Please help! Stabilized wood problem!

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Apr 9, 2006
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I was working on a stabilized wood handle and found a soft spot about 3/4 of an inch long by about 1/8 of an inch wide. I'm afraid to buff that section, fearing that the buffer wil tear out the soft wood. Is there any way to "stabilize", or fix this small section so life can go on? I'm almost sick over it, I was up to 1000 grit when I noticed what was going on. Thanks for any help! -Matt-
 
I was working on a stabilized wood handle and found a soft spot about 3/4 of an inch long by about 1/8 of an inch wide. I'm afraid to buff that section, fearing that the buffer wil tear out the soft wood. Is there any way to "stabilize", or fix this small section so life can go on? I'm almost sick over it, I was up to 1000 grit when I noticed what was going on. Thanks for any help! -Matt-

What is it stabilized with and what wood is it? Was it vacuum stabilized?
 
Ray , I got the wood from an E-bay store. The seller vaccuum stabilized the wood from what I got from his store info. I've never worked with it before, so I didn't know what to expect,but noticed it smelled like some kind of varnish. It works up well and does not soak up water or anything and the stabilizing agent seems to have gotten through all the wood. This is kind of a border line spalt line area where it happened. -Matt-
 
Ask the seller what they use to stabilize their wood. If it is not methyl methacrylate or an acrylic based stabilant you will probably continue to have trouble. There is a reason the big stabilizers use the stabilants they do.
 
Would I have to dilute the superglue or just use as is?
Use thin superglue.

You cannot dilute superglue. Once the polymer chains start linking you cannot break them. Mike Fitzgerald made a great post a couple years ago explaining how super glue hardens.
 
What wood is it as that makes a big diffference in your next move?

It was stabilized spalted curly mango wood from East Bay Turning Wood and Burls. Not the wood that makes the difference, it's the location of the soft spot in relation to the handle, and I'm almost done sanding to final dimension. A small chunk of wood actually fell out, leaving a void that can be fixed, but I need to get th rest of that section of wood hardened, before I can move on to buffing. I hope that makes sense. :confused:

Chuck, thanks for the info on the glue and stabilizing. I'll be sure to buy from the people who do stabilizing using the proper stuff from now on! -Matt-
 
Yeah I'd go with the superglue idea or a water based polyacrylic that will soak into the wood a little. Superglue is easier and will probably work fine though.
 
Super glue the place with thin cyanoacrylic.
These wood sellers that "Stabilize" the wood by vacuuming it in a pot of Nelsonite or other compound, are not doing the business any favor.What I consider stabilized wood is impregnated with a cured acrylic resin.
Stacy
 
Super glue the place with thin cyanoacrylic.
These wood sellers that "Stabilize" the wood by vacuuming it in a pot of Nelsonite or other compound, are not doing the business any favor.What I consider stabilized wood is impregnated with a cured acrylic resin.
Stacy

I'll definitely be spending the extra money from now on for the quality stuff. Not that I was trying to be cheap, I just really liked the wood, and when it arrived smelling like varnish, I was suspicious, but didn't know, since I've never worked with it before.

I've got the superglue super-saturated in the wood at this point and waiting for it to dry completely. I owe everyone here a big thanks for being so fast to answer with good advice, so THANKS GUYS!!!:D -Matt-

P.S. Matt, don't sweat it, it's not a hijack if the info's relevant right? ;)
 
Ray
Have you had problems with Staburl? Just wondering as I've used quite a bit of Jim's stuff w/out problem.
Thanks, and sorry to hijack greaseman
Matt Doyle

No, actually on the contrary I think Jim is probably the best and most affordable stabilizer there is right now. That's why I was asking though because I know he uses the right stuff to stabilize wood. He may actually even do special orders and colors for you if you email him. Last time I ordered 6 sets of double dyed box elder burl scales from him and he only charged me $50 bucks (and he provided the wood on that). I couldn't believe it. His stuff always finishes up awesome too!!
 
What I consider stabilized wood is impregnated with a cured acrylic resin.
Stacy

Not to hijack this thread, but what is the process and materials for doing this right? It seems like we're always hearing that vacuum impregnating with Nelsonite or wood hardener isn't really stabilizing, but it seems like nobody will step forward and explain the proper technique. Everything else in knifemaking has been open-book except this one thing. :confused: The big guarded secret of commercial quality wood stabilizing.

-Ben
 
Not to hijack this thread, but what is the process and materials for doing this right? It seems like we're always hearing that vacuum impregnating with Nelsonite or wood hardener isn't really stabilizing, but it seems like nobody will step forward and explain the proper technique. Everything else in knifemaking has been open-book except this one thing. :confused: The big guarded secret of commercial quality wood stabilizing.

-Ben

Vacuum stabilization (impregnation) with a cured acrylic resin would be the correct way!
 
Thanks Ray! You had me sweatin! I have several hundred dollars worth of his scales, and feel the same way that you do about the quality of material. The thing I like most is that you can ACTUALLY SEE the piece of wood you are buying. Tha's why I only have a few sets from WSSI or K7G
Matt
 
There's no secret, except maybe the exact conditions each place uses. The wood is impregnated with a "monomer", the precursor to a polymer. It is called "methyl methacrylate" (MMA). In it's polymerized form it's called poly (methyl-methacrylate) or PMA. I have heard that one place uses two different monomers, but that part's a secret I believe. If MMA is polymerized all by it's lonesome into sheet form PMA, we refer to it as Plexiglas, BTW.

The wood is dried to an optimum moisture content, I believe 7% is maximum, 3% is better. It is then placed in a "bomb", or heavy vaccuum, pressure chamber and covered with the MMA. The wood is then subjected to cycles of vaccuum and pressure (and I think some heat as a consequence). The pressure's important, just like in pressure treated wood. Most of what the vaccuum does is suck air out of the pores in the wood so liquid can take it's place. Pressure forces it into the fibers of the wood. After full impregnation with the monomer, the blocks are removed and set on trays/foil where they are spritzed with an "initiator" (usually a peroxide, guys who tried this at home used Noxynol-9, the acne medicine from the pharmacy) which causes the monomer to polymerize and form large molecules called "acrylic plastics", or PMA.

To understand the difference with "home" methods: the stuff like Minwax Wood hardener and Nelsonite are typically acrylics already polymerized, ground up and then dissolved in solvents. Thus, you saturate the wood and then the solvent dries back out leaving the plastic behind. So, when you stop to think about it, if the solids content of the MW is 30%, 70% acetone and you wet the whole block inside, when it dries out only the 30% solids are left behind, so coverage can't be as thorough as with MMA impregnation.

The big difference? The home stuff "coats" the wood internally, whereas the pro procedures can essentially turn the wood into a big continous block of plastic due to the post-impregnation catalytically initiated polymerization.

Hope someone else understood that besides me. Made perfect sense as I wrote it, but I'm not sure..... :)
 
Thanks Ray! You had me sweatin! I have several hundred dollars worth of his scales, and feel the same way that you do about the quality of material. The thing I like most is that you can ACTUALLY SEE the piece of wood you are buying. Tha's why I only have a few sets from WSSI or K7G
Matt

Sorry for another rabbit trail. Do y'all buy off e-bay or does Staburl/Jim
have a website? Goggle only has the ebay stuff
 
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