Profound Cultural Question

[Dave K]

Walosi-

You are right, the "new for 2000" one is the one that I have, though it was actually purchased in late '99.

I noticed at some point that Garud grew some arms; my Garud doesn't have any.

Also, I'm pretty sure that my Garud is made from rosewood and not saatisal as the HI website states.

And hey, if we can make sirupati and kobra Garuds, then how about a Garud katana as a sort of Nepali "Highlander" reproduction?

Uncle Bill could sell it with the Queen CD, too!

-Dave

 

[Walosi]

Dave:

I've been looking at the wood and although I can't identify it, I've come to the conclusion it isn't saatistal. It has some slight golden sap grain toward the blade, but none in the carved portion, and I've completed enough coats to show grain down to about 2'

It is heavy, dense, and a perfect carver's medium - definately selected by someoe who knows exactly what he is doing.

Uncle Bill, are there other examples of carvings beside blade handles? The workmanship is self-evident, and a plaque, or a couple of figures would make a heckuva backdrop to display a couple of nice knives against. A plaque of the kami diety behind a couple of Terry's racks with dragon figurines on either side would even step up one of the presentation rigs. Nice accessory line to add to the shopping page?

I think I've Khaught a khunew bug

 

[ruel]

1. I had the same thing in mind: carved presentation racks! I think I'd prefer free-standing ones, since all my wallspace is taken up by bookshelves.

2. Yvsa: $22.50 for a keris? Wow! I need to visit that store!

The pamor on that blade above is 'beras wutah' (scattered rice grains), I think. Whenever I don't know the pamor, and it seems kind of random, I guess 'beras wutah' which seems to be the "default" pamor.

"And if you're like me and at least one other you will get a very nice feeling from using a beautiful tool for plain utilitarian tasks." It's not a plain task if you can do it with style, right?

"Garud" must certainly derive from Sanskrit "Garuda," since nearly all Sanskrit derivatives adopted the final -a deletion. Nepali, though, isn't derived from Sanskrit so maybe it didn't translate exactly. 'Garud' still means eagle in Sanskrit derivatives, but Uncle Bill's experience tells us that 'Garud' in Nepali has a wider application. Really interesting stuff for a linguistics student like me!

 

[prn]

ruel said:

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">"Garud" must certainly derive from Sanskrit "Garuda," since nearly all Sanskrit derivatives adopted the final -a deletion. Nepali, though, isn't derived from Sanskrit so maybe it didn't translate exactly. 'Garud' still means eagle in Sanskrit derivatives, but Uncle Bill's experience tells us that 'Garud' in Nepali has a wider application. Really interesting stuff for a linguistics student like me!</font>

Nepali is Indo-European, and, in fact, Indic. I'm not sure, offhand, and I don't have references here, whether Nepali is descended from Sanskrit/Pali as are virtually all the modern Indian languages or if it is from a sister branch, but I suspect the former (on no real data). AFAIK, the entire Indic branch of IE is descended from the Skt-speaking invaders, and that would include Nepali.

"Garud" is probably just the regular modern Nepali reflex of "garuda" but IIRC, it shows up in Thai as "garuda" (from Pali) with the final vowel, so the final vowel may not have been lost in Pali since Thai shouldn't have had any "need" to add a final vowel. But I've been wrong once or twice before

so my guesses may be worth no more than you've paid for them.

The word "garud(a)" clearly does show up all over south and southeast Asia as a loan word, even where it would not have been native, but Nepali is one where it could have been native. I certainly don't know enough about the history of the word or of Nepali to say for sure just what path the word took to get there. Borrowing words from closely related languages is too commmon to dismiss. For examples, just look at English. Without detailed knowledge, you wouldn't know which members of doublets like "yard/garden" or "shirt/skirt" was the native Anglo-Saxon word and which was borrowed from Scandinavian. (The first of each of these doublets is A-S.)

(I used to be a linguist, but I was a syntactician rather than a historical guy, so I don't really have the specific knowledge that I ought to have in order to spout off here.

)

Paul


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Paul Neubauer
prn@bsu.edu
A tool is, basically, an object that enables you to take advantage of the laws of physics and mechanics in such a way that you can seriously injure yourself.

 

[Bill Martino]

Wal, I have a hard time telling pine from purple heart so I really am at a loss when it comes to wood ID and probably get it wrong more than half the time. I'll make my best guess and then let the experts tell me when I'm wrong.

We did have a couple of the Hanuman - Ganesh Special scabbards come in. There's a pix of one or two somewhere and it shows what the carvers can do outside handles. I've got to get a pix of my sarangi which will show the same thing. It's a small violin type instrument that is carved out of a single piece of wood -- don't ask me what kind of wood, though!

And thanks for linguistics lessons -- really quite interesting stuff. I keep on learning but seem to forget what I've learned the next day.

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Blessings from the computer shack in Reno.

Uncle Bill
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[This message has been edited by Bill Martino (edited 06-13-2001).]

 

[ruel]

"I keep on learning but seem to forget what I've learned the next day."

I can barely remember what I did this morning! :O

1. Speaking of Ganesha, look at this nice keris hilt from Bali -- one of my favorites:
http://weaponspage.homestead.com/baliganesha.html
Somehow Hindu gods seem to bring out the best in woodworkers, whether in Nepal, Bali, or wherever!

2. Paul, you're right; I was thinking of Newari instead of Nepali. Some other language facts about Nepal are here: http://www.sil.org/ethnologue/countries/Nepa.html#NEP

I guess the final vowel deletion rule took effect after the formation of Pali. I do recall, though, that some Thai expression use 'phut' for Buddha while others use 'phuttha'. Were Asian languages your specialty when you studied linguistics?

 

[prn]

Nah. I had (and still have) a bunch of friends who specialize in various Asian languages (primarily either Sino-Tibetan or Daic (Thai and relatives)) but I was primarily a syntactician with the usual strong bias toward getting my data from English.

That sort of field has gone in directions I wasn't too happy with and I just sort of lost the urge.

Paul


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Paul Neubauer
prn@bsu.edu
A tool is, basically, an object that enables you to take advantage of the laws of physics and mechanics in such a way that you can seriously injure yourself.