Pearls before Swine

[Let It Bleed]

Personally, I hate going to walmart simply because it's usually not worth the aggravation. However, I've always been curious why Spyderco even uses wal-mart as a retailer for a few Spyderco models, but afaik doesn't sell their Byrd line there.

Obviously there is no way for me to know the specifics of Spyderco and walmart's business dealings, but I wonder if using a discount chain will tarnish Spyderco’s brand name in the long term. After all, it seems reasonable that one of the many considerations in creating a separate brand (Byrd) to market their lower end knives was to prevent the diminution of the Spyderco brand.

I realize that Kershaw and Buck knives are also available at wal-mart and that most on this forum will discern the quality of any particular knife based on the "quality of the knife." Therefore, where as we may identify these finds as treasure among the flotsam and jetsam, many others may consider them all (e.g. Gerber) of equal value and differentiated solely by price. Essentially, is this a case of “pearls before swine” that will in time diminish the exemplary reputation of the brand that Spyderco has cultivated over the years? Do you think it will be detrimental or beneficial to the continued success of Spyderco?

I do not pretend to know better than Mr. Glesser as to what is best for Spyderco’s future success as he has done it and I have not. However, I see no disrespect in speculating on the potential effects certain business decisions may have. After all I consider Spyderco knives to be second to none and I want to buy them as much as they want to sell them. Likewise, I love Kershaw and Benchmade knives and even bought an OD-1 from wal-mart. I realize my hypocrisy in that I would also prefer if Kershaws were not sold at walmart, but chose to buy from them because it cost less.

Additionally, does anyone know if wally world still sells the S30V Native? Seriously, who doesn’t want to buy a 65 dollar knife for only 30 dollars?

 

[jill jackson]

I haven't seen a Spyderco at any of the 3 Walmarts I shop at for a good while. All, Bucks, Kershaws and Gerbers.

 

[Jake Bauer]

yeah i think wal mart stopped selling all spydies.

 

[tinwiskers]

I've looked at 3 Walmarts in the Denver Metro area and I have found no Spydies. I believe Mr. Glesser stated that Walmart stopped selling them because they weren't selling like they (walmart) thought they should.

I personally think that it was worth a try on Spyderco's part. Get more name recognition and introduce a great product as the Native to the masses but in my opinion I think Walmart just didn't give it a long enough chance to be on the shelves.

 

[Phil Elmore]

Wal*Mart is a retailer.

Wal*Mart is no more "evil" than any other retailer.

Shopping at Wal*Mart does not make you evil.

Having one's products available in a Wal*Mart does not in any way harm the reputation of the manufacturer.

 

[Courtland]

Well I certainly agree with Your first 3 statements Phil, but that last one, not so much.

MANY people do not, and will not care about such things, but MANY MORE people DO think that the company you keep, and the people you do business with says something about you. it may be unfair, but it IS a common belief.

I am not saying this to tarnish spyderco or walmart in anyway.

my $.10

 

[Phil Elmore]

I don't think so. I don't think most people care at all where a product is available elsewhere, as long as it can be had from the outlet where they do shop.

 

[Let It Bleed]

Evil Now that's hyperbole!

 

[Courtland]

You don't have to agree, but perception, especially perception of quality DOES play an integral role in shaping how people percieve a product. Rightly or wrongly Wal-Mart has a reputation for selling "cheap-plastic-crap". do they sell OTHER good quality items? Sure. But aside from electronics most people don't associate Wal-Mart with high quality. Of course Wal-mart is not the only store this is the case for, its just the whipping boy of this particular thread and this particular example. Spyderco knives however ARE generally high-quality items. Ergo, most people don't expect to find them at wal-mart.

The point that the top poster made, and that I am making, is that inevitably SOME people are going to have their opinion of spyderco shaped, or at least effected, by the fact that they are (or apparently were) available at Wal-Mart. By all means you are free to disagree, but I think you are pushing a boulder up-hill on this one; people DO shape at least part of their perception of a product based on where it is available.

Again, my comments are not meant to denegrate or call into question spyderco or their business practices.

my $.10

 

[ousanas]

the Native was available at walmart, and in fact was in no small part developed at the request of walmart for a basic, user friendly, sheeple friendly knife. Sal has stated that product testing yeilded that blade style as the most NKP friendly of the designs they put forth for the "walmart" knife. IIRC

Walmart stopped carrying it because it was not selling, it was "too expensive" for most walmart users. We all know here that it was a GREAT deal, unfortunately, NKP think anything in that case is a ripoff when they can buy a $.59 knife at the gas station checkout etc etc etc...Everyone I works with uses cheap $5 crap knives and says they are as good as anything I carry.

Walmart online did carry a few other models, but I don't think they even have any of those anymore

As for it tarnishing Spyderco's reputation, it hasn't over the last several years when they WERE carrying the knife, and now that they aren't, I don't see it affecting Spyderco's reputation in any way.

 

[Phil Elmore]

Nobody says, "Well I was going to buy a Kershaw Leek, but because you can buy it at Wal*Mart, where I don't shop, I won't buy one."

 

[Lycosa]

What's Wal-Mart??

 

[Let It Bleed]

Nobody says, "Well I was going to buy a Kershaw Leek, but because you can buy it at Wal*Mart, where I don't shop, I won't buy one."

My question has more to do with possible effects to the higher end knives Spyderco makes. For example, which would sell for more: a watch with the Tag Heuer brand or the identical watch sold under the Timex brand?

Spyderco’s creation of the Byrd brand of knives seems similar, but in reverse, to how Toyota and Nissan created their luxury priced Lexus and Infinity lines respectively. A Lexus with the Toyota name simply will not sell for as much.

Likewise, if the Spyderco brand name becomes identified with mass appeal inexpensive knives, could that impair their ability to command the premium price necessary to make a profit on high end knives that appeal to a limited market?

 

[ousanas]

My question has more to do with possible effects to the higher end knives Spyderco makes. For example, which would sell for more: a watch with the Tag Heuer brand or the identical watch sold under the Timex brand?

Spyderco’s creation of the Byrd brand of knives seems similar, but in reverse, to how Toyota and Nissan created their luxury priced Lexus and Infinity lines respectively. A Lexus with the Toyota name simply will not sell for as much.

Likewise, if the Spyderco brand name becomes identified with mass appeal inexpensive knives, could that impair their ability to command the premium price necessary to make a profit on high end knives that appeal to a limited market?

Interesting question. My initial reaction would be to say unless it's quite literally one of the $5.00 timex junker ones, the TH branded one will sell more overall. That's kinda what happened with the Native I think. People see a $40.00 knife that doesn't have any of the flashy options of cheaper knives in the case (Tacticool options, assist opener, Combo edge, etc etc etc) and it gets passed over.

Yeah, it's interesting about the toyota honda comparo you say, cuz it's basically exactly what they did in reverse for reasoning as well, Sal has stated that copies/low end knives were hurting the sales of the lower end spydies, so they basically just went and contracted one of the factories in China that did those same copies/low ends, upped the QC and told them to make the byrd lines to Spydie specs, and they are brilliant. I have a feeling Honda and Toyota just up specced their vehicle lines to have some sort of comp. with mercs, beemers, etc. etc etc.

The third part is an intersting point to ponder as well, it's a fine line to walk between "low cost mass market appeal" and "high end quality cutlery" Kershaw sort of walks that line, they have LOTS of low end but decent quality blades, and some AMAZING high end blades, not to mention the ZT line. Spyderco likewise has both, although not as many low end options besides the byrd line. I would honestly not be surprised to see more and more of the "Spyderco" line be headed towards the high end quality knives and dedicate the low end to the byrds. I mean, the Delica, Endura, Ladybug, and the like aren't going anywhere, so there will always be the great knives there, but I would be surprised to see many more NEW low cost actual Spyderco knives.

 

[Phil Elmore]

The fact that a product is available in Outlets A, B, and C has very little bearing on its perception. Customers don't care where else something can be had. They only care that they can find it when they want it.

 

[zenheretic]

As for it tarnishing Spyderco's reputation, it hasn't over the last several years when they WERE carrying the knife, and now that they aren't, I don't see it affecting Spyderco's reputation in any way.

My question has more to do with possible effects to the higher end knives Spyderco makes. For example, which would sell for more: a watch with the Tag Heuer brand or the identical watch sold under the Timex brand?

Let it Bleed. Do you enjoy picking scabs or what? Why do I ask? Well please read ousanas's quoted post above.

If you wanted to jump on the Walmart and Spyderco, in business together oh noez, dogs and cats sleeping together, complete pandemonium!!!!111 You are about three years too late. That topic quickly grew old back then, and especially old and not relevant now.

Walmart quit that contract about a year ago.

But hey, if nothing else, at least you earned a Jack Burton award. Cudos!

 

[ousanas]

Let it Bleed. Do you enjoy picking scabs or what? Why do I ask? Well please read ousanas's quoted post above.

If you wanted to jump on the Walmart and Spyderco, in business together oh noez, dogs and cats sleeping together, complete pandemonium!!!!111 You are about three years too late. That topic quickly grew old back then, and especially old and not relevant now.

Walmart quit that contract about a year ago.

now now zen, shiny footprints remember...

Anyway, while it may have come off in his first post sounding a little jabby at spyderco, I don't REALLY think it was meant that way. I think (assume) it was more in the way of a question from someone who didn't know the details of that relationship. His second post about it was also discussing the different brand/same manufacturer aspect of the byrd line being something that seems to be taylor made for wally world.

As an aside to LIB, the reason the Native was the Spyderco at Walmart was that they wanted a Quality, Name brand American made knife that was affordable. I think beside low sales the other reason (and this is just a guess) for them ending that particular relationship is they now have several very nice quality american made Kershaws that fit the bill.

 

[amen74]

I would buy a Spyderco knife from a gas station if the price was right. Spyderco would still be #1 in my book.:thumbup:

 

[ousanas]

I would buy a Spyderco knife from a gas station if the price was right. Spyderco would still be #1 in my book.:thumbup:

Agreed. I have almost no other knives now... One Bladetech mouse that I got a matching one for my father for his Bday, A Kershaw Lahar (that's up for trade for something spydie related if anyone is interested), and actually a Kershaw OD-1 I just picked up at WalMart today ironically.

As an aside, I wish Wal-Mart did still have the Natives around here, as I gave my last one to my brother in law as a Bday present and never got around to grabbing another before they dissappeared from my local store Oh well, I'll grab a regular again soon. Not to mention the spydie forum one....

 

[Josh K]

I would buy a Spyderco knife from a gas station if the price was right. Spyderco would still be #1 in my book.:thumbup:

If a gas station near me sold Spyderco's I'd make that my exclusive fill 'er up place.

Even if gas was $3 a gallon.







Okay, maybe not at $3 a gallon. :foot: