Preliminary car shopping - Rants and Raves

B

Bob W

Joined
Dec 31, 2000
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Wife and I have been in the early stages of shopping for new automobiles, one each. She wants a four-door for incoming baby, upscale interior, and good traction for winter driving. I want a two-door, convertible, maybe a two-seater. So today while in "the city" (aka, Pueblo, Colorado) we stopped by a couple of dealers for preliminary visits. Just checking out the options, and hoping to eliminate some names from the huge selection of vehicles available

RANT: very few of the cars I wanted to see are physically available at dealers. Nothing convertible at the Toyota dealer. Honda S2000 not in stock. Chrysler Crossfire not in stock. Pontiac G6 convertible not available for several months.

RAVE/RANT: wife really likes the Chrysler 300C. To me, it's a cavernous monstrosity, but what wife wants... Trouble is, you upgrade to a decent engine, add an option package, and add an accessory or two and these are very expensive vehicles. Additionally (see RANT above) the all-wheel-drive model is not in stock.

RAVE: Wife really likes the '05 and '06 Avalon. She actually test drove one today and liked the power (268HP), comfort, and interior features (I rode in back seat and it felt like the rear of a schoolbus). It's not too expensive unless you buy the absolute top of the line model. Still, we'd like to save some $$ and buy used or a new '05 that's discounted. Same old story, none in stock...

RAVE: Just on a hunch we stopped at the Lincoln dealer and sat in a used '03 Lincoln LS. V8, fantastic interior, 280HP, loaded with toys including a touch-screen radio and navigation system. Price seems OK too. But it's a rear-wheel-drive. Salesman says that the LS has great traction anyway because of the weight balance (50% of weight in the rear) and traction control system. Anyone comment on this?

RANT: Lincoln dealer also has a newer Thunderbird, the only one in town. But it's an automatic... the automatic with the manual override would be very cool.

HUGE RANT FOR PONTIAC, with a bit of RAVE: Rave first. The Red Tag prices on the G6 Coupe and Sedan were very low. Even the turbo models were inexpensive. Now for the RANT: The Pontiac G6 is one of the most uninspired vehicles ever - trying to blend in with the sea of Camry/Accord look-a-likes it seems. The interior was equally unimpressive. Blah.

Next up, the Pontiac Solstice. Beautiful car! Abso-freakin'-lutely beautiful. Perfectly designed interior, great curves, and unique appearance. The trouble with the Solstice? Pontiac has been hyping this car as a low-price competitor to the Miata. And for sure it looks better, in and out, than the Miata. Pontiac's advertised msrp is $20,000 - $25,000 depending on options. But the actual selling price of the Solstice was $29,000 due to a $5,000 "street value markup". No red tag sale on the Solstice, and few have been made available for dealers to fight over. :mad: I hope they choke on it. Dumb-asses.

Didn't have much time in "the city" today, but we'll be back for more test driving and note-taking. Hopefully a bigger city next time...

Best Wishes,
Bob
 
I noticed the other day that the decently powered (280 hp?) Infiniti G35 is available with four doors, full time AWD and, I believe their auto tranny's include that neat manual shift feature. The price is reasonable too, at least when compared to Acura, BMW, Audi and Lexus. And, IMHO, the styling of the G35 has the Avalon beat by several orders of magnitude. I swear I can't even tell the difference between the Camry and the Avalon just by looking. You may even be interested in the G35 coupe. Same amount of power and even dramatically better looks than the sedan.

I also see that you were looking at the Pontiac G6. By chance did they have any GTOs in stock? Admittedly the styling is only marginally more inspired than the G6, but mygod man, where else are you going to get 400 hp these days for $34K.
 
I can comment on the Lincoln. At one point my wife had a Mark VIII with rear wheel drive and traction control. She commuted 25 miles each way up a fairly nasty hiway and had to go to work no matter what. She had absolutely no problem with the Lincoln. On at least one occasion she got messed up by a truck and she said the TC kicked in and she drove right out of the problem.

Good luck,
Win
 
Bronco,
I didn't notice if Pontiac had a GTO in stock or not. But I think it has the same styling (or lack thereof) as the G6.
I swear I can't even tell the difference between the Camry and the Avalon just by looking.
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You're right, they look very similar on the outside. The real difference is the interior - the Avalon's interior design is far superior. And the Avalon is significantly larger and has a better engine.

We didn't go to an Infinity dealer, if there is one in Pueblo. Too bad the two-door G35 isn't available in convertible. I've seen pictures and those are beautiful cars. I'll definitely look into the four-door for wife. I want to show her the Jaguar X and a Lexus also (would be buying used if getting those brands).

Win,
I drive a Mark VIII now. It is better on ice than my similar Cougar was, because of the Lincoln's traction control. Still, the tiniest bit of snow/ice and we leave it parked. It can't get up the hills in town with even the slightest bit of ice/snow. It is a beautiful car though, and has a perfect interior. Too bad there's nothing like it from Lincoln any more...

-Bob
 
Ya know who's doing some great cars these days? Cadilac. Yeah, I know the stereotypes, but take a look and see if you might end up in a Caddy.

With baby on the way, safety has to be your number one concern. That means no convertible. Sorry.

For safety, check out Mercedes, BMW, and Volvo. Several years ago, a friend of mine bought himself a brand new E-Class Mercedes. Just days later, he got t-boned badly in an intersection. The firemen who pryed the cars apart so he could walk out said, "Good thing you were in a Mercedes."
 
With baby on the way, safety has to be your number one concern. That means no convertible. Sorry.
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What? Even if the baby's strapped down???

Just kidding. Sedan is for wife and baby. Convertible is for me. :D

Thanks for the tip on caddy/mercedes. The four-door Cadillac that I like is the STS, not the brand new ones, but a couple of years ago. Unfortunately, I think they're rear-wheel. Wife really likes the new Caddilac-somthing-or-other, but they're way out of her price range. Maybe in three years she can buy a used one. Don't know much about Mercedes, but to be affordable, it'd have to be an older car. We aren't necessarily looking at brand new vehicles, but don't want to go older than 2-3 years.

How about the Lexus ES300? Just showed wife some online photos of the interiors. Looks eons ahead of Toyota, including the Avalon.

-Bob
 
Well, wife didn't like photos of G35 coupe...

Like I said, we're still in the preliminary stages of shopping for wife's four-door. We didn't have much time to spend in town yesterday, couldn't visit every dealer, and only test-drove one car.

Just wanted to share what we found, particularly my disappointment with Pontiac.

Best Wishes,
Bob
 
Closest I have been to Pueblo is Bozeman and Livingston MT, lots of Audis there, also what about Subaru?
 
also what about Subaru?
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Haven't looked at any yet. But I know wife will not like their sub-standard interiors.

The Tribeca interior is incredible! But the car is a big ugly station wagon. If only you could get the Pontiac G6 with a Tribeca interior... Heck, why not a Miata with a Tribeca interior! Daydreaming away...

Wife's brother had an A4 Audi. Something in the engine kept blowing... The A6 gets good reviews though. We haven't been to the Audi dealer either. I like the TT roadster!

-Bob
 
Well to each his Bob, I been in some Subaru’s and seemed quite adequate to go from point a to point b which is all I use a vehicle for. One question, if you were going to put kids in a car which kind of interior would you prefer?
 
Hi All-

A two-door coupe gets "old" for anyone who has to live with them for awhile...whether they have kids or not. Rear doors are mighty handy for extra passengers, hanging jackets on a hanger so they don't wrinkle, or carrying delicate cargo where you don't wish to use the trunk.

~ Blue Jays ~
 
One question, if you were going to put kids in a car which kind of interior would you prefer?
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Well, I doubt the kid is going to display preferences of vehicle interiors for several years. :) And the kid will be in a carseat too, and in the back seat, so I doubt the interior and driver's ergonomcs will matter to him/her anyway. :) But to me, the often driver, it's very important. Leather is also a 'must' - I don't think dog hair and baby spitup ever comes clean from cloth. Fortunately, even the crappiest cars nowadays have a leather option.

A two-door coupe gets "old" for anyone who has to live with them for awhile...whether they have kids or not.
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I've never owned anything but a two-door, not will I ever. That's why the new sedan is going to be Wife's. I can't argue with her reasoning for wanting one - access to the carseat in the back seat. But I also can't go without a car that suits me.

I been in some Subaru’s and seemed quite adequate to go from point a to point b which is all I use a vehicle for.
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Can't argue with that. In fact I presented similar logic to wife, "Who care what the outside looks like? When you're driving you can only see the inside." She didn't buy it. I guess, considering the price of modern vehicles and wide variety of cars available, there's no reason to settle for something that isn't going to make her happy.

With car shopping there are several factors I consider: exterior style, interior design and ergonomics, features and accessories, and performance. Once in a blue moon you come accross an affordable vehicle that accels in each of these areas (used Lincoln Mark VIII). Most times though, it's a balancing act of sacrafices.

Best Wishes,
Bob
 
Bob W said:
Well, wife didn't like photos of G35 coupe...
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Well, if she didn't like the coupe then there isn't a chance in hell she'll like the sedan. :)

As far as convertibles go, perhaps the Nissan 350Z warrants a look. Again, the car seems to represent something of a bargain in this category.
 
Well, wife didn't like photos of G35 coupe...
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Well, if she didn't like the coupe then there isn't a chance in hell she'll like the sedan.
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Oops. I mean she didn't like the G35 Sedan. She did like the coupe, and we could buy one to replace the Mark VIII if it weren't for incoming Baby.

There is a good reason you can't find a good used Avalon. People keep 'em.
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That's what I'm hoping. There are plenty of '04 and older Avalons, but '05 was the first year for the nice interior. Would be great to find an '05 lease return, factory demo, or heavily discounted leftover new. We left our name at the dealer in case something like that shows up.

As far as convertibles go, perhaps the Nissan 350Z warrants a look. Again, the car seems to represent something of a bargain in this category.
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That's definitely on my list to test drive. Beautiful cars, especially in blue.

-Bob
 
Buy. We're high-mileage drivers and I tend to keep cars for as long as they last.

-Bob
 
Bob W said:
Buy. We're high-mileage drivers and I tend to keep cars for as long as they last.

-Bob
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I see NM as a location, what do you average a year, 20k or so. I cant seem to get under 20k a year here in AZ and thants not counting any vacation trips.
 
Yeah, that's about right. 20,000 - 30,000 miles/year, on each vehicle. Plus 5,000/year on my motorcycle. I love to drive and travel, every trip to 'town' is 190 miles total, and I drive 80 - 130 miles round trip to work. Wife doesn't drive to work, so most of the miles are mine.

Some leases, the last I checked into it, only allow 12,000 miles/year! Would be OK for an urban family's extra car.

-Bob
 
My wife describes the typical car driven by an American as a "costume."

We treat our automobiles as transportation and not as toys, costumes or status symbols.

We've done the four wheel drive thing, and found it didn't do any better than front wheel drive in snow.

So, front wheel drive.

People shouldn't have to crawl into your back seat through the front door just to satisfy your sense of fashion and style, nor as a concession to your ego.

Four doors.

It takes gas to make a car go, and gas costs money.
Get a high gas mileage car.

We have owned three Suzukis, all manufactured by DaeWoo.
They don't break, they drive great and they don't cost very much to buy or to operate.

My wife loves her Speed Yellow Chevy Aveo, made by DaeWoo and marketed in Canada and Europe as a Suzuki Swift.
I got it new for $8700 and it gets 35mpg even with my leadfoot wife driving it.
My wife commutes 50 miles round trip, daily, through some of the toughest winter driving in America.

Nice car, nice radio, nice heat, nice seats, nice windshield wipers and defrosters.
What more could a person want?

A costume? :)
 
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