Pattadese for two and a half days.

Very nice looking knife, Carl! Do you know of any domestic sources to order these?

-Parke1
 
aarya said:
Is there a backspring on that knife, or is it only friction?
Click to expand...

Jo,
thank you for posting the video, I had never seen it. Salvatore Giagu is an excellent maker that I've had the pleasure to meet more than once: he works with his wife (the woman in the video) and his son, and has a small cutlery museum above his workshop in Pattada. He also has one of the longest waiting list (years) among Sardinian knifemakers. I've never seen any of his knives with a backspring: this pattern (the "resolza" or "pattadesa") is a pure friction folder. Personally, I don't think he does, but he might make some "slipjoint variant" by request; anyway, rest assured that his knives are friction folders, as any real Sardinian pattern. The steel between the two scales is usually called "arch", but has no tension, it only works as spacer, as Carl said. Sometimes, the handle is made by one uncut piece of horn (or wood), with no arch, and is therefore described as "monolythic" (if you've seen the picture of my "arburesa" on this forum, you should know what I mean).

Fausto
:cool:
 
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Thanks for the link Pete.
Anthony Bourdain knows many things about my island...which comes as no surprise, since his wife is Sardinian :D

Fausto
:cool:
 
Thank you Carl and Fausto. A spacer makes much more sense with the bolster being the way it is. I was thinking that a backspring wouldn't have enough room to move inside the bolster, also with the pin-placement as it is, it makes much more sense as a spacer. :)
 
This is very interesting. An Opinel without the locking ring would be similar, this thread makes me want to try that. When using a Pattada has anyone had close calls about the knife closing on your fingers? I presume the danger is quite small if you use the knife as it is supposed to be used, as a cutter. How difficult or dangerous would it be to use a Pattada for piercing anything or is a matter of technigue?
 
HFinn said:
This is very interesting. An Opinel without the locking ring would be similar, this thread makes me want to try that. When using a Pattada has anyone had close calls about the knife closing on your fingers? I presume the danger is quite small if you use the knife as it is supposed to be used, as a cutter. How difficult or dangerous would it be to use a Pattada for piercing anything or is a matter of technigue?
Click to expand...

I'll try to address those questions.

Using the pattada type of knife, or any friction folder is just like using a slip joint pocket knife. You pull open the knife, cut with it, and push it closed. While cutting, the forces at work on the blade, keep it open. Cutting anything from a piece of rope to a sausage is exactly the same.

But...and her is the big difference, with no spring, the blade does not move at all unless there is continuing pressure on the spine of the blade. This means that if you use the point, and you push a little crooked, the blade will only close as far as it is pushed. It does not go past a point then snap shut on you. This goes as well on opening the knife. You grasp the blade to pull it open, and if halfway or one third open your fingers slip off the blade, it stays right there where you slipped off. Again no snapping shut. I think there is a very good reason these friction folders and penny knives have been popular for a thousand years or two.

My odyssey to the friction folder began a few years ago at a lunch where a member of our Vespa scooter group had his family there. Pascal is born and bred Frenchman, and when I was using my Opinel at lunch, a conversation broke out on knives and European style folders. Pascal thought it funny I was engaging the locking ring for such a mild job as slicing some nice fresh French bread. He pointed out that he nor his father and brother bother with the lock, and the locking ring was not brought out until 1955 for the Opinels. While there are still folding knives used in France that are like Opinels with no lock. People just take care while using, and there is no problem. Technique wins over no springs.

So when I started to play with Opinels as an experiment, I snugged up the rivet and did without the lock. I encountered no problems at all. In fact, I got so used to the springless friction folder, I started to look at my American style slip joints and saw how the spring actually could be seen as not only non functional, but dangerous. And I did use the point of the Opinel, I just was careful in my technique. With the Pattada, the sharp almost needle like point catches in what it is stuck into, and as long as you push strait in, it pierces just fine. You can feel it when it's right, and if it starts to get out of line while you pierse, the friction type mechanism lets you correct while doing it. In a weird way, it's more predicable and instinctive to use a friction folder. It's a mush over instead of a sudden snap that ends with a blade closing on your fingers like a guillotine. I hope I'm making sense. You can open it one hand pretty easy by bumping the butt end so it comes out a bit, (I think Opinel has a name for this maneuver) then hook the point on what you want to cut, or any surface like the table edge, tree, boot heel, and just pull it open. Not having a back spring actually makes the knife much easier to deal with. Or you just hold the blade while hooking the butt against a pocket edge, and pulling the blade all the open.

As far as the using the point of the Pattada, from what I understand of the history of Sardinia, bandits in the hills used the large Pattada's to uphold their fearsome reputation. :eek:

I hope I have been of some help.

Carl.
 
Jackknife, thank you for your explanation. It now makes perfect sense.

I visited Florence a short while ago and saw knifes in the window of a coltellieri there that I now know were pattadas. I admired their clean and simple lines and the bone handles. Very elegant indeed. I think I will get an Opi nr. 9 and remove the ring, tighten the axle a bit and modify the handle to my taste. Removing the ring will make the knive more slender and easy to pocket.

I wonder if using the pattada as a weapon takes a special technigue, like pinching the blade flat between your thumb and forefinger to guide the point? I would do it that way.
 
One more video for the youtube addicts :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRZyjPmvbVs

Back to HFinn question...
Yes, a clumsy piercing move might induce the knife to close...meaning to leave the "full open" position. But believe me, to make the knife close down to your fingers, you need to try hard even to do it on purpose. Good friction folders, with the right amount of friction in the pivot area, don't close that easily by the way, and they're often used (at least here) to pierce quite alot. Nowadays it's more cheese and slices of sausage. In the past...well, more than one man has been pierced with these knives, and if you look at the shape of the blade, you can easily understand how good it works for piercing.
Small sidenote: I've seen a couple of resolzas whose butt had been sanded (or made like this from the maker) so that the very point of it would go half a mm beyond the end of the handle, to make it a one hand opener: basically, a man could hold the knife (or grab it from his pocket), and make the point of the knife "catch" on his trousers while making a half circle with the handle, thus opening the knife,

Fausto
:cool:
 
I enjoy learning more about how these knives work. Thanks Carl and Fausto!

Here is a video of the one hand opening that Fausto is talking about.
[video=youtube;mLDah6-KU9w]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLDah6-KU9w&list=FLNBPjWvbUDvUkiMZQRtVfSw&index=18[/video]
 
Wow. The Bourdain video is great. I'm a fan of his show.

I rarely engage the lock on my Opinels.

I think I need to get one of these knives. Anyone offering a proxy service or know of a vendor that ships to USA?
 
I took the lockring off the old Opi nr 10 I have. Tightened the pivot with a ball peen hammer and hey presto, I got a dedicated friction folder. It is so simple it feels stupid. Works like a charm. I quess it took the Bladeforums just to think outside the modern knife box. :D
 
Interesting video you posted there aarya, liked watching all that sawing and preparation, very impressive. Some expensive stuff there too not surprisingly:eek:

Carl, I like the leaf shaped blade it is amazingly versatile in use.

Thanks, Will
 
HFinn said:
I took the lockring off the old Opi nr 10 I have. Tightened the pivot with a ball peen hammer and hey presto, I got a dedicated friction folder. It is so simple it feels stupid. Works like a charm. I quess it took the Bladeforums just to think outside the modern knife box. :D
Click to expand...

That's how I got started in experimenting with friction folders. Lord knows I had some Opinels hanging around here, so I snugged one up and used the heck out of it. :thumbup:

Carl.
 
Wow! Such great videos and information again gents.

It's so hard not to love these knives.
 
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Hi folks,
so today I was wandering in a kitchenware/knife shop (I do that sometimes :rolleyes:), and I thought it would be nice to take a picture of these knives and post it here to raise more love. Now, I'm not a fan of Damascus myself, and I know the quality of the picture is pretty bad...yet I hope you can catch a glimpse of one of the most beautiful Sardinian folders I've ever seen and handled.

21785486.jpg


Fausto
:cool:
 
that one on top looks very cool...the blade looks like it has 2 different patterns of damascus on it...never seen that before. I also really like the horn on the top one...the way it kind of looks like waves in the horn, I think that is my favorite feature of horn, the wavy look you sometimes get, almost like a "curly" wood or something, I bet it looks stunning in person.
 
Vic,
personally, my favourite of the bunch is the lower knife. First, because I have a slight preference towards the "antique shape" Sardinian knives rather than the "pattadesa", and second because I love that kind of horn. As for the Damascus, this maker forges and produces his own Damascus, and I've seen many different variants of it in his knives :)
P.S.: did you get my email? :rolleyes:

Fausto
:cool:
 
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