Props to Ken Onion and Kershaw!

Any Cal. said:
Jerker, I am not sure how this will come across in print, but I think I know what you are saying. It makes me think of how people use things according to how they percieve them.

Think of a Sebenza. The large majority of owners use them for jobs that most people could use any tool for. Because of their price, the knives are used VERY lightly. It makes me think that a steel could be graded as an expensive, specialty steel, and then people would percieve that it's use would need to be commensurate with the way it is graded.

The steel could be the same basic composition, but it's price and description would suggest something other than general use. Then, heat treat specs could be given for that steel that would push the line a little.

As I understand, there are certain Spyderco knives designed for a thin edge and lighter cutting tasks. Those who buy those knives do so with the realization that more care will be required in use. Kind of like the SG2 Kershaws.

If a steel was graded/priced differently, wouldn't this have the same effect, even if the formula was basically the same? One steel could have a more forgiving heat treat, and another, with a different price, could carry a higher end, more rigid heat treat sequence, though both are of very similiar composition?
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Hi Any Cal,
Hehe good suggestion Sandvik will increase prices on the steel that ends up in harder knives:D. Just kidding. I do believe that different heat treatments could be used depending on application (a big chopper vs a small EDC should have very different hardnesses in my opinion). Having different hardnesses depending on price-point or targeted customer group could maybe also be possible but the knife-makers know this market far better than me. Also I think most forumites knows this part of the knife market better than me.

What I meant with my previous post is that we believe that we have a much better product than for instance 420HC, 420J2 and 440A. But if we stick to our "conservative" hardening programs where our hardness levels are not much higher, usually in the high 50:s. It will be hard for a typical knife buyer to realize that there is a performance difference. Higher hardness IS (for right or wrong) considered performance. Sometimes as the only performance parameter.

Regards
//Jerker
 
svrider3 said:
In my experiences the ZDP-189 has a lot better wear resistance then
the S30V. Not that S30V is bad in any means. I have many knives in
S30V and I think it's a great steel. For me it just comes down to what
I plan on doing when I pick a certain knife with a certain steel. If I plan
on cutting a lot where wear resistance is an issue, I'll reach for the ZDP.
But for the most part in every day use, the 13C26 just does the trick for
me. It takes a fine edge, holds it pretty well and it's easy to bring back a
scary sharp edge on. I usually take my edges down to around 12 degrees
per side, and even at that angle 13C26 holds a great edge as long as I'm not
cutting something very abrasive.

Thanks for all your time spent here with us Jerker.
You've given us a lot of valuable information. :thumbup:
Click to expand...

Hi Svrider3,
I personally believe the wear resistence depends on carbide volume, period. If the carbides have high levels of vanadium or not I think is secondary. It might have some effect but my personal opinion is that it's small. Your experience seems to confirm this. I would have guessed from a theroretical standpoint (I dont own knives of either grade) that ZDP would out cut an S30V because of the sheer amount of carbides in ZDP. 3%C and 22% Cr will mean an insane amount.

About keen edges. Bragging warning.
13C26 in razorblade production has three bevels on a blade which have the same thickness (roughly) as a human hair 76 micons (0.076 mm thickness). I think the final, third, bevel is 12-15 degrees depending on maker, and the edge shaves for weeks. Literally. A fine-grain steel can handle any angle but since coarse grades (440C, D2 etc) cant handle keen edges easily there is where the larges difference in performance is between these different steel types. I also like to have razor-sharp knives with keen edges.

It's my pleasure to be here. In fact this community is what educated me about knives in the first place. Here is where I found out which questions we needed to be able to answer as well as steel information/performance from a users standpoint. I'm happy to bring something back.

Regards
//Jerker
 
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