Ovens - any reasons not to go sugarcreek

cbr900son

cbr900son

Joined
Mar 3, 2011
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Well did my taxes today and got a nice suprise. A decent refund!!!! So was thinking the last thing I really need is a heat treating oven. Is there any reasons to fork out the extra $ for a paragon or higher end oven? Im a hobbyist and make between 3-6 knives a month so not like ti will be used likea full tiem maker but I dotn want to have regrets either down the road.
 
Sugar creek works well for many makers out there for a fairly economical price. My only hitch would be to make sure and pony up the extra for a digital controller so you know your temps are where they should be and are held there automatically. Otherwise, you have to babysit the oven and make little adjustments to the dial.

--nathan
 
This is just a thought, but you could buy a used stove from an appliance store, you know, a kitchen stove with an oven, for a $100. bucks most places. This gives you a high heat, reliable heating oven. I know a lot of smiths who have kitchen stoves in their shops.
 
Sugar creek make good kilns, just make sure you get one that is rated for the highest temp you plan on going to. If you plan to HT SS on a regular basis, you need to be able to hold a higher temp than if you were just doing plain carbon steel.
 
I bought a sugar creek Ht oven years ago to HT 440C and D2. In the beginning it worked great. As time went on it took longer and longer to reach the temps required until It would no longer reach those temps at all. I called the nice people at sugar creek and was instructed to measure the resistance of the heating element which I did(can't remember what that was). The resistance was to high which meant I needed a new heating element which I bought and installed, great back in business. Then a short time later it began taking longer to reach required temps until it no longer reaches the temps required for higher alloy steels, again. The problem is the heating elements are open exposed to the air. You need a HT oven with sealed elements so, next oven I will spend the extra money, mean while I send my knives to Paul Bos heat treating.
 
David Stifle said:
This is just a thought, but you could buy a used stove from an appliance store, you know, a kitchen stove with an oven, for a $100. bucks most places. This gives you a high heat, reliable heating oven. I know a lot of smiths who have kitchen stoves in their shops.
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A kitchen range is only good for tempering, IF closely monitored.
 
R APPLEBY said:
I bought a sugar creek Ht oven years ago to HT 440C and D2. In the beginning it worked great. As time went on it took longer and longer to reach the temps required until It would no longer reach those temps at all. I called the nice people at sugar creek and was instructed to measure the resistance of the heating element which I did(can't remember what that was). The resistance was to high which meant I needed a new heating element which I bought and installed, great back in business. Then a short time later it began taking longer to reach required temps until it no longer reaches the temps required for higher alloy steels, again. The problem is the heating elements are open exposed to the air. You need a HT oven with sealed elements so, next oven I will spend the extra money, mean while I send my knives to Paul Bos heat treating.
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I have never heard of such a problem with Evenheat ovens, but I suppose it is possible. It would seem that your problem may have originated in some other area, and showed up in short lived elements, or your elements may not have been heavy enough to do their job on a long term basis.
 
LRB said:
I have never heard of such a problem with Evenheat ovens, but I suppose it is possible. It would seem that your problem may have originated in some other area, and showed up in short lived elements, or your elements may not have been heavy enough to do their job on a long term basis.
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I have a sugar creek oven not an evenheat, the second time the elements failed was only a matter of a couple weeks. It is very probable the elements are not heavy enough for high temps. I am not an oven expert or am I trying to put down sugar creek kilns, just my experience. I am still shopping for another oven.
 
Are the connections good on the elements to their terminations? Clean of any oxidation?

Additionally, on all high temp ovens an SCR or other current limiting device can GREATLY increase the life of the elements..The huge inrush of current takes its toll on heater element wire.
 
R APPLEBY said:
I have a sugar creek oven not an evenheat, the second time the elements failed was only a matter of a couple weeks. It is very probable the elements are not heavy enough for high temps. I am not an oven expert or am I trying to put down sugar creek kilns, just my experience. I am still shopping for another oven.
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You don't by any chance leave the door open when you are cooling down do you?

I have a Sugar Creek Big Knife Kiln and love it. Folks often talk about how great the old Good Kiln company kilns were. Sugar Creek Kilns are made by Good Kiln.

I wonder if it is possible to seal/hide the elements in SC/Evenheat/Paragon kilns?
 
Anyone try ITC213 on their elements to increase life? Might be worth a call to an applications engineer over there. I've seen it in catalogs but don't have any first or even second hand experience with it.
 
Rick Marchand said:
You don't by any chance leave the door open when you are cooling down do you?

I have a Sugar Creek Big Knife Kiln and love it. Folks often talk about how great the old Good Kiln company kilns were. Sugar Creek Kilns are made by Good Kiln.

I wonder if it is possible to seal/hide the elements in SC/Evenheat/Paragon kilns?
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Rick, I Never leave the door open longer than it takes to remove a blade, the connections are good and no corrosion. As far as a limiting device for power surge? Sealing the elements, doubtful, and that is why I am still shopping.
 
Bob -- Are you pushing the ceiling of their spec'd upper temperature limits? If not, something else must be up. Maybe some other defective part? Maybe your power source is not within specs? I'm just grabbing at straws, but I can't imagine a company selling a product that doesn't work for what it was design to do and staying in business. Did you talk with Sugar Creek about the snafu? Seems like they'd want to get to the bottom of that. -- Aloha, Phil
 
Phil Dwyer said:
Bob -- Are you pushing the ceiling of their spec'd upper temperature limits? If not, something else must be up. Maybe some other defective part? Maybe your power source is not within specs? I'm just grabbing at straws, but I can't imagine a company selling a product that doesn't work for what it was design to do and staying in business. Did you talk with Sugar Creek about the snafu? Seems like they'd want to get to the bottom of that. -- Aloha, Phil
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Hey Phil, New house, new wire with a separate service for the shop. I measured the line power at the box and at the outlet, all good. I don't see 1850 degrees pushing it. Not sure how long I've had the oven, 10 yrs? and it's an analogue controller(thats what was available at the time). It worked great for the first 7 years, then went into decline. I'm not knocking sugar creek, just going to up grade on the next oven.
 
I would give the guys at even heat a call tell them your on the fence to get a even heat or the suger creek that is much cheaper and see what they cen do for you as far as price. Im sure they will work with you, I know they did with me when also as far as paragon I sold my parogon to get the even heat of the same size as I did not care for my paragon at all.
 
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