Plumb Scout Axe Timeline Paper

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Feb 28, 2013
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With the help of Steve Tall's research and countless hours of my own, I put together this Plumb Boy Scout Axe Timeline paper to help everyone date their BSA axes. It took over a year, but it was a fun project. I hope you enjoy reading it and using it to date your Plumb Scout Axes. :0)

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1EsJA490PbH_zii5sxPRPINgfkL193ccY/view?usp=sharing

Thanks to LegionPrime for getting a better link to the pdf. :)
 
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Won't open for me! I guess you have to be of the 'mesmerized/hypnotized by the interactive tiny screen' generation to be able to see this.
 
Hmm...it opens on my computer and my phone. I wonder if you have to have Facebook in order to open it. I’ll see what I can do when I get home.
 
Awesome, thanks !
I think I like the 1938-1950 pattern the best ( obviously a stamp had changed but it was still the same )
 
Awesome job, Ryan!

Here's hopin' that I can find a Plumb BSA that will lead to a revision of this excellent paper. ;-) (Though I think that you have probably cataloged all of 'em. But a fella can dream, right? ;-) )

Chris
 
Awesome job, Ryan!

Here's hopin' that I can find a Plumb BSA that will lead to a revision of this excellent paper. ;-) (Though I think that you have probably cataloged all of 'em. But a fella can dream, right? ;-) )

Chris
Go for it Chris!! I’ll gladly add it to the list if you find one. :)
 
Wow, Landodnal. My compliments. Very generous of you to share your careful and thorough sleuthing with us. Many users and collectors will be seeking out (and referring to) this extensive compilation. I notice that right side (along with the more conventional left side) Plumb stamps feature in there, much like they do with other Nationals. You've covered Plumb Guaranteed and Plumb Genuine stamps too, something that has puzzled many of us (me for sure).
 
Wow, Landodnal. My compliments. Very generous of you to share your careful and thorough sleuthing with us. Many users and collectors will be seeking out (and referring to) this extensive compilation. I notice that right side (along with the more conventional left side) Plumb stamps feature in there, much like they do with other Nationals. You've covered Plumb Guaranteed and Plumb Genuine stamps too, something that has puzzled many of us (me for sure).
Thank you 300Six. I tried to be as OCD as I could. I know there are still a few discrepancies where there was limited information. As time goes and my collection of Plumbs gets a little bigger, I’ll try to update the paper.
 
Thank you 300Six. I tried to be as OCD as I could. I know there are still a few discrepancies where there was limited information. As time goes and my collection of Plumbs gets a little bigger, I’ll try to update the paper.
You're competently taking over (with regard to BSA (Boy Scouts of America, and not famous Birmingham Small Arms)) from from wherever 'keener' (and (at one time) collector extraordinaire) Operator1975 left off. And you're gratefully acknowledging the research wizard powers of Steve Tall. No man (researcher) is an island! All power to you for cashing-in on (and giving credit to) to any and all that are involved in this. But you deserve the majority of credit for patiently searching/gathering up oodles of niggly details and putting all of this information together.
 
I would love to do another paper focusing on a different company (Collins, Kelly, etc.), but none of these companies had near as large of an advertising campaign as Plumb did. At least as far as I’ve been able to find. There’s just very little information on the internet in regards to specific details for dating heads made by these companies.
 
I would love to do another paper focusing on a different company (Collins, Kelly, etc.), but none of these companies had near as large of an advertising campaign as Plumb did. At least as far as I’ve been able to find. There’s just very little information on the internet in regards to specific details for dating heads made by these companies.
Plumb sure did promote their product. Still plenty of questions though. Really good information you guys have put together. The time frame for the Genuine vs Guanteed I found the most interesting. I wonder if it parallels the other lines?

I hope that more vintage catalogs get shared on the net. As those will greatly increase our knowledge.
 
I've gone through this 'booklet' some more and am really impressed with how much information you gleaned via catalogues and corroborating with actual specimens. Where did you access all of these? Is there a 'mother lode' library source (Girl Scout HQ Archives?) that you came across or was much of this painstakingly scoped-out online?
Your timeline for the BSA National patterns is further affirmation of the timeline for regular National versions; an official start date of 1948 (with some early release versions (1947?/1948 up until the Sept patent approval) being stamped 'Patent Applied For') and an end date of 1972, which coincides within the following year of the Ames takeover. Judging by the self-explanatory catalogue ad pictures; the fact that quite a few Nationals are stamped on the right (similar to many brands of rafting heads) may well haven been a simple expedient to allow prominent decal/label placement on the left.
 
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I have a Scout head, bought at a flea market some years ago that I was sure was a pre WWI version due to its lack of nail notch. I see now it's a 1950 or so "National" head with the "Genuine Plumb" rather than the "Guaranteed" Plumb. I had to re-haft it myself so I don't know if it's early or the later 1956 with a plastic seal.
Great info!
Thanks!
 
I have a Scout head, bought at a flea market some years ago that I was sure was a pre WWI version due to its lack of nail notch. I see now it's a 1950 or so "National" head with the "Genuine Plumb" rather than the "Guaranteed" Plumb. I had to re-haft it myself so I don't know if it's early or the later 1956 with a plastic seal.
Great info!
Thanks!
You would have remembered if the original haft was set in epoxy because the stuff is a sonovagun to remove.
 
I've gone through this 'booklet' some more and am really impressed with how much information you gleaned via catalogues and corroborating with actual specimens. Where did you access all of these? Is there a 'mother lode' library source (Girl Scout HQ Archives?) that you came across or was much of this painstakingly scoped-out online?
Your timeline for the BSA National patterns is further affirmation of the timeline for regular National versions; an official start date of 1948 (with some early release versions (1947?/1948 up until the Sept patent approval) being stamped 'Patent Applied For') and an end date of 1972, which coincides within the following year of the Ames takeover. Judging by the self-explanatory catalogue ad pictures; the fact that quite a few Nationals are stamped on the right (similar to many brands of rafting heads) may well haven been a simple expedient to allow prominent decal/label placement on the left.
Thanks again 300Six. Believe it or not, this was done with over a year of pain staking research. Google Books became my best friend along with google images and a few other sites. I literally pieced a puzzle together that was spread across the interwebs, lol. But it was a lot of fun. I seem to have an affinity for researching and compiling information. Bladeforums had a lot of the pieces scattered throughout its posts, just no one had put them together into one congruous thought. Now for the National pattern. Interestingly enough, I don't believe the National Pattern was ever granted a patent. If it was, I cannot find it in any patent database. September 10, 1948 was when Plumb copyrighted the phrase, "Here's the new Plumb National Axe." I wish I could find evidence of the patent, but its still a mystery. The only indications we have are the copyright date, which does mention the "NEW" national axe which is pretty self evident, and we also have the National Pattern heads that have Patent Applied for on them. But since those heads don't have dates stamped into them, we can only assume they were the earlier of the national pattern heads manufactured. With the copyright date, you'd think we could just assume it was 1948 which coincides with the release of the national pattern to the boy scouts. But then comes the Plumb Victory National Axe. The Victory logo was advertised from around 1942 to 1944. It was meant to raise support for the war efforts toward the ending of WWII. So the advertising stopped in 1944. But does that mean they stopped producing the Victory axes in 1944? Not necessarily. Maybe they were produced up until the late 1940's which would make sense why we have some national pattern heads with the Victory stamp. But I'm only speculating. Is it feasible that Plumb continued to manufacture these heads three years after the war was over? Your guess is as good as mine. The other option is that Plumb began producing the National Pattern in the early part of the 1940's, but due to the war did not get a chance to push advertising for the head or produce it in mass quantities. As I said in the paper, the 1940's were a busy decade for the Plumbs. Fayette R. Plumb II joined the war efforts by serving in the military. William Plumb died in 1944. And factory management changed hands. It's totally possible they had the design built for the National Pattern in the early 1940's but did not get a chance to really market it until around 1948. If you look at most Plumb Victory axes and hatchets, the finish is less refined. You can see grind marks from the factory that would usually have been smoothed out, but did not because production was being rushed for the war. The interesting part is the Victory National axes have this same unfinished look. So if the National Pattern really didn't come out until 1948, that means plumb continued to manufacture the victory line for at least 3 years after the war, AND the factory lines where these heads were being made with the unfinished look continued as well after the war for multiple years. Again, this is all speculation, but it is very interesting. These questions may never be answered. Time will only tell.
 
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Thanks again 300Six. Believe it or not, this was done with over a year of pain staking research. Google Books became my best friend along with google images and a few other sites. I literally pieced a puzzle together that was spread across the interwebs, lol. But it was a lot of fun. I seem to have an affinity for researching and compiling information. Bladeforums had a lot of the pieces scattered throughout its posts, just no one had put them together into one congruous thought. Now for the National pattern. Interestingly enough, I don't believe the National Pattern was ever granted a patent. If it was, I cannot find it in any patent database. September 10, 1948 was when Plumb copyrighted the phrase, "Here's the new Plumb National Axe." I wish I could find evidence of the patent, but its still a mystery. The only indications we have are the copyright date, which does mention the "NEW" national axe which is pretty self evident, and we also have the National Pattern heads that have Patent Applied for on them. But since those heads don't have dates stamped into them, we can only assume they were the earlier of the national pattern heads manufactured. With the copyright date, you'd think we could just assume it was 1948 which coincides with the release of the national pattern to the boy scouts. But then comes the Plumb Victory National Axe. The Victory logo was advertised from around 1942 to 1944. It was meant to raise support for the war efforts toward the ending of WWII. So the advertising stopped in 1944. But does that mean they stopped producing the Victory axes in 1944? Not necessarily. Maybe they were produced up until the late 1940's which would make sense why we have some national pattern heads with the Victory stamp. But I'm only speculating. Is it feasible that Plumb continued to manufacture these heads three years after the war was over? Your guess is as good as mine. The other option is that Plumb began producing the National Pattern in the early part of the 1940's, but due to the war did not get a chance to push advertising for the head or produce it in mass quantities. As I said in the paper, the 1940's were a busy decade for the Plumbs. Fayette R. Plumb II joined the war efforts by serving in the military. William Plumb died in 1944. And factory management changed hands. It's totally possible they had the design built for the National Pattern in the early 1940's but did not get a chance to really market it until around 1948. If you look at most Plumb Victory axes and hatchets, the finish is less refined. You can see grind marks from the factory that would usually have been smoothed out, but did not because production was being rushed for the war. The interesting part is the Victory National axes have this same unfinished look. So if the National Pattern really didn't come out until 1948, that means plumb continued to manufacture the victory line for at least 3 years after the war, AND the factory lines where these heads were being made with the unfinished look continued as well after the war for multiple years. Again, this is all speculation, but it is very interesting. These questions may never be answered. Time will only tell.
You are correct about Nationals presenting a real puzzle. That I know of, none of us have definitive answers on Plumb Victory models because as you say if Nationals first came to light officially in 1948, whereas Victory versions of all Plumb patterns were solely a wartime expedient, then where does a Victory model Plumb National fit in? There are enough of them around in axe forum/collector circles not to have been one-offs or prototypes and I don't recall any of them having the 'Pat Applied For' stamp on them either.

"Nationals" were an intriguing 'entirely new' Plumb pattern that came to market when it was alarmingly obvious (to axe makers) that fledgling (but rapidly evolving) chainsaw technology was going to ruin the commercial market for axes. Were these 'eye candy' products akin to the 'tail fin' and 'bumper bullets' in the auto industry that signaled the beginning of rampant fashion-consumerism in north America? I 'took a shine' to Nationals long after they were gone for no reason other than visual appeal. But are these any better than conventional Daytons and Michigans for backyard or recreational use? I don't use an axe to make a living so I really don't know.
 
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