Possible clone

rcb2000

rcb2000

Joined
Apr 15, 2014
Messages
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Hi Guys and Gals,
I never come over to this part of BF, but hope to have a reason one day (i.e. an amazing Sebenza in my hand)
Had someone at work show me their new Small Sebenza,, and immediately alarms went off in my head, as I have handled a real one (which are spectacular)
Before I begin I totally am aware that, as the saying goes "This thread is useless without pictures" applies here,, no worries,,I am getting them! It was a little weird to say "hey let me take a picture of this,, I think its a fake"

Heres what I saw.
*Small Sebenza, once side was all carbon fiber,, but the carbon fiber looked ,,, unfinished.
*Bought off eBay for a 'good price'
*The biggest thing I noticed,, it that the thumb stud wasn't blue,, neither was the concaved screw by the lanyard hole
*Had some blade play when it was half-closed.
*Dont know how to describe it,, but just didn't feel right. Got the same feeling when some idiot proudly showed me his fake PM2..junk.

I understand none of these means it a fake,,, but the silver thumb stud thing for sure threw me off,,,
Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

thanks
 
The thumbstuds can come in silver and so do the lanyard pins.

The carbon fiber scales are pretty "finished" though... Maybe it was worn? I happen to think carbon fiber doesn't age well especially with hard use.
 
Good to know,, I'll get pics asap. I doubt he was looking for a fake,, he's a huge japanese chefs knife junky... Carters, etc
I hope its not a fake..
 
I'm not an expert by any means, and I don't have a small sebenza, and....I'm a newbie with CRK knives; but to me the most alarming point would be the blade play when half closed, I have closely inspected the design and construction of a large 21, and these do not allow any blade play in any position: the blade pivot hole takes a perfectly machined hardened stainless bushing, and this in turn takes in a perfectly machined pivot screw which even if loose will not allow any play at all; I just verified this with a large plain that I have. Thanks for posting, I am learning more because of your post.
 
makariotes said:
I'm not an expert by any means, and I don't have a small sebenza, and....I'm a newbie with CRK knives; but to me the most alarming point would be the blade play when half closed, I have closely inspected the design and construction of a large 21, and these do not allow any blade play in any position: the blade pivot hole takes a perfectly machined hardened stainless bushing, and this in turn takes in a perfectly machined pivot screw which even if loose will not allow any play at all; I just verified this with a large plain that I have. Thanks for posting, I am learning more because of your post.
Click to expand...

I forgot, the clearance between the parts I mentioned is probably one or two ten thousands of an inch, I haven't measured them, but they're tight, that is what makes a sebenza a sebenza, the manufacturing tolerances, I think.
 
I just got my large sebenza 21 carbon fiber, but for some reason I cant post pics for you to compare,

If you mess around and try to make it open "smoother" and polish the discs holding the blade, even .001 of an inch, it will have blade play, or if the screw is not tightened enough it will have blade play.
 
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makariotes said:
I forgot, the clearance between the parts I mentioned is probably one or two ten thousands of an inch, I haven't measured them, but they're tight, that is what makes a sebenza a sebenza, the manufacturing tolerances, I think.
Click to expand...

Grandmaster said:
I just got my large sebenza 21 carbon fiber, but for some reason I cant post pics for you to compare,

If you mess around and try to make it open "smoother" and polish the discs holding the blade, even .001 of an inch, it will have blade play, or if the screw is not tightened enough it will have blade play.
Click to expand...

Very true.

One of the large 21's I had in the past had the slightest bit of movement when half open. More of a vertical?? Movement. I found a lot of threads and other people with the same experience.

However......none of mine EVER had a side to side movement of any kind.

Pics will definitely help.
 
Pictures would help a lot. I'm pretty new to CRK but my first one was the small cf insingo, I think the same you described. I've been carrying mine daily and using it at work and home. The blue thumb stud isn't quite as blue as new, seems to wear quickly and as for the carbon fiber, it looks good at an angle but it's not the best finish looking straight at it because it's used and carbon fiber doesn't wear nicely like other materials (micarta for instance). I have no idea if it's real or not and with pics I still probably wouldn't know 100% but I can say my used small cf sounds somewhat similar to what you're describing. It could just be a well used piece
 
I'll try to get them tomorrow,, it's a strange request but I'm really curious if my suspicions are correct
 
Just say you want to take a picture so you can use it as reference to find one yourself! Or just be honest and tell him you suspect it may be a (good) fake.
 
I don't know that blade play really sets off my alarms. Unless it has been toyed with or put together incorrectly there should be no blade play. I know with my large 21 if it's not put together correctly it will hang up and let you know something is wrong. I have never had it come back with blade play after a cleaning,even if I did inadvertently screw up the assembly the first time. I guess depending upon how much play there is it could be wear, but even then I suspect the play would have to be minimal. From what I can see it's like a Ferrari, it either goes together perfectly and goes like a bat out of Hell or it does not, and VERY bad things start to happen. At least that's been my meager experience with my Sebenza.
 
Gizler00 said:
One of the large 21's I had in the past had the slightest bit of movement when half open. More of a vertical?? Movement. I found a lot of threads and other people with the same experience.
Click to expand...

There can be some play between the pivot bushing and the blade when the knife is half open. This is due to the small gap that's necessary to fit the pivotbushing into the hole in the blade. It's most noticable when you pull/push the blade against the pivot.

This can sometimes be mistaken as side to side play, but it's not.
 
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Sorry for the lag in time,, didn't see him for a bit... Here we go.
So I put together a list of common clone characteristics:
Hole for detent ball on fake
Concave lanyard pin on real
Back of thumb stud should be blue on anodized
Rounded vs straight choil
Counter sunk clip on real


2a9t8gz.jpg

This is the one that got me,,, lugs look very different
o8h4eb.jpg


2eauqgz.jpg


mwfa51.jpg
 
Looks like a Franken=Sebenza.
The lock side looks very much legit, but the thumb stud looks totally wrong.
Would be nice to see a pic of the entire blade, because it looks to be fake by the thumbstud.
And that's definitely a homemade CF scale and back spacer.
 
Real. Although I question the CF scale. It looks aftermarket and probably came with the backspacer.
 
I knew that carbon fiber looked weird
And the thumb lugs for sure aren't legit,,, but if the rest of the knife were real why would you put fake lugs on it?
 
They look like Benchmade thumb studs from knives like the 710. They are wider and the ridges offer a little more bite than the stock Sebenza.

I prefer the aesthetics of the original lugs but these probably make it a bit easier to open one handed.
 
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