Post Co Vid Quality Control

MikeC

MikeC

Joined
Sep 16, 2005
Messages
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Given the total and complete rearrangement of the global supply chain and numerous other economic head winds with inflation.

Anyone getting suspicious manufactures might start or have already long since started cutting corners with materials and/or craftsmanship/workmanship?

I, along with numerous other people are noticing it, in lots of other products. I think it’s only logical to expect to show up in knives at some point, if it hasn’t already.

Just 1 example, what if blade thickness was reduced by a few 10,000 of an inch, doesn’t seem like much but across 10s of thousands of knives on a model run, could add up savings for manufacturer.

Maybe the heat a few degrees less on heat treat ir just a few minutes less in the kiln?

Thoughts?
 
Most companies are doing this type of thing constantly, in just about every market.

One of the main reasons I frequent this forum is to weed these companies/makers out and try to stick with those that buck the trend of constant “cost savings”.

Will more companies do it now vs. before covid? I doubt it.

Folks who aren’t just out for maximum money are already a rare breed, and I don’t see some supply chain issues changing their values fundamentally.

(But keeping my fingers crossed).
 
I don't think anyone is cutting a few thou off anything dimensionally.

What I do see, are price increases to offset pandemic-induced supply chain material and manufacturing issues, which will still take some time to stabilize post-Covid.

It's a lot easier to simply raise prices by a few cents (or dollars), rather than muck around with CNC and tooling setups to save a few thousandths of an inch.
 
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If a maker reduces the blade thickness to save fractions of a cent on material costs, the knife will no longer assemble correctly.

If there’s a cut, it’s in shipping/receiving, development and marketing. Cuts in operations only slow the manufacture of new knives and defeat the intent of getting new knives into the market as cheaply as possible.

I can imagine a scenario where a manufacturer reduces production rate to meet cost constraints, but intentionally reducing quality is brand suicide.
 
Errrr, right when I got into knives, Ontario swtiched from 1095 to 1075, not that I have an issue with 1075, but they didn't do it for any type of reason but cost-saving. I think it had something to do with the whole global chain being affected, yeah.

Also, you can say "Covid", just don't talk politically. There are no censors here to beat by posting it like that, and you can't beat what isn't allowed like that, because a person is looking at it. To my understanding, you can use any clean words you want here, as your topic is ultimately about knives. I am sorry, I am not trying to "mini-mod", it is just that the "Co Vid" thing looked like an attempt to subvert censors that do not exist :)
 
The only knife I have that seems like this might have happened is with the Ontario Bushcraft field knife. I knew they switched to 420hc from 5160, but the blade stock was much, much thinner than the original.

I thought it might be a fluke, so I got a second one and it was the same.

I felt a bit bamboozled as it was advertised as same stock thickness. The ones I have are so thin they could pass as filet knives.

Coincidently, the thin geometry cuts fantastic though, and I use one of them quite often as a camp kitchen knife.

I don't think this falls in the same category as the OP's concerns, but I did feel like I was taken for a ride.
 
MolokaiRider said:
The only knife I have that seems like this might have happened is with the Ontario Bushcraft field knife. I knew they switched to 420hc from 5160, but the blade stock was much, much thinner than the original.

I thought it might be a fluke, so I got a second one and it was the same.

I felt a bit bamboozled as it was advertised as same stock thickness. The ones I have are so thin they could pass as filet knives.

Coincidently, the thin geometry cuts fantastic though, and I use one of them quite often as a camp kitchen knife.

I don't think this falls in the same category as the OP's concerns, but I did feel like I was taken for a ride.
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Oh, I remember my one issue with the Ontario steel switch - they were still advertising 1095 long after the switch to 1075. Fine with the steel, but it wasn't cool that the change wasn't disclosed. Imagine buying some Spyderco upped to VG-10, and receiving CTS-BD1, across the board all over, for 6mo after downgrade, it wouldn't be accepted. (not that Spyderco did any such downgrade, just example).

It is because are "just 10xx" series that this is considered okay, or that it isn't talked about, I think. It is principle for me. I love Ontario, but still believe in honesty. I am not one of those people, but some people do find that to be a big enough difference, and they could pass their return window before the steel change info stumbles through their lap.
 
Too many factors to reduce the thickness even in a fixed blade. Likely not happening on a standing model. Certainly not in a folder where tolerances are very tight and a few thou can make it too tight or loose to make work.
 
Rolled steel (blade stock) is produced and sold in specific thicknesses, typically with certification that proves exactly what it is and it's thickness within certain tolerances. It's simply not feasible to reduce the thickness of a blade to a non-standard measurement to try and save money.

Putting less cereal in a box is easy, producing thinner, non-standard blade stock is a lot harder and would actually cost more money than it would save.

Like has been said already, knife makers can simply raise prices. That's the easiest and cheapest thing for them to do. Or they can simply use thinner standard thickness steel.
 
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The specs are out there. If you see changes to them: just report it to the rest of us.
But I doubt that the major manufacturers will change much...
 
Ok, maybe the specs was the wrong way to phrase it. How about quality of steel coming out of the plants, the screws for the pivot, heat treat, skilled labor to work the plants or assembly the knives. It appears there are numerous problems across many types and kinds of markets, especially for commodities and materials. One would think it only reasonable to assume that is has effected the market for all manufactured goods to some degree? So I was just wondering if anyone has seen it show up in knives bought since say 2020,. Moreover, is anyone apprehensive now about making purchases of knives made during this time, again say 2020 through current.

Case in point, I'm holding off on buying 2 spyderco para 3, not that I don't have confidence in their product, I don't know about the manufactures of all their parts? Who knows, steel, screws, handle slabs, pivot pin, stop pins, etc. Again, if its impacting nearly every durable good product and others such as food products, its got to have worked its way into knives. Just wondering to what extent, and when will it show up and be readily apparent or obviously visible to the end user?

Hope this helps clarify the question.
 
shane45-1911 said:
I don't think anyone is cutting a few thou off anything dimensionally.

What I do see, are price increases to offset pandemic-induced supply chain material and manufacturing issues, which will still take some time to stabilize post-Covid.

It's a lot easier to simply raise prices by a few cents (or dollars), rather than muck around with CNC and tooling setups to save a few thousandths of an inch.
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In steel supply I have had a lot of mills running at max and min tolerances on raw stock.

You'd be surprised what steel mills will do to save a couple hundred dollars and or run an extra 50-100ft of material per master heat.
 
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Hashishiin said:
Oh, I remember my one issue with the Ontario steel switch - they were still advertising 1095 long after the switch to 1075. Fine with the steel, but it wasn't cool that the change wasn't disclosed.
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Um...no. Not even close to correct. This post details exactly why Ontario did it, and yes, it was disclosed. Dealers aren't always up on keeping their product listings. I can name a dealer that has multiple errors on its website.
 
I feel that knives being built today are as good or better; than those of the past...
 
Haven't noticed it, but it would be pretty hard to unless you handled a LOT of knives. Honestly, if there are any issues happening I would guess it's probably more due to staffing problems than any conscious attempt to cut costs. Everyone everywhere is short staffed right now, and I doubt knife manufacturers are immune to it.
 
Tafkaag said:
Um...no. Not even close to correct. This post details exactly why Ontario did it, and yes, it was disclosed. Dealers aren't always up on keeping their product listings. I can name a dealer that has multiple errors on its website.
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I'm an "Ontario Truther". We don't believe Ontario actually wrote that message, but rather, aliens with the ability to time-travel.
 
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