Problem with John Smith

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Nick Stathopoulos

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Nov 10, 2012
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Hi, this is my first post, I was advised to write here in order to find help.

I commissioned a katana from John Smith. I paid 500$ on Deember 2010 before he started working on the blade and I would have pay an additional 500$ upon delivery. Projected time of completion was 6 months afterwards. 2 years and many excuses later I have received nothing. He didn't reply to my emails, so I created a thread about my problem in another forum where he writes and also sells his blades. He is logging in there often but he never responded to the accusations. Last time we communicated he said to me that he had the blade finished and ready to ship, although he couldn't send it because he was afraid it would be confiscated by the local authorities (which wouldn't happen as I 've assured him). Later I learnt that he was lying; when he was telling me that he had the sword and just wouldn't ship it, he had already sold it to another client. And it was not the first time he treated a customer this way. Any help towards a solution will be greatly appreciated.

This is the last step before pursuing the case in court.

^^^ THIS John Smith is NOT:

John W. Smith (Kentucky)
John M. Smith (Illinois)
J.D. Smith (Massachusetts)
Monofletch
 
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Barry H said:
Just to clarify, are you talking about John W. Smith, out of Kentucky?
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Yes, he is John W. Smith but I 'm not sure if he lives in Kentucky. Someone brought to my attention an address of his in Waynesboro, Pennsylvania.

jeepin said:
Well obviously not, or he wouldnt be trying to pursue him in court.
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Obviously, yes. I don't want to go to the court, especially since it 'd be an international case, with the difficulties this comes with, but, if it has to be done, let it be. What bothers me the most isn't the money, it 's the behaviour. When you treat someone nicely and he is kind but then turns out to be a fraud....I don't know, it 's a very nasty feeling. Saying lies, like I 'I got the sword but I won't send it to you', when in reality you have sold it to someone else, or getting lost and not responding to emails for months are the worst ways of treating a customer. And since this is my second experience with a bladesmith I know it shouldn't be like this.
 
It's not the same John Smith I am thinking about. "John Smith" is probably the most common name in America, if not the world.
 
gregorio said:
i doubt the site is under construction. It is probably ready to go and just on hold; he probably needs to pay his web developer.
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either that or he is covering up by deleting the only way to get a hold of him.

sounds like the usual "in over there head" saying, and he bit off more than he could chew and is in a hole.

either way it sucks for the OP

oh and I have done some searching and found that 5 months ago he couldn't make the annual meet at the local gathering because he said he was going through hard times with his new job.

not too sure if hes still in MD or not, but if he has the OP's money he should either refund or fulfill his end of the order.
 
^^^ THIS John Smith is NOT:

John W. Smith (Kentucky)
John M. Smith (Illinois)
J.D. Smith (Massachusetts)

All well respected makers with names of John Smith. There must be others.

Coop
 
Thanks, Coop! If we don't get better information soon, I am going to close the thread and let it drift into obscurity. Too common a name, it's making good men look bad. I don't see where the deal has anything to do with BF or BF members.

The "other forum where he writes and also sells his blades" is the proper place to pursue this. I doubt he even knows he has this allegation to answer here. Without his input, and especially without a certain ID of the man, this is a dead end.
 
Esav Benyamin said:
Thanks, Coop! If we don't get better information soon, I am going to close the thread and let it drift into obscurity. Too common a name, it's making good men look bad. I don't see where the deal has anything to do with BF or BF members.

The "other forum where he writes and also sells his blades" is the proper place to pursue this. I doubt he even knows he has this allegation to answer here. Without his input, and especially without a certain ID of the man, this is a dead end.
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Already done it to no avail. As you can see we IDed him. I do not mean to disturb other reputable knifemakers with the same name, I just got the recommendation by one of your members that BF is the place where many customers found solution to their problems with bladesmiths and I came here.

wolf5391 said:
are you talking about this guy?

http://www.youtube.com/user/smithforge?feature=watch

if so I believe the last time I talked to him he was in cascade MD near Frederick MD.
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Yes, it 's is him alright. When did you speak with him last time? Are you sure he lives in MD? Look here http://www.tradekey.com/company/Smith-Forge-LLC-1566512.html . It is confusing.
 
Nick Stathopoulos said:
Already done it to no avail. As you can see we IDed him. I do not mean to disturb other reputable knifemakers with the same name, I just got the recommendation by one of your members that BF is the place where many customers found solution to their problems with bladesmiths and I came here.



Yes, it 's is him alright. When did you speak with him last time? Are you sure he lives in MD? Look here http://www.tradekey.com/company/Smith-Forge-LLC-1566512.html . It is confusing.
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like I said its been a while since Ive talked to him. Maybe 2 years or so ago.

he lived only 2 hours from me then and I was planning on visiting his shop.

I'm not too sure if he is still in MD. He stated he had gotten a new job and things were hectic, so he might have moved to PA and got a different job.

the link you have is too vague though and that's the problem. There are so many John W. Smiths out there that could own some business called smith forge.

plus, John to my knowledge worked by himself and this link said there was 1-5 employees.

I'm sorry I cant be more help, but I think you should send him link to this thread so he can chime in if he chooses to.


EDIT: I checked my emails and the last date I had contact with him was 6/17/2010. A bit longer that I had thought so my information is clearly outdated.
 
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SharpByCoop said:
^^^ THIS John Smith is NOT:

John W. Smith (Kentucky)
John M. Smith (Illinois)
J.D. Smith (Massachusetts)

All well respected makers with names of John Smith. There must be others.

Coop
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Nick Stathopoulos,You should cut & paste Coop's post & put it on the top of your original post.I agree with others that this name is way too common & this thread could be slanderous to honest makers with the same name.
Lots of people don't read past the first post or the first couple of sentences that show from a google search.

I hope you get your money back.
 
SharpByCoop said:
^^^ THIS John Smith is NOT:

John W. Smith (Kentucky)
John M. Smith (Illinois)
J.D. Smith (Massachusetts)

All well respected makers with names of John Smith. There must be others.

Coop
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.....please include me-- I am not the John Smith you are looking for either!!! I would hate for someone to get the wrong idea! :D
 
I just communicated with the seller. Here is his message and my answer to him:

Nick Stathopoulos said:
John w Smith said:
Nick

If you want a blade that I can ship to Greece with out any problems, then it will have to be smaller less that a 30" nagasa. So the balls in your court now the current blade takes it over the mark and more charges incur. So reforge a smaller blade?

I do not appreciate you running around complaining to people because you are not getting your way. I told you early on about the Laws in Greece and even though you told me to just declare it all in an invoice, is still not enough. Those laws are in a affect for a reason, plus the cost to ship the blade is as I stated in earlier emails well in excess of $300 to which I am not sure why they are so high.

This is my conclusion

John
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Firstly, you did not tell me about the laws and it was not early. I mentioned the whole process you have to go through, when I told you that I 'm importing another japanese blade. You told me about the laws this year, while you knew from the first minute that you are dealing with someone who lives abroad, with the difficulties this comes with.

And since I 've already gone through this process once, I know exactly how this works; what you say about length limitation is false, all needed from you is a signed statement describing the blade (not an invoice), in which I 'd tell you exactly what you need to write.

Secondly, if you do not appreciate me complaining about your business, you should reply to my emails and personal messages. I am not complaining because I 'm not getting my way, we had an agreement, I kept my end and you didn't. It 's only right I complain and I 'm the only one who can make demands now. Also, I didn't secretly diss you, I did it publically, in the forum you write and sell your stuff, so if you felt the accusations were false, you could have responded at any time with your own argument....but you didn't because you know the truth and you know I have stored all of our communication as proof that what I say is true.

Thirdly, you continuously lie. You were telling me you can't just ship the sword due to this technicality (which as I said above is also a lie) but at that time you had already sold it, as I can see in this thread http://www.swordforum.com/forums/showthread.php?110333-W-2-30-quot-Shinogi-Zukuri-Katana-For-Sale . And this is not the first time you say to somebody the lie that you can't ship to their country, while you 're selling the blade to someone else, you did it with Lee James Bray too http://www.swordforum.com/forums/showthread.php?109778-Problem-with-Bladesmith&p=1181047#post1181047. I guess China and Greece have similar policies about swords....

So let me see what are you trying to do here. You took 500$ from me for a specific katana I commisioned, you took 1200$ from somebody for the same blade and now you are also trying to sell me a smaller, different than what I ordered blade. A perfect solution for you: you get to close the case, take more money and unload one more blade from your stock.

But I had enough of this, so we will do it the right way: my sword or my money back. You can either send me the exact blade I ordered (30 inches, shinogi zukuri, o-kissaki, choji hamon, W2) until the end of the month or issue me a full refund together with a public apology in this forum. Otherwise, I will pursue the case in court.

I 'm going to make your message and my answer to you public, hope you don't mind.

Nick
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