Oxidation Frustration

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone!

I’m vaguely familiar with Renwax, but I’ve never used it. If I understand correctly, you would have to clean/remove it from a knife before carrying/using it? Also, as a wax, wouldn’t it be messy/difficult to apply to the liners and backspring down in the blade well?

I’ll have to read up on the VCI products. I’ve also been looking into dehumidifiers and am considering one for the basement.

I agree that storing the knives upstairs rather than in the basement would be ideal, but the layout of the house and the furniture we have upstairs make it a less-than-ideal solution. It would require me to store them in something other than the parts cabinet I’m currently using, which I bought specifically for storing knives and have been very happy with.

One thing I’ll definitely be incorporating, in addition to any other solution(s), are some desiccant packets. :thumbsup:
 
Thanks for the suggestions, everyone!

I’m vaguely familiar with Renwax, but I’ve never used it. If I understand correctly, you would have to clean/remove it from a knife before carrying/using it? Also, as a wax, wouldn’t it be messy/difficult to apply to the liners and backspring down in the blade well?

I’ll have to read up on the VCI products. I’ve also been looking into dehumidifiers and am considering one for the basement.

I agree that storing the knives upstairs rather than in the basement would be ideal, but the layout of the house and the furniture we have upstairs make it a less-than-ideal solution. It would require me to store them in something other than the parts cabinet I’m currently using, which I bought specifically for storing knives and have been very happy with.

One thing I’ll definitely be incorporating, in addition to any other solution(s), are some desiccant packets. :thumbsup:

Regarding the bold text, take a look at the Seal1 that I mentioned. It's a wipe on wipe off liquid and because of that it's easier to use than Renwax.

It's an ideal product for the blade well. Mike Latham from collectorknives.net highly recommends it and that's how I was introduced to it. Mike will send you a free sample with any order just for the asking or you can buy a whole bottle of it which you will likely end up doing anyway if you try it.
 
Regarding the bold text, take a look at the Seal1 that I mentioned. It's a wipe on wipe off liquid and because of that it's easier to use than Renwax.

It's an ideal product for the blade well. Mike Latham from collectorknives.net highly recommends it and that's how I was introduced to it. Mike will send you a free sample with any order just for the asking or you can buy a whole bottle of it which you will likely end up doing anyway if you try it.

Thanks, Rick. I’ll look into it as well.

To be honest, I think a big part of the problem is that when it came to knife care I was a bit spoiled with the dry climate in Arizona. I wiped the blades and oiled the joints regularly, but probably neglected to make sure the liners and backspring in the blade well were kept oiled, because it never caused any issues in that climate.

I’m also just glad that I noticed this when I did, and not a few weeks or months down the road!
 
Barrett,

I'll add one more thing and then I'll shut up.:D

Another advantage to using something like Renwax, Seal1, etc. combined with a VCI product or desiccant packs is that you get two forms of protection for peace of mind and your knives stay clean and dry without the need for excess oil on them. Under those circumstances the only oil required is in the joints.
 
This thread got me looking at my knives as well. How or what tool do you folks use to clean the back spring and frame when you do find some rust inside? My red 15 clip has some spots on the frame. North Carolina here:D
 
How or what tool do you folks use to clean the back spring and frame
Wooden coffee stirrer, toothpick, or bamboo skewer. Torn-off corner of a paper towel, oil or WD-40 if needed. None of mine have rust, though.
 
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Well, with that thought, I decided I ought to check on all my other knives, which are stored in an old parts cabinet
After reading your post I too have spent much of the afternoon examining and oiling. Of the ones I checked everything seems to be ok and I feel better now. :) Barrett were your knives wrapped and in their tubes while inside the parts cabinet?
 
After reading your post I too have spent much of the afternoon examining and oiling. Of the ones I checked everything seems to be ok and I feel better now. :) Barrett were your knives wrapped and in their tubes while inside the parts cabinet?

I don't store them in the tubes. Here are a couple old photos showing the cabinet and how I store my knives in it. I lined the drawers with tool box drawer liner.

0CbTnnf.jpg


mogytye.jpg


Before we moved (and hopefully again once we get settled), I kept this cigar box on top of the cabinet (also lined with tool box drawer liner) to set knives in after I'd carried them for a few days. Once a few had accumulated, I would oil them, wipe them down and put them back in their spots in the drawers.

lBQ4jKO.jpg
 
I don't store them in the tubes. Here are a couple old photos showing the cabinet and how I store my knives in it. I lined the drawers with tool box drawer liner.

0CbTnnf.jpg


mogytye.jpg


Before we moved (and hopefully again once we get settled), I kept this cigar box on top of the cabinet (also lined with tool box drawer liner) to set knives in after I'd carried them for a few days. Once a few had accumulated, I would oil them, wipe them down and put them back in their spots in the drawers.

lBQ4jKO.jpg
[/QUOTE
That looks like an awesome setup you have there. And a great idea for holding the users prior to storage. I don't keep mine in the tubes either simply because (imho) there's little reason to own them if I can't have easy and readily available access to them. However they would probably fair better in the waxed paper inside the tubes. That's why I ask about it.
Thanks for the comprehensive response.
 
Barrett, welcome to the Upper Midwest! I can't argue with the experts on the need for vigilance and coatings. But it strikes me that you need to get at the root of the problem ie the humidity. Get one or more dehumidifiers down there. Don't skimp, but don't go overboard either since they work best with long run cycles. Your home looks new enough that you hopefully don't have standing water. (My house built in 1894, gets a stream running in the spring that's big enough to fish in. :D)

Good luck.

Edit: one other thing, it may be best to move the collection into the middle of the room since a lot of the moisture is likely coming through the walls.
 
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I live in the Mississippi River delta region - it gets very humid here. I don't do anything unusual with my pocket knives, storage-wise. Some of my GEC knives that I carry occasionally are in my desk drawer. The rest are in their tubes on the shelf. Same with my Case CV steel knives. I carry a Case CV knife most of the time.

No rust on any of them, including the GECs that I carry most often. Not on the blades, nor the liners, nor the backsprings. Same with my Case CV knives. This thread made me wonder so I got a couple out of their tubes that had been untouched for years. They looked fine - no rust, no patina, nothing. I put a drop of mineral oil in the pivots and spread the excess on the blades (doesn't take much - one drop does it) and put them back away.

Maybe there is something different about northern humidity but down here in the mid-south, where it is 83% humidity right now, it doesn't seem to be a problem for me. Only time I get a patina is when I try to create one on purpose.

Plain food-grade mineral oil is the only thing I use for rust prevention (Norton Honing Oil actually). Before I put a knife up that I won't be using for a while, a small drop in the pivot, open and close it a couple of times, rub the excess on the blade (and backspring if it's a GEC) and that's it. For a carry knife, I do the same maybe once every couple of weeks, if that often.

I love Renaissance Wax, but I use it on bone/stag handles. Really brings out the beauty. Very little required. I rub it on with a fingertip and buff off. I guess you could use it on the blades and liners too. Its easy to apply.

For inside bladewells I'd put a little on a gun-cleaning patch or torn off corner of a paper towel, rub it inside the blade wells using a toothpick, bamboo skewer, or wooden coffee stirrer, let dry a minute, then buff it using a clean piece of paper towel. It's a very light, thin wax. Personally I'd just use mineral oil in the same way.
 
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That looks like an awesome setup you have there. And a great idea for holding the users prior to storage. I don't keep mine in the tubes either simply because (imho) there's little reason to own them if I can't have easy and readily available access to them. However they would probably fair better in the waxed paper inside the tubes. That's why I ask about it.
Thanks for the comprehensive response.

Thanks, Dwight! I was excited when I found that cabinet a few years ago, as it works perfectly for knife storage. My GEC knives now take up the entire top row and two drawers on the second row. The rest of my hodgepodge traditional knife collection fills most of the rest of the second row, and I have a couple drawers of modern folders that I almost never carry nowadays, so I still have plenty of room to grow! :D

Barrett, welcome to the Upper Midwest! I can't argue with the experts on the need for vigilance and coatings. But it strikes me that you need to get at the root of the problem ie the humidity. Get one or more dehumidifiers down there. Don't skimp, but don't go overboard either since they work best with long run cycles. Your home looks new enough that you hopefully don't have standing water. (My house built in 1894, gets a stream running in the spring that's big enough to fish in. :D)

Good luck.

Edit: one other thing, it may be best to move the collection into the middle of the room since a lot of the moisture is likely coming through the walls.

Thanks, Bugdoc. If you're talking about the house in the background of the photos showing my knife cabinet, that was our house in Arizona, which was a fairly new home (2003). The house we bought here in MN was built in 1976, so not as new as our previous place, though certainly not as old as 1894! I'm hopeful we won't have any water issues. One of my projects was to bury corrugated pipe to divert the water from the downspouts out 20+ feet from the foundation. And the plumbing has all been updated, and is easily accessible (the bathrooms, kitchen, etc. are all on the back side of the house, and almost all the plumbing is accessible in the unfinished basement utility room). The rest of the basement (probably 80% of the total space down there) is finished and carpeted, so I'll have to keep an eye out for any potential water issues. :confused: (No signs of anything concerning yet with a couple rainy summer weeks in the books, but I know winter can be a different story.)

I agree that we'll probably need at least one dehumidifier down here. At the very least, it'll be fairly easy to put one just about dead center of the entire basement space and make use of an existing condensate pump from the HVAC system to avoid emptying the water manually.

I also think you have a good point about the location along the wall. Again, I think you may have been referring to the photos from our house in AZ, but the current location of the cabinet in this house is along a wall on the front side of the house where the basement is fully underground. The good news is that, while moving the knives upstairs would be difficult, I do have some room to move them around within the basement. Right now they're in a sort of extra wide hall/landing area at the bottom of the stairs, but there's also a spare bedroom down there, and a large bonus room where I could potentially move them. (I'm not sure how walkout basements compare to regular basements when it comes to moisture issues, but the bonus room is fully open to the backside of the house, with a large window and entry door, and exterior walls in the spare bedroom and utility room are only maybe 1/3 underground with windows that open to the back and side of the house.)

I do appreciate your feedback, as living in a home with a basement is a new experience for us. (My parents, when I was in high school, built a home with a walkout basement, but it was literally a brand new home, so there weren't really any of the concerns that come with an older home with a basement.)

I live in the Mississippi River delta region - it gets very humid here. I don't do anything unusual with my pocket knives, storage-wise. Some of my GEC knives that I carry occasionally are in my desk drawer. The rest are in their tubes on the shelf. Same with my Case CV steel knives. I carry a Case CV knife most of the time.

No rust on any of them, including the GECs that I carry most often. Not on the blades, nor the liners, nor the backsprings. Same with my Case CV knives. This thread made me wonder so I got a couple out of their tubes that had been untouched for years. They looked fine - no rust, no patina, nothing. I put a drop of mineral oil in the pivots and spread the excess on the blades (doesn't take much - one drop does it) and put them back away.

Maybe there is something different about northern humidity but down here in the mid-south, where it is 83% humidity right now, it doesn't seem to be a problem for me. Only time I get a patina is when I try to create one on purpose.

Plain food-grade mineral oil is the only thing I use for rust prevention (Norton Honing Oil actually). Before I put a knife up that I won't be using for a while, a small drop in the pivot, open and close it a couple of times, rub the excess on the blade (and backspring if it's a GEC) and that's it. For a carry knife, I do the same maybe once every couple of weeks, if that often.

I love Renaissance Wax, but I use it on bone/stag handles. Really brings out the beauty. Very little required. I rub it on with a fingertip and buff off. I guess you could use it on the blades and liners too. Its easy to apply.

For inside bladewells I'd put a little on a gun-cleaning patch or torn off corner of a paper towel, rub it inside the blade wells using a toothpick, bamboo skewer, or wooden coffee stirrer, let dry a minute, then buff it using a clean piece of paper towel. It's a very light, thin wax. Personally I'd just use mineral oil in the same way.

Thanks for the info, John! I normally just use mineral oil, as well. (I didn't realize that Norton honing oil, which I had from using with Arkansas stones, was just mineral oil until after I bought a 12 oz. seemingly lifetime supply bottle of mineral oil at the pharmacy!).

I would have to imagine that humidity is humidity wherever you are, but I'm no expert. (I will say that the nice thing about the humidity up here compared to down south is that it's doesn't really get that hot, so it's not all that unpleasant when you're outside.) :D

I use gun cleaning patches and (sometimes) toothpicks for getting down into the blade wells, too. I find that a gun cleaning patch folded over twice with a little oil applied is perfect for getting down in between the liners, followed by another dry one to get an excess oil out of the blade well. As I said earlier, I think part of the problem is that I got out of the habit of oiling that part of the knife all that often because it wasn't really necessary in the drier AZ climate.
 
A lot of good suggestions. Over time I have tested / used many different products to prevent / remove oxidation. If you want to test some products for oxidation prevention, treat several blades with different treatments and put on a paper plate in a ziploc with a cap full of iodine. You'll know pretty quick what works and what doesn't.

My central air unit does a pretty good job on the humidity. But I use Seal1 on trouble blades (Froglube is good as well, but has a smell); which is typically those with a rougher "satin" finish - the pores are just more open the more "as-ground" a blade. Lemon oil on thirsty slabs; RenWax on others. And, I buy bulk silica kitty litter (similar to this) and fill tube socks for each of my vaults.
 
Thanks for the suggestions, everyone!

I’m vaguely familiar with Renwax, but I’ve never used it. If I understand correctly, you would have to clean/remove it from a knife before carrying/using it? Also, as a wax, wouldn’t it be messy/difficult to apply to the liners and backspring down in the blade well?

I’ll have to read up on the VCI products. I’ve also been looking into dehumidifiers and am considering one for the basement.

I agree that storing the knives upstairs rather than in the basement would be ideal, but the layout of the house and the furniture we have upstairs make it a less-than-ideal solution. It would require me to store them in something other than the parts cabinet I’m currently using, which I bought specifically for storing knives and have been very happy with.

One thing I’ll definitely be incorporating, in addition to any other solution(s), are some desiccant packets. :thumbsup:

I think you'd only use Ren Wax on the blades of knives you were putting into storage Barrett. I only use it on a few, but it's pretty good stuff, and the coating it leaves is barely detectable. I just usually put a drop of mineral oil in the pivot, and apply some to the inside of the spring with a pipe-cleaner at the same time. I find pipe-cleaners great for cleaning knives, and as applicators, and I get through quite a few of them. I've never actually bought any of the desiccant packets, but I buy a lot of stuff which arrives with one or two of them, so I just throw them in my knife drawers :D :thumbsup:
 
I read that in some American states it can be so humid you knife can develop rust overnight on the night stand.

One knife owner i read would drop his work knife in a container of mineral oil when he got home, coating all surface with oil, you just have to remember to remove all excess oil with a cloth before you leave for work next day.
 
I use a "Garryson Garryflex Abrasive Block" grey 120 grit to remove rust and marks on my knives.

These blocks are solid, the abrasive is though the entire block so you can cut the blocks up.
 
Welcome to the Great Lakes region, home of rusted knives!!!! LOL

I've had a similar battle going on for years now, fighting to keep my GEC's rust free, after having troubles that are very similar to yours.

  • Get the knives out of the basement. It's your biggest issue. Move them to the top floor of the house if possible. It helps tremendously. I store my knives on the 2nd floor of the house, in a spare bedroom that isn't heated or air conditioned. The door stays closed when not in use. I never have a problem with any knife stored there.
  • I do coat very valuable collector's items with Ren Wax, just to be safe.
  • Oil the blade wells and backsprings once per week. They're crazy susceptible to rust.
  • Force a patina on the knives you'll be carrying. Force a DARK patina.
  • Learn to live with only having a couple knives out at a time. It sucks to not be able to have 4 or 5 knives on my nightstand, but I know they'll rust if I leave them there during the summer months.
  • Get used to carrying your knives in leather pouches. Pouches help a lot in keeping the sweat from pockets away from your knives.
  • Learn to love stainless. There's a reason why smart knife manufacturers moved to stainless many years ago. GEC just hasn't caught up with the times yet.
 
You have to wash your knives after use before storage. If you touch or leave any residue from anything on these knives in those conditions they will rust.

When my knives aren’t being used, before I put them up:

1. Wash
2. Put rubber gloves on so you don’t leave fingerprints or residue of any type.
3. Dry (I like a hair dryer)
4. Put mineral oil on your gloves.
5. Liberally apply mineral oil on the knife
6. Let this dry for a few days.
7. Reapply mineral oil lightly
8. Let it dry again
8. Wipe excess mineral oil and store.

If I don’t do this, what happened to you, will happen. General use of my knife with foods and such will cause rust by the morning if I don’t clean my knife. Fingerprints will do the same in storage, so it’s why I use gloves. The last time I had such rust, I used a scotch-brite pad to remove rust in between the liners.

I also use dehumidifying packs next to the knives in storage. If those packs fill up or become full, I know the humidity is high. I also store them on the shelf-lining foam GEC uses for production.

I pull 3-5 knives out a week for a rotation. Store your knives where it’s the best climate controlled in your new house. I won’t touch a knife in storage without gloves on. Even when knives are in service, I won’t let them go long with out a cleaning or a finger wipe of the blade.
 
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