Pitting on my blade:(

Joined
Nov 2, 1999
Messages
1,437
Today I noticed some pitting on the blade of my Sebenza. I am the fifth owner of it, and got it about six months ago, but before it got to me, it headed home to the CRK shop to be re-blasted, and blade repolished. The knife is about four years old, and has an ATS-34 blade.

Today I noticed minor pitting. I used a microscope at my lab, and saw that it was in fact very tiny rust spots. I hand rubbed flitz to try and get the spots out, but it didn't do the job...just made my blade a little more polished.

I have been wiping down with tuff-cloth and have been wearing it in a G2 leather sheath. I haven't exposed to wet conditions for any length of time.

Any suggestions on how to get rid of the rust/pitting?

Thanks,
Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
Hmmmm, quite strange. I wonder if the leather of the sheath absorbed moisture and together with the tanning acids caused the corrosion. Usually the ATS-34 should hold up just fine especially if satin and not bead blasted.

If the spots are so small that they are only visible under a Microscope (that's love
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) I wouldn't worry too much about it. More important is to find and eliminate the cause of those spots.
 
If I'm not mistaken, there was a thread sometime ago that discussed the corrosion effects of leather.....specifically the type of leather and the dye in the leather. It also stated that you shouldn't store or keep your knife/knives in leather sheathes.

You need to slow the corrosion process (once started technically you can never stop it) and treat it so that it doesn't get any worse. Send CRK a e-mail and ask them for their advise.......

Good luck.......

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GigOne
"Livin' Life - Full Throttle"
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"Happiness is a belt-fed weapon & a Walter Brend Model 2!"
 
I've either been lucky or it's a tribute to Kalguard but my one piece MkIV is remarkably rust free after many years of being left in the sheath (including the edge). Mind you it's not very humid in the north of England - a bit damp though
smile.gif


Mark
Originally posted by GigOne:
If I'm not mistaken, there was a thread sometime ago that discussed the corrosion effects of leather.....specifically the type of leather and the dye in the leather. It also stated that you shouldn't store or keep your knife/knives in leather sheathes.

You need to slow the corrosion process (once started technically you can never stop it) and treat it so that it doesn't get any worse. Send CRK a e-mail and ask them for their advise.......

Good luck.......


 
The pitting is actually visible with the naked eye...the spots are about the size of pin pricks. I used the microscope to see if there was rust in the pitting, and infact there was.
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I emailed CRK, and hopefully they will be able to get back to me soon. I really would like to try and solve this "problem." Maybe I just need to take the knife out of the sheath when it's not in use. Hopefully I can find some way of removing the pitting before it gets deeper.

Thanks,
Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
New Observation:

Most of the pitting has occurred near the pivot area, and the thumbstud. This part of the knife is not enlosed by the sheath, it is exposed. Perhaps that implies that the problem does not stem from the sheath.
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~Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
Here is the particular thread:


http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum54/HTML/002267.html

Corrosion is nothing more than the spontaneous destructive oxidation of metals. In reality, corrosion begins when the manufacturing process begins. All metals corrode; in our normal atmosphere of 21% oxygen, all metals except gold, platinum, and palladium corrode spontaneously. Corrosion takes place through an electrochemical cell. The two half-reactions use the corroding metal itself as both the electrodes and the electronic conductor of the external circuit. The ionic conductor is usually a film of aqueous solution on the surface of the metal.

All of us know that iron rusts, and that iron pipes corrode in wet soil. This reaction of corrosion is an electrochemical process. In many corrosion reactions the metal is oxidized to a soluble form. The cathodic reduction reaction of the cell is the reduction of the hydrogen ion, of oxygen, or of water.

The destructive corrosion actually occurs beneath the paint film at the edges of the crack, in the region of lower oxygen partial pressure. The mechanism of corrosion here is differential aeration; the greater amount of oxygen in one place as compared to another sets up a concentration cell -- a galvanic cell driven by a concentration difference for one or more species.

There are two basic methods of protecting metals from corrosion (after the manufacturing process). One is to slow down the process by reducing the rate at which the reaction can take place. The other is to reduce the electromotive force of the corrosion cell, or transfer the electrons by electronic conduction to a location where the corrosion can occur without harm. Slowing down the corrosion process is done with protective coatings. These help to keep out oxygen, water, and electrolyte salts. Electrolyte salts assist corrosion by reducing the electrolyte resistance in the corrosion cell; the presence of small salt crystals in the air is the major reason why metal corrodes more rapidly at seacoasts. Protective coatings are effective in preventing corrosion as long as they adhere firmly to the surface of the metal to be protected. There is a third process (alloying method). An example, when chromium or chromium and nickel are alloyed with the iron; this alloy is not only absolutely rustproof but will even resist the action of such corrosive chemicals as hot, concentrated nitric acid. The alloying method is probably the most satisfactory but also the most expensive form. Here is some info on the "less expensive" forms.

Cathodic protection from corrosion occurs when a metal to be protected is forced to be the cathode of the corrosion cell by coupling it to a metal more easily oxidized than itself. Metal fences and sheets made of iron can be protected by galvanizing them, which consists of coating them with zinc. The galvanized metal will not corrode until after the zinc coating does, since zinc corrodes more readily than does iron. For example, protection of an oil pipeline with a magnesium sacrificial anode. The anode will corrode but the pipeline will not. The magnesium anode can be replaced by an inert or iron anode if a continuous external power source is used to hold the iron anode at a magnesium potential.

In anodic protection from corrosion, the metal to be protected is briefly made positive to form a stable oxide film on its surface. The stable oxide film then protects the underlying metal from corrosion. This is effective for some steels. Other metals such as aluminum form a protective adherent oxide film by themselves. Stainless steels form a protective film of nickel/chromium oxides since they have a high content of these metals. Iron oxide does not form a coherent and adherent film on iron metal so iron oxide does not protect iron from corrosion. Aluminum metal is highly reactive to oxygen, but in the presence of air it spontaneously and rapidly forms a tough resistant film of aluminum oxide which protects the bulk of the metal from corrosion. The oxide film can be enhanced, and its properties changed, by anodization. Anodization is a process in which the aluminum is made the anode of an electrolysis cell using an aqueous acid electrolyte for a few minutes at comparatively low current densities. The resulting oxide film makes the aluminum more resistant to corrosion. The film can also be dyed with coloring matter since it is more porous and absorbent. A wide variety of anodized finishes are found on the aluminum parts of small appliances and household siding. Anodization is also used with magnesium, zinc, and titanium.

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There was an actual test performed that tested "Corrosion Produced by Leather in Contact with Metal." Here is the link:


http://www.astm.org/DATABASE.CART/PAGES/D1611.htm


But, it'll cost ya $20+ to get a copy.



[This message has been edited by GigOne (edited 10-09-2000).]
 
If it's near the thumbstud and the pivot area I wonder if it comes from touching the blade while you open it. Sweat can be very corrosive.
 
COme !

It's only microscopic tiny tniy spots!

Use your knife harder ! It should not rust if it's used a lot !

Elbow grease protect any blades !

I have been using a 1075 carbon steel knife and I don't have any spot of rust.

Because I use it all the time !

cheers,

JM
 
Yeah......what Nemo said!

UW Mitch, because you don't use this particular knife enough...... Send it to me immediately!
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We definitely don't want it to rust way!
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Hmmm I keep my Sebenzas stored in the sheath all the time and haven't come across any pitting or rusting yet, glad to hear it was outside the sheath at least!
I use veggy Tan leather and not that chrometan stuff that really can rust a knife just by being near it....

G2

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"The Road to Hell is Paved with Good Intentions!"
Take the time to read your Bible Now, don't be left behind...

G2 LeatherWorks
 
I suppose this is why I'm getting a TNT from Mayo...but really is there anything I can do remove the damage that has been done.

Maybe Mayo can make me a talonite Sebenza blade?
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~Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
Try a really fine brush and more Flitz to get into those tiny rust pits.
 
Send it back to CRK. I'm sure they will fix it! (No charge, if it's their fault...)

Michael

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He who has smelt the smoke is never free again...
 
C4,
The knife has already gone back to CRK for general refurbishing, which included re-polishing the blade, re-blasting the handles, putting a dual thumbstud, and shipping. I had a total of about $75 out of pocket for this.

I doubt one could say that rust is CRK's fault, unless the heat treat is bad. All steels have the potential to rust, some just are more resistant than others. I don't feel like dropping more $$$ to remedy this problem. It is MY OPINION that CRK has some of the BEST customer service around, but with that serivce comes a certain price.

sorry for the rant
frown.gif
as you can tell this is a bit of a sore spot for me.

~Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
I got an email response from Anne this morning. She said I could have it sent in to be cleaned up, or I could have a BG-42 blade put on (at a cost of course
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).

I already have dished out a fair amount of money for this knife, but realize I am the fifth owner of it. I'm probably going to just wait a while and replace the blade at some point.

~Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
Mitch:
If you are going to change the blade, have a damascus one put one. That will rea really dress up the knife!
 
Curious....What is the cost for a new blade?

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Keith D.Armacost
If The Women Don't Find You Handsome,
At Least Let Them Find You Handy. R.G.
 
A damascus blade would be nice, but I don't think it would be a great match with completely plain handle slabs. I'd need some wood inlays too
wink.gif


Anne said they could install a BG-42 blade at a cost of $105 plus shipping and insurance.

Perhaps I will sit around until they start doing blades in Talonite
biggrin.gif


~Mitch

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My Hobby Page
 
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