Period swords and modern swords

[SShepherd]

I was handling by shobu zukiri raptor katana and thinking about how robust and strong it was. It has some pretty heavy duty dimensions 13" grip, 30" blade , 7.6mm thick and 2lbs 11oz weight. I was wondering if period swords had similar dimensions or if they were generally smaller and of slighter build. Also in terms of strength and cutting ability were they similar or are modern swords so much more capable. I would assume modern swords are superior but how much more?

The swords were generally smaller, because the japanese people were smaller. That's not to say there weren't large ones made. I've seen 300 year old tanto that was 3/4" thick (perhaps they were ancient "stridersama" family )
Geometry varied from period to period and smith to smith, as did depth of the sori. One thing I've learned about japanese swords is there seems to be an exception to every rule.
Modern steel and heat treating are vastly superior to what smiths used in the past- which is point of contention for many a cool-aid drinker. They did the best with what they had, and did it very well. Remember, I'm not speaking of craftsmanship as I think some of the old swords still haven't been matched ( ofcourse that's my opinion based on my artistic taste)
Take a look at this site; http://www.nihontoantiques.com/
and find other stores that sell authentic nihonto, most give dimentions.

 

[JParanee]

If I am not mistaken you are asking about performance between modern and let's just say older swords

Let's start with modern swords

I have the same Shobu blade you speak of. It is a wonderful cheap practice blade. To compare it to one of my Hartsfields is like comparing a ferrarri to a camero they both can get it done but one just does everything better

Balance, edge geometry and temper of steel which translates to cutting ability is night and day between the 2 blades

There where some fantastic swords in ancient times when men lived and died by them so just like today it would depend on the blade and the care put into the important things

We just have an advantage in being able to start out with higher quality steel but the disadvantage of knowing how they would perform in battle

 

[Nternal]

I understand what you guys are saying about the skill of the user and everything but that was never my question. I don't how the thread turned in that direction other than some of you wanting to talk down to me.

 

[JParanee]

I hope you don't think I was talking down to anyone what I was trying to say is that sure a good base steel is Important but balance! edge geometry,weight and temper make for a great sword not just modern technology

 

[BePrepared]

IMHO, i'm finding that by far the most important feature in swords AND knives is the quality of the heat treatment. A blade with superior steel and inferior heat treatment will not perform even close to as well as a perfectly heat treated blade in a mediocre steel

Case in point Becker knives... their heat treat is second to none, but they don't use any of the super steels, just 1095 CroVan, and they can easily out perform and outlast blades of much more expensive steels

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

I hope you don't think I was talking down to anyone what I was trying to say is that sure a good base steel is Important but balance edge geometry weight and temper make for a great sword not just modern technology

^Yup! Exactly this. :thumbup:

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

Ditto, wasn't trying to talk down to you. I would probably agree with you if you said something like "modern production swords are better than period production swords," but then, that's mainly because there weren't that many period production swords outside of ones produced specifically for a combat like WWII or something, made by relatively unskilled craftsmen. A sword made by a master craftsman is always, IMO, going to be better than one made by an amateur or a hobbyist, and there just aren't as many craftsmen these days who really understand sword making and sword use. There are definitely some, and many of them are on here. I think that skill factor and just knowing how to build a sword in all of the various nuances will ultimately be far more important than modern steel or production techniques can make up for.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Ditto, wasn't trying to talk down to you. I would probably agree with you if you said something like "modern production swords are better than period production swords," but then, that's mainly because there weren't that many period production swords outside of ones produced specifically for a combat like WWII or something, made by relatively unskilled craftsmen. A sword made by a master craftsman is always, IMO, going to be better than one made by an amateur or a hobbyist, and there just aren't as many craftsmen these days who really understand sword making and sword use. There are definitely some, and many of them are on here. I think that skill factor and just knowing how to build a sword in all of the various nuances will ultimately be far more important than modern steel or production techniques can make up for.

There's much evidence that blades were produced on an industrial scale in many countries for domestic and foreign sale, especially in Germany and Italy. The blades would then be matched with fittings and assembled by a local cutler. Apparently bare blades have been found both with over-long tangs to be cut down to specific length, and ones where the "tang" was essentially left as a thick lump that would be locally forged out to the appropriate length and shape.