from Busse.
 
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