OT: What is a "Firearm" ?

Daniel Koster

Daniel Koster

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What is a "firearm" according to the ATF?

I'm just curious.

Just reading in the paper about a certain man who "lost his right to possess firearms". He's a part-time gun-maker...:rolleyes: So does that mean he has lost his job? Or will he just consign himself to making gun parts? :confused:

The world of guns can be so confusing sometimes...I wish I understood it better, but I don't. Excuse my ignorance - especially if I have contradicted myself somehow...:footinmou
 
dip arm in gasoline and light with match = firearm.

haha sorry, I assume its anything that fires a projectile using a small explosion within the weapon. Techinally you can have gun parts laying all over the place, but you dont really have a firearm until they are assembled, certainly cant shoot a gun without all the right peices.
 
Black powder weapons don't count

There are infinite variations in these laws(or rather, in rulings), but as I assume this has some relation to your other thread, black powder pistols/rifles don't count. This is why you can still order them through the mail, and why you can make them for resale without a class 2 manufacturer's license.

Least, i think that's all true. :D
 
just like he said ^^

a weapon that fires a projectile using an explosive or propellent.

There is still debate whether we have the right to own firearms, as the 2nd amendment was for militias back when it was added. But there is still debate about what a militia is. I am all for firearm ownership, and I collect myself. But more and more people are nuetral about the subject, and arent being educated on firearms, so we are losing our "right" more and more. I wouldn't be suprised if we totally lost our right completely in under 100 years. Just my opinion, and I am a 17 year old, so take it as a grain of salt.

DO NOT start arguing on this topic, because I will not reply.
 
Firearm = chemical explosion to propel a projectile.

Airguns, blowguns, etc. don't count as firearms under Fed. laws, but they might under your state laws. Actually, Fed. law explicitly prohibits classifying airguns as firearms, but stome states do it anyway. I'd hate to be the test case on a conflict like that.

Some states consider air pistols to be firearms (MA used to until a few years ago, but no longer does), and NYC bans any type of airgun outright--not just discharging the gun, but the airgun itself. If you buy an airgun in MI you have to have it shipped to a FFL dealer, you can't have it shipped home. I believe you can't have airguns in NJ unless you're going to a show or competition.

Blackpowder and antique guns (made before 1898) don't count. There are "BB" guns propelled by primers. They have about the same power/velocity as an air-powered BB, but since the source is chemical, they are considered firearms.
 
Originally posted by etp777
Black powder weapons don't count

There are infinite variations in these laws(or rather, in rulings), but as I assume this has some relation to your other thread, black powder pistols/rifles don't count. This is why you can still order them through the mail, and why you can make them for resale without a class 2 manufacturer's license.

Least, i think that's all true. :D
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Massachusetts takes a slightly different view. You must have a firearms ID to buy powder and shot, heck I've even had to present it for .177 pellets.

Cheers

GC
 
A firearm is a rifle, shotgun, or handgun that fires smokeless cartridges. It must have a receiver to be considered a firearm. Blackpowder guns do not qualify as firearms (they are deadly weapons), legally speaking. Felons cannot own "firearms", however black powder guns are an exception, unless there is a specific local ordinance to the contrary. I'm sure that there is more, but I am unable to produce any more information off of the top of my head. Hope this helps
 
I thought that just having a reciever can be considered having a firearm? Anybody clarify that?
 
I don't count MA, NJ, NY, CA, or IL in any of my statements on firearms, as they might as well be another country in that respect by their laws, or such is my opinion. That's the primary reason I moved out of IL.

SHoulda clarified that though.
 
Originally posted by Bobwhite
I thought that just having a reciever can be considered having a firearm? Anybody clarify that?
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Thats what i thought, because that part has a Serial number on it, that was the part considered to be a firearm. Thats why some companys can sell you all the parts to build a working garand or other rifle, but you need to supply a reciever.
 
What the registered part is depends on the firearm. For instance,with ARs, it's only the lower receiver. This is why you can get a registered class 3 lower, and then put whatever upper you want on it(from .22LR to .458 Tromix). With FALs the registered portion is the upper receiver. Some weapons though are a bit stranger. If memory serves, for a Browning 1919, the registered portion is the sideplate.
 
That is correct as far as I know.

If you have a box with the raciver of a rifle in it and a box with EVERY other part for that rifle in it what you have is:

A Firearm in the first box and a bunch of rifle parts in the second box.

-John
 
What is technically a firearm and legally a firearm are two very different things. According to the JBTs, a simple part can be a "firearm." In fact, in the 1990s, the socialists in congress wanted to make magazines legally considered "firearms.":rolleyes:
 
I'm pretty sure that you are right (at least where I am from). For instance, here in commie California certain rifle that “look” like they were made for war type use are illegal to own (doesn’t matter if they are semi-auto just like some hunting rifle). But, one can own the upper receiver assembly, i.e. the barrel, hand guard, and even the bolt assembly for the rifles like the AR-15, yet I believe it is considered a felony (which means you go to jail and loose your right to own any guns, ever) to own the lower receiver. I believe (but am less sure on this) you can own the parts that would go into the lower, i.e. trigger assembly, but you just can’t own the “housing” for those parts. Oh yeah, I don't think this has as much to do with the serial number as it does with the actual firing mechanism. For instance, semi-auto pistols have the serial number on both the lower receiver and on the slide, and then again on the chamber (of the barrel) however, one can re-order either a slide or a new barrel without having to register either part or having to re-register the gun as a whole.


Just to clarify the legal issue brought up by an earlier post, the second amendment was not added to the Constitution just for militias, it is an individual right, and therefore a timeless one that should be guaranteed to ALL Americans. My intent is not to pick a fight with Enter, but that kind of misunderstanding of our freedoms is what allows those in power to take advantage of us and strip us of our rights.
 
I don't believe a reciever counts as a firearm, since people successfully sell recievers on ebay, and most of you know ebay's STRICT no firearm policy. Unless they are selling the lower reciever?

I just remember seeing an MP5 reciever going for $5,500 and it didn't get taken down.

Someone correct me please if I'm mistaken.
 
The legal and technical definitions vary so much from jurisdiction to jurisdiction that any blanket definition will be flawed. A gunsmith who is prevented from possessing firearms is screwed. I'm betting that he or she has a domestic violence or drug conviction that contains that proviso. A number of leos wound up disarmed as a similar result and I think there had to be an exemption made for military personnel that may or may not have gone through.

BATF considers the serialized receiver to be a firearm. Then you throw in curios, relics and AOWs just to make it more confusing. Likewise "joining" certain parts can get grey, like putting a flash hider on a preban upper with a postban lower.

MP5s on ebay? Was it some kind of scam or sting? I think I'd run away from that deal and not look back.
 
Here- straight from the Title 18, USC, Ch. 44

A "Firearm" means (A) any weapon (including a starter gun) which will or is designed to or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; (B) The frame or receiver of any such weapon; (C) any firearm muffler or silencer; or (D) any destructive device. The term does not include an antique firearm.
 
Edit- This was a reply to Pendetives post right above mine- but now his post has been edited.

Yes, felons lose the right to own firearms, but you will also lose the right to own firearms if you have a misdemeanor domestic violence conviction.
 
Originally posted by det
Edit- This was a reply to Pendetives post right above mine- but now his post has been edited.
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I decided to wait to get a little more information. The part you responded to was this:

Someone said that felons lose the right to own firearms. I should clarify that I think the article I read stated that he was being charged with 3 misdemeanors, so that probably won't apply to him afterall. I guess if he had been charged with a felony that would make it so that he could not own certain gun parts (listed in earlier posts as "receivers") nor any "firearms" but still be able to own blackpowder, airguns, etc., right?
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