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Phoenix?
- Thread starter zman_11
- Start date
- Joined
- Aug 18, 2008
- Messages
- 3,681
That looks like the best ball lock yet; I wish I could afford one!
Firebat
Gold Member
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2000
- Messages
- 1,060
Three (ok, 3.5) things I did not like about mine:
1. Back end of handle is pointy as heck. Just like a custom Viele I owned, the tip of the handle ends in a point, and it's stabby. The handle edges are not radiused, just sharp unbroken 90 degree edges, and both the Ti handle sides and the micarta terminate into a the pointy shape.
This was a problem everytime my hand happened to brush up against the exposed butt end of the knife clipped into my pocket (it is afterall tip-up..) and then:
2. The ball bearing lock is very nice and effective, but it's a two-hands-to-close affair. As such, my natural tendency was to bring the knife up into my right hand, handle end pressed into my palm to help secure the knife while my fingers right fingers pulled back the lock and left hand closed the blade. Ouch. The point of the handle and sharp edges of the Ti slabs are quite uncomfortable. Were I able to operate the ball lock with one hand to release, maybe this would not have been an issue...not sure.
3. Lack of jimping on top of blade or foward-most part of handle. Just a pet peeve of mine, seems like a missed opportunity for additional nice (and functional) detail.
3.5. Knife showed up in little protective bubble baggie, but had copious amounts of scuffs and scratches on the exposed satin finish Ti. Honestly, it looked well used. Obviously eventually unavoidable if used daily, but kind of disappointing on a brand new knife. I bought a red box Benchmade Ti Pika once, and that thing was nowhere near the same league as the Phoenix...had the same kind of scuffs and scratches when it showed up. Sort of a bummer, albeit admittedly rare for Spyderco.
So I dunno. Were I to find out that mine was just an early fluke, I'd buy another, but that pointy handle is a deal-breaker for me as it stands. Maybe I could get a good customizer to smooth out the tail a bit, but even then I'm not sure that I like having to use two hands to close this one. (It is is a solid lock, that's for sure. Pretty impressed by that.)
1. Back end of handle is pointy as heck. Just like a custom Viele I owned, the tip of the handle ends in a point, and it's stabby. The handle edges are not radiused, just sharp unbroken 90 degree edges, and both the Ti handle sides and the micarta terminate into a the pointy shape.
This was a problem everytime my hand happened to brush up against the exposed butt end of the knife clipped into my pocket (it is afterall tip-up..) and then:
2. The ball bearing lock is very nice and effective, but it's a two-hands-to-close affair. As such, my natural tendency was to bring the knife up into my right hand, handle end pressed into my palm to help secure the knife while my fingers right fingers pulled back the lock and left hand closed the blade. Ouch. The point of the handle and sharp edges of the Ti slabs are quite uncomfortable. Were I able to operate the ball lock with one hand to release, maybe this would not have been an issue...not sure.
3. Lack of jimping on top of blade or foward-most part of handle. Just a pet peeve of mine, seems like a missed opportunity for additional nice (and functional) detail.
3.5. Knife showed up in little protective bubble baggie, but had copious amounts of scuffs and scratches on the exposed satin finish Ti. Honestly, it looked well used. Obviously eventually unavoidable if used daily, but kind of disappointing on a brand new knife. I bought a red box Benchmade Ti Pika once, and that thing was nowhere near the same league as the Phoenix...had the same kind of scuffs and scratches when it showed up. Sort of a bummer, albeit admittedly rare for Spyderco.
So I dunno. Were I to find out that mine was just an early fluke, I'd buy another, but that pointy handle is a deal-breaker for me as it stands. Maybe I could get a good customizer to smooth out the tail a bit, but even then I'm not sure that I like having to use two hands to close this one. (It is is a solid lock, that's for sure. Pretty impressed by that.)
- Joined
- Jul 20, 2006
- Messages
- 779
I see what you mean about the back of the knife....the way I grip the knife the point doesn't the base of my hand, I haven't carried it too much yet. The ball lock on mine is tight as well, I've found that spinning the ball a little with your thumb before you try to unlock it it will slide back easier.
Firebat
Gold Member
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2000
- Messages
- 1,060
What I was trying to describe is not an issue if you're using it as it is not apparent in the grip when opened ...it's just whenever you happen to come in contact with the rear tip or "butt" of the handle where I feel the design is less than ergonomically friendly.
I'm a righty, so imagine the knife is open in my grip. Now, I want to close it. To do that, I bring the back of the knife into my palm to stop the knife from moving as I pull the lock back with my index finger and thumb of the same hand; and I use my left hand to close the blade.
This seems like a natural way to close this knife and every time I did, I got stabbed in the palm when I applied the pressure to pull the lock back.
Also caught a nice scratch on the side of my hand from the butt end sticking out of my pocket in the clipped position. (I swear, there were no tears...ok, maybe one or two....
) but it was definitely an annoyance.Otherwise, I really dig the design and lines of the knife, but the issues I encountered really took the fun out of playing with it.
Firebat
Gold Member
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2000
- Messages
- 1,060
You can't tell that from those pics...you really have to see the handle from the rear, as if you were looking down the length of the knife or into the middle of the frame, not visible from the stock photos.
I handled one in a store today. It was very well made and I liked the ergonomics. I agree about the lack of jimping on the spine though, it would be better with it. I can close the ball lock one handed (Pinch with thumb and middle finger, push blade down with index finger then finish closing blade with my thumb) but the caged ball lock is much easier to operate one handed.
- Joined
- Jun 16, 2006
- Messages
- 1,411
I've heard (read) from multiple Phoenix owners about the scratches on the Ti on brand new knives. That bothers me a bit. When paying that price for a knife I would expect it to be in pristine condition, i.e., no scratches. I'll put em' on myself. 
But I'm still gonna get one though.
But I'm still gonna get one though.
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2005
- Messages
- 3,817
I agree with you, it sound very disappointing. Scratches, sharp edges.
I would still like it despite scratches (I could polish it myself) I am not sure the sharp edges (are they really very sharp?) would bother my as much as it does some. From what I hear it is easily customizable with a minimal amount of work.
What I do like is solid lockup and good fit which this knife (judging from what you guys are saying) has plenty of. I do like the white color handle.
I can understand why people would not want to have to provide the finishing touches themselves after buying a higher priced product. On the other hand this design is very unique and not exactly cheap to manufacture due to materials used (titanium.)
As far as edge is concerned if it came in Spyderedge maybe sales would not be very good with this knife for me I would have a hard time deciding whether I would want it in spyderedge or not.
However for models such as the police I picked Syderedge hands down.
I would hate to see the Phoenix go out of production due to lack of sales because it looks like a good solid design. I am definitely getting one.
What I do like is solid lockup and good fit which this knife (judging from what you guys are saying) has plenty of. I do like the white color handle.
I can understand why people would not want to have to provide the finishing touches themselves after buying a higher priced product. On the other hand this design is very unique and not exactly cheap to manufacture due to materials used (titanium.)
As far as edge is concerned if it came in Spyderedge maybe sales would not be very good with this knife for me I would have a hard time deciding whether I would want it in spyderedge or not.
However for models such as the police I picked Syderedge hands down.
I would hate to see the Phoenix go out of production due to lack of sales because it looks like a good solid design. I am definitely getting one.
Arrival finally? Well let me put it this way this thing rocks. Clear peel off plastic strips were on bolsters (no scratches at all.) I don't think my hands are going to get blisters anytime soon. If you don't like the acute angle of the front bolster it can be easily smoothed with a file and sand paper.
Keep in mind it is deliberately designed that way it is not a flaw.
Fit is excellent and finnish is very good (I like mirror polished blades but they are a bitch to do) The clip is nice and tight and the white micarta grips are not rough enough to harm your clothing.
It's unique design alone makes it an eye catcher and it does look classy (subjective.)
Shaving sharp blade with no play at all. The ball bearing lock engages a good portion of the the blade (it does not just hang off the tip of the edge of the blade tang/pivot) and you hear a good clunk and ping upon locking open. It is not a heavy nor light (medium heft.)
Satin finish on the titanium and blade
The ball bearing area is wide enough to easily facilitate one hand closing with bare hand or thin gloves, as per request of those of you who don't like knives that are hard to close. Good blade pivot pin and torx screw construction enables taking apart knife.
Overall knife is constructed to be very strong, simple, and reliable.
Negatives are that is not as light and comfortable to grip as the FRN handled folders, not as grippy as textured G10, it uses white nylon washers (I like phosphorous bronze) however it still opens (and closes) very smoothly. The clip holes and recess are drilled and tapped for tip up right handed carry only an empty indentation with 3 holes on either side of the grips would not look good on this knife so it is understandable. Ergonomics for me are not as good as endura or police model I like to grip it without my finger in choil this is totally totally subjective and dependent on ones hand size and profile.
Angles all along knife frame seem to be on the acute side particularly on inner aspects however sliding my fingers across with firm moderate force produced no cuts or scratches.
I am very satisfied with this knife and I do not anticipate an serious problems with it.
Keep in mind it is deliberately designed that way it is not a flaw.
Fit is excellent and finnish is very good (I like mirror polished blades but they are a bitch to do) The clip is nice and tight and the white micarta grips are not rough enough to harm your clothing.
It's unique design alone makes it an eye catcher and it does look classy (subjective.)
Shaving sharp blade with no play at all. The ball bearing lock engages a good portion of the the blade (it does not just hang off the tip of the edge of the blade tang/pivot) and you hear a good clunk and ping upon locking open. It is not a heavy nor light (medium heft.)
Satin finish on the titanium and blade
The ball bearing area is wide enough to easily facilitate one hand closing with bare hand or thin gloves, as per request of those of you who don't like knives that are hard to close. Good blade pivot pin and torx screw construction enables taking apart knife.
Overall knife is constructed to be very strong, simple, and reliable.
Negatives are that is not as light and comfortable to grip as the FRN handled folders, not as grippy as textured G10, it uses white nylon washers (I like phosphorous bronze) however it still opens (and closes) very smoothly. The clip holes and recess are drilled and tapped for tip up right handed carry only an empty indentation with 3 holes on either side of the grips would not look good on this knife so it is understandable. Ergonomics for me are not as good as endura or police model I like to grip it without my finger in choil this is totally totally subjective and dependent on ones hand size and profile.
Angles all along knife frame seem to be on the acute side particularly on inner aspects however sliding my fingers across with firm moderate force produced no cuts or scratches.
I am very satisfied with this knife and I do not anticipate an serious problems with it.
Day 2 this thing looks even better in direct daylight again the satin finish on mine did not come scratched and the white micarta grips imitate the look of ivory quite well.
I have had lock failure on lock back knives as well as even the compression lock due to lint and other debris that fall and wedge into the locking mechanism. With the ball bearing lock trapped debris is much less likely, would be quickly seen and easily cleaned.
Ball bearing locks do not quickly become weak and compromised when they wear but actually become even more secure with wear for a period of time. They should last and hold their integrity much longer than other types of locks. A visual inspection of the mechanism would enable anyone to put two and two together and figure that out.
I have had lock failure on lock back knives as well as even the compression lock due to lint and other debris that fall and wedge into the locking mechanism. With the ball bearing lock trapped debris is much less likely, would be quickly seen and easily cleaned.
Ball bearing locks do not quickly become weak and compromised when they wear but actually become even more secure with wear for a period of time. They should last and hold their integrity much longer than other types of locks. A visual inspection of the mechanism would enable anyone to put two and two together and figure that out.