Pocket Knives? What gives???

Teague

Teague

Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
633
There are a load of pocket knives for sale on ebay. Rough Rider, U.S. Classic, Smith and Wesson, German Rooster, German Owl Head are some of the cheap brands that are available.

Then there are Marbles, Case, Queen, Boker etc. that are much more expensive.

My question is this: Are the expensive knives that much better that they command so much more money?

I can buy a knife in the first group for about $10 (including shipping). With the exception the Marbles, the Case, Queen, and Boker are at least three times that much! The Marbles knives are in between at around $20.

So, what gives here guys/girls? I haven't bought these kinds of small pocket knives very often before. I'm thinking of buying a bunch as gifts and as barter items if the economy keeps going south.

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Here's a Rough Rider Copperhead Imitation Abalone. 3 3/4" closed. 440 stainless clip and skinning blades that sold for $7.51 including shipping.

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Here's an inexpensive Case XX Peanut Yellow Black Widow Knife 2 7/8" closed. Brand NEW in box! That sold for $31.50.

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And, here's a Marbles Coke Bottle Fluted Honey Bone. 5 3/8" closed. Stainless clip blade that sold including shipping for $13.51. It has a little case with it.

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Your first list plus the marbles are made in China, the Case and Queen brands are made in the USA. Boker has some knives made in Germany, some in Argentina and some in China so prices vary greatly on that brand. Makes a difference if you are paying someone a livable wage in the USA or Germany and what is being paid in China. In rare exceptions the quality of the knives made in China is as good as made in USA or Germany, RR is usually brought up as having very good quality, but many other China brands are not up to the same fit and finish and quality of steel used in USA or Germany made knives.
 
This is full of generalizations but a rough idea.

Some of the Chinese knives are very good, and for $10 cannot be beaten.
Boker, Henkel, and the less expensive Case knives are better, the Fit and Finish, and they start at $35.
These brands become more expensive as the scale material gets better.
Case is the market standard, a US brand, you can judge other knives by it.
Case has created a collector market, so they have a huge range with different scale material, And I do not know if they are worth it.
Queen is a very good US brand, often with D2, and these start at $45.
Then you move in to Canal Street, and Schatt & Morgan, both US brands, which start at $60 and these are the top of the production knives.

A $35 Boker will last you forever.
I do not know about the Chinese knives.
And as you spend more money, yes the quality is that much better.

Interesting, even the more expensive slipjoints are often cheaper than many linerlocks or lockbacks.

Nowadays, I would rather spend $50 on a three bladed stockman in D2 with Stagbone scales than a single bladed one-handed opening locking knife. (and I have plenty of them!)
 
Thanks for the input. I saw that several of the Queen had D2. I can see how someone would get caught up in collecting. All I could get from the Marbles website is that their knives were manufactured "Internationally." But, the ones (Marbles) I've purchasec seem to be very good quality knives?
 
I just got a few of the Marbles knives, I'm pretty sure they are made at the same factory as Rough Rider.

For a good working tool, there's nothing wrong with either Rough Rider or the Marbles brand. I have a few Smith & Wesson slipjoints too and they're pretty good for a working knife too.

IMO Case knives are very high in terms of value per dollar paid, while the low cost imports are hard to beat , Case makes a very nice product at a fair price. Try a Case Med Stockman or Trapper, you'll get a well made knife and will be able to see the difference.
 
Teague said:
There are a load of pocket knives for sale on ebay. Rough Rider, U.S. Classic, Smith and Wesson, German Rooster, German Owl Head are some of the cheap brands that are available.

Then there are Marbles, Case, Queen, Boker etc. that are much more expensive.

My question is this: Are the expensive knives that much better that they command so much more money?
Click to expand...

As others have said, you are paying for country of manufacture. Sal Glessar has said that you can cut the cost of a knife in half by manufacturing in China. As far as being worth the extra, many US knives are no better in quality as working knives than many of the Chinese knives.

It also depends on how many layers of corporation are having to be paid. Spyderco is a stand-alone. Case is a division of Zippo. So I would guess that they have to make more profit on a knife than Spyderco. That would drive a bigger price differential than merely production costs. Just a guess, mind you. I've not seen the accounting sheets.
 
Great posts! Thanks everyone! I've purchased over 70 pocket knives of various manufacture this past week and am impressed (in the less expensive knives) with the Marbles and Rough Rider brands. The Marbles are very well made and all I can get on their website is that they are "internationally" manufactured under Marbles strict quality controls other that it does say "China" on one of the blades. I still think Case is the standard that all these other pocket knives can be judged by.

IMO, it really comes down to a business concept called "economies of scale." labor is so cheap in China that many Chinese companies can virtually assemble these knives for pennies compared to the dollars it takes to assemble them in the USA. China has such a HUGE competitive advantage in the LABOR input that it startles other countries that are so desperate to compete. It's a wonder that not ALL the manufacturing jobs in MDCs (more developed countries) like the USA haven't fled to China. As the economy gets tighter here and China becomes more affluent, I think we'll see the status and price of goods produced in China increase. So, I’m going to stockpile as many of these little gems as I can to use as barter items when/if the economy fails. Besides, I've already got all the other survival items I'll ever need (including PMs). So, this just makes sense to me.

What are your thoughts?

BTW, I found this link to be very helpful...

http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/wr_case/about_case_knives/handle_material.php
 
Teague said:
I'm thinking of buying a bunch as gifts and as barter items if the economy keeps going south.
Click to expand...

Teague said:
Great posts! Thanks everyone! I've purchased over 70 pocket knives of various manufacture this past week and am

IMO, it really comes down to a business concept called "economies of scale." labor is so cheap in China that many Chinese companies can virtually assemble these knives for pennies compared to the dollars it takes to assemble them in the USA. China has such a HUGE competitive advantage in the LABOR input that it startles other countries that are so desperate to compete. It's a wonder that not ALL the manufacturing jobs in MDCs (more developed countries) like the USA haven't fled to China. As the economy gets tighter here and China becomes more affluent, I think we'll see the status and price of goods produced in China increase. So, I’m going to stockpile as many of these little gems as I can to use as barter items when/if the economy fails. Besides, I've already got all the other survival items I'll ever need (including PMs). So, this just makes sense to me.

What are your thoughts?
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The more items of foreign manufacture you buy, the faster the US economy will fail. The best thing any American can do for the US economy is buy a fuel efficient car, preferably one that is US made.
 
knarfeng said:
The more items of foreign manufacture you buy, the faster the US economy will fail. The best thing any American can do for the US economy is buy a fuel efficient car, preferably one that is US made.
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Let's see, Hum! That would be a Honda or a Toyota - wouldn't it? The problem is that there isn't much manufactured in the USA any more. Even the military is outsourcing almost everything. :(
 
knarfeng said:
As others have said, you are paying for country of manufacture. Sal Glessar has said that you can cut the cost of a knife in half by manufacturing in China. As far as being worth the extra, many US knives are no better in quality as working knives than many of the Chinese knives.
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I am totally not discussing the politics.

Labour is cheaper in China, so the production cost are lower and you can produce a well made slipjoint knives for $10 a piece.

When you look at the more expensive production slipjoint knives, the quality of the knife is a quantum leap better, and this increase in quality is reflected in the price.

The question is, if the skill set, expertise and quality control was availiable in a cheap labor country, how much would these cost?
 
the rough rider knives have impressed me and make wonderful starter knives for youngins and excellent users, price cant be beat, excellent choice of long gone patterns too. Case knives can be pricey but the sodbuster jr yellow handle CV steel, excellent fit and finish and razor sharp 19 bucks. might give it a look:D
rough rider gets my vote:thumbup: for affordable gifts to youngins and non knife nut people, ya just might get a few interested and create a new knife nut or two:)
cheers
ivan
 
I just did a non-scientific test.

One of my daughter was visiting me.
She has a good eye for quality.
I gave her a really nice RR stockman in Sawbone, a Boker Stockman, and a Queen Stockman.

I asked here to rate the quality just by looking.
She rated them, RR, Boker, and Queen.

I then asked her to price them.
She doubled the price for each step in quality.

As I said just anocdotal, but interesting.
 
Teague said:
Let's see, Hum! That would be a Honda or a Toyota - wouldn't it? The problem is that there isn't much manufactured in the USA any more. Even the military is outsourcing almost everything. :(
Click to expand...

The majority of Hondas are built in Marysville, Ohio. Most Mazdas are built outside Detroit. BMW has a plant for their Z series in Georgia.

Foreign name does not always equal foreign built.
 
I prefer old nice quality slippies, even with some blade wear, versus a new chinese one. And if you check that auction site you can get them cheap. I'd rather have one nice old Schrade than 5 of the new ones.
 
Of the dozen or so assorted slip-joints I own I find the Queen (inc Schatt & Morgan) and Victorinox to be of the best quality. Another thing to mention is that many of these knives seem to hold their value pretty well. Which basically means that in several years the chinese knives will only be worth the $5 or so you paid for them (if that), while a Queen or Schatt will be worth many times more than that. Personally I like my knives to hold at least some value, so I dont buy the $10 knives anymore.
 
I just picked up my first rough rider it's the sodbuster with a brass liner lock. I put it next to my dad's old case and schrade knives and the rough rider has just as good fit an finish as any of them and when opened the blade has no play in it and was razor sharp. I paid 9.99 for it with free shipping from smkw. This knife has gotten me intrested in collecting more tradition styles and most are gonna be rough rider cause it's what I can afford.
 
The OP is in ID - home of some fine US-made knives - Buck! A trip to Wally World will reveal the Buck 503 Prince and 110 Folding Hunter - both $25 - and terrific bargains. While you are there, look at the Spydie Native in S30V for $40. These are all US-made and very decent quality. Sure, there are those Buck 370-seies PRC-made slip joints. Try to find a Buck 301 Stockman - a great US-made bargain @~$22. I do have a few PRC-made knives - some folks thought I wanted them. I have a bunch of US-made - and German-made - knives... I can tell the difference between them and the PRC-made knives, as I am sure most can. I'll buy fewer - but nicer - and non-PRC-made, too. YMMV.

Stainz
 
A lot has been said about RR knives in this thread and I agree that they are very good knives for the money. However, I like the Marbles knives even better. For the money I don't believe there is a better knife anywhere. Have any of you had any experience with Marbles knives?
 
Rough Rider knives got me so exited about slippies again that I just purchased 3 Case knives in the last 3 weeks. So in that way a Chinese manufacturer actually helped an American one.:) By the way I did the "rate these knives" thing with my non-knife-nut wife and she instantly rated the Case knives as being the highest quality by far with RRs a distant second followed by Schrade (USA) then Boker.
 
I say collect what gives you enjoyment while hopefully not putting you in debt.

I agree with something Oupa mentioned a while back - it is tough to beat an old Swiss Army Knife. Here's one of my old ones - 54 years old, and still (or again?) a smooth & solid as a rock user. Got that old Remington next to it pretty cheap, too (blades are worn, but I like it anyway).

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