Out of Control

[jackknife]

I have to admit, I look at the news of things like this with a disbeleiving eye. I can only wonder how it all got so perverted.

Going to school in my day, young boys learned a lot by imitating thier elders. It was common, no, expected for a boy to have a small pen knife in his pocket because it was what even the teachers had. It was common for a lady if she had need of a cutting tool, to turn to her male escort, be it her husband, father, boy friend, or even brother, and request the loan of his knife or have him do the cutting. It was just expected of a gentleman. Just as having a handkerchief and a watch was expected. Part of the fabric of everyday life.

In my time in high school, I was a member of the rifle team, and we shot against other high school teams in the area. This meant that we took our .22 rifles to school, and on entering the school went right to the priciples office to check our rifles. In the afternoon for the meet, we checked them back out and under the guidence of Mr. Bricker, the coach of the team, we got in the bus and went to the shoot. I guess times have really changed. It makes me feel old to see what we had such a great time with, demonized so much.

Our shop teacher, Mr. Stiers, considered a young man to be unprepared if he did not have a pocket knife to shave off the rough edge of a saw cut piece of wood on a project, or sharpen one of those fat carpenter penicils that wouldn't fit in a conventional wall mounted crank sharpener.

The only anti-knife behavior I ever ran into in public school, was the wicked witch of Glen Haven Elementry school, also known as a certain Mrs. Jacobs. Although not really out and out against school rules, she had a habit of conficating any pocket knife she made visual contact with. This eventually called for a resistance movement and strong action on our part. But that was the only incident I can recall where a knife was a demonized item.

I try to teach these young scouts I'm sort of a consulting advisor to, the advantages of having certain things on you for the sake of self reliance, not just in emergencys, but everyday life.

I'm very glad I'm not a young person struggling to find myself in this mixed up world.

 

[338375]

It really is sad how things have changed, but we already know that.

I remember carrying a slipjoint when I was in school, it was not a big issue. Even at a young age, we would go out for recess and sit around and admire each others knives, even though non of us had any idea at that time what the real differences were. On a good day we would find a few twigs to whittle on. Life was so much simpler back then...

Heck in grade school I got to take my 22 pistol for show and tell. It had to stay in the office until it was time to take it to class, then I went and got it and kept in class until class was over. Then it went back to the office...

Good on you Blues for sending the letter. I have been following this on the talk shows for the last few days and had great intentions of doing the same. I have to be honest though, I dropped the ball on doing it....

My 13 year old son loves knives, camping, hunting and fishing. He has a decent little collection, but his favorite is still the yeller peanut that was won in the give away from Stockman242 some time back..

He likes to carry it with him, but knows that school is not the place to take one.

Gus, were you in school before pencil sharpeners

 

[TwoDogs]

We'll keep it here as long as we don't sally forth too far afield. Otherwise it may end up in one of the sub-forums set up for this sort of discussion.

I carried a pocket knife all through my schooling and I think it was only taken away from me once by Mrs. Bernhardt in 5th grade. It was returned at the end of the day with an admonishment not to open it during class. (I don't recall my reason for having done so.)

Thanks for leaving it here, we'll behave.

You were probably doing something terrorist related (at the age of 10) like sharpening a pencil, or something extremely dangerous like cutting the old chewing gum from underneath the desk.

 

[Blues]

Here's a quote I think you guys will enjoy from the book On Your Own In The Wilderness by Colonel Townsend Whelen and Bradford Angier (1958):

The most indispensable tool for a hunter or fisherman or camper, and in fact for any outdoor man and boy anywhere, is the knife-a businesslike knife, sharp and keen. Mrs. Whelen's aunt, who taught high school Latin for thirty years in Nebraska, had the right idea. She asked every class, "Which boys have a jackknife in their pocket?" The ones who had none did not rate very high with her.

Her philosophy was that if a boy did not have a knife and know how to use it, he was not likely to grow up able to do many things for himself...I have had a knife like this in my back pants pocket ever since I was knee-high to a chopping block.

Common sense from the days when common sense actually seemed to be common.

 

[338375]

Here's a quote I think you guys will enjoy from the book On Your Own In The Wilderness by Colonel Townsend Whelen and Bradford Angier (1958):

The most indispensable tool for a hunter or fisherman or camper, and in fact for any outdoor man and boy anywhere, is the knife-a businesslike knife, sharp and keen. Mrs. Whelen's aunt, who taught high school Latin for thirty years in Nebraska, had the right idea. She asked every class, "Which boys have a jackknife in their pocket?" The ones who had none did not rate very high with her.

Her philosophy was that if a boy did not have a knife and know how to use it, he was not likely to grow up able to do many things for himself...I have had a knife like this in my back pants pocket ever since I was knee-high to a chopping block.

Common sense from the days when common sense actually seemed to be common.

:thumbup: It certainly is a rarity these days...

Last year in school, one of my sons teachers asked what the kids did over the weekend. When Travis said he went hunting, the teacher asked him why ?
Then proceeded to tell him why hunting was a bad thing. I had to call the teacher and have a little "chat" with her, but the damage was already done because most of the kids in his school don't hunt either. So one minute he was proud and the next minute he felt like an outcast...

 

[texasflyfisher]

Common sense from the days when common sense actually seemed to be common.

Common sense; If I could only bottle it and sell it, I would be wealthy beyond my wildest dreams!

My 11 year old son keeps a SAK on his desk in his room. Pretty much the only time he carries it is when we go fishing because the rest of the time he is in school and I would rather not have to confront a bunch of folks with no common sense if it inadvertently fell out of his pocket. He knows not to take it to school but he knows it is not because it is a dangerous weapon but rather a tool that folks at school would erroneously perceive it as one.

On his 10th birthday party, we had some of his friends come over and there was a part of the party where the kids teamed up to see who could put a plastic model kit together the fastest. One boy took out a little SAK Classic to remove the plastic pieces. I can't tell you how happy I was to see a young boy carry a knife and use it and I told him so!

Anyways, anyone know how I can bottle up some common sense?

 

[Blues]

Common sense; If I could only bottle it and sell it, I would be wealthy beyond my wildest dreams!...
Anyways, anyone know how I can bottle up some common sense?

A start?

 

[texasflyfisher]

Haha! All you need now is a few hundred gallons of it, a crop duster plane and you know where it needs to be sprayed! :thumbup:

 

[hoopster]

The general e-mail contact address for the Troy, NY school district is:
boe@troy.k12.ny.us
I would put ATTN: Thomas Mayo in the subject line as he is the president of the Board of Education.
Send them some common sense but please be nice.

 

[brownshoe]

Do something about it.

First, tell the young people you know what happens if they have a knife at school. I do. Suprising, they all know the rules pretty much by third grade. Its hard for me to believe that a senior in high school was not fully aware of the risk he was taking. I also tell youn people about the local laws regarding knives and police search...this most do not know. They all listen intently.

Second, parents work to temper the "no tolerance" policy. Children and teenagers must be allowed to make mistakes...this is how they learn.

Third, make sure the kids you know have a legal knife.

 

[Capt. Carl]

:thumbup: It certainly is a rarity these days...

Last year in school, one of my sons teachers asked what the kids did over the weekend. When Travis said he went hunting, the teacher asked him why ?
Then proceeded to tell him why hunting was a bad thing. I had to call the teacher and have a little "chat" with her, but the damage was already done because most of the kids in his school don't hunt either. So one minute he was proud and the next minute he felt like an outcast...

Sounds like a vegetarian trying to push her agenda on the children. That's about as low as you can go.:thumbdn:

 

[TwoDogs]

Hoopster....thanks for the link.

I still just can't get past the fact that the knife was locked in his car. Additionally, did they search everyone's car, did they search faculty members cars....are scissors still allowed in school, is a tire tool in the trunk a tool and a weapon too....etc. etc. Just seems to me in today's societey the term "knife" automatically means a weapon and is no longer considered a tool.....how did that happen?

I carried a pocket knife most every day to school and never ever once gave it a second thought, nor did my parents.....nor did the school for that matter.

 

[ttoney83]

Another kid (Eagle Scout no less) in trouble for having a traditional knife (that his grandfather gave him)... and this one was locked in the trunk of his car, not to mention the poor little cub scout that was just proud of his new scout knife....please, where does it stop.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,566182,00.html?test=latestnews

How many of you are like me and can remember carrying your pocket knife to school with no worries at all.

They better watch those #2 pencils, they can get pretty sharp....someone could get hurt.

In the article the Superintendent is quoted as saying;

"Sometimes young people do things they may not see as serious," Superintendent George Goodwin told the Albany Times-Union. "We look at any possession of any type of knife as serious."

And sometimes OLD people do things that are just plain INSANE! Anyone writing their representatives to complain about this obscenity of zero tolerance? Their Schools? Their State Legislatures? It's long past time for this BS to stop...

 

[artmichalek]

Not to thread jack, but there was a great article in our local paper this morning about how much more prepared American high school students were back in the '40s.

http://www.burlingtonfreepress.com/article/20091016/NEWS02/91016003&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL

Four thousand feet might not seem tall to those of you out west, but with two thousand feet of clean prominence and surrounding valleys almost down to sea level the weather on that mountain can get pretty nasty even on a good day. I can't imagine a search and rescue trip up there this time of year with as little gear as those boys had. And these days an Eagle Scout with a Congressional recommendation to attend the US Military Academy can be labeled a dangerous criminal because he's in possession of the minimum tools required to open a package of AA batteries.

 

[TwoDogs]

And these days an Eagle Scout with a Congressional recommendation to attend the US Military Academy can be labeled a dangerous criminal because he's in possession of the minimum tools required to open a package of AA batteries.

:thumbup::thumbup: and thanks for the link too.

 

[hayseed1]

I graduated from a small rural school in 1984.We carried schrade LB 7's and buck 110's on our belts and back pockets daily with never even a cross look from a teacher or principle.
I might add that disagreements were settled with bare hands without swat teams to break them up and lawyers involved after the outcome.The guys that had the altercation were usually friends in a day or two,Or at least got along.
I think they(school boards etc.)think that making posesion of a pocket knife in school they will stop violent people from making violent acts.
We'll put that young man in our prayers tonight,I hope they haven't ruined his future plans,It sounds like he had real drive and great goals.The kind of kid they portray as a good example.