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QC issues? Rate my OCD/10

Don't listen to anyone telling you you're being picky. Those same people would use a Benchmade with the same flaws as proof Spyderco is more virtuous.





Your complains are valid. Full stop.
 
Having 2 Seki-City Spyderco knives, one recently (the new black Police model) and a Stretch 2 XL PD#1 Sprint model, with edges that never should have passed QC, I'm not real happy with what appears to be a downward slide in Seki quality. Some of the other PD#1 Sprint knives I bought have below average edges, but the S2XL was the worst – in at least 2 places the edge is rough sliding a finger nail along the edge, and the edge grinds are uneven (on both knives). These knives were purchased brand new from legitimate dealers.

Some people excuse away poor quality by saying something like, "well, it's easy to fix an uneven edge by re-sharpening" – maybe so, but should a customer buying a $285 knife have to sharpen it before they even use it – heck no! I expect the quality to be present when I buy anything, and I don't want to waste time fixing something brand new that should have been right to start with! If you buy a new car, and it runs a little rough or maybe there is a bad spot in the paint, are you going to explain it away and just fix it yourself? If so, that only encourages the poor quality to continue.

On the bright side, I have bought quite a few Golden and Taichung Spyderco models recently, all with nice edges and otherwise good quality too, so I will continue to buy those, but I'm done with buying the Seki knives.
 
Having 2 Seki-City Spyderco knives, one recently (the new black Police model) and a Stretch 2 XL PD#1 Sprint model, with edges that never should have passed QC, I'm not real happy with what appears to be a downward slide in Seki quality. Some of the other PD#1 Sprint knives I bought have below average edges, but the S2XL was the worst – in at least 2 places the edge is rough sliding a finger nail along the edge, and the edge grinds are uneven (on both knives). These knives were purchased brand new from legitimate dealers.

Some people excuse away poor quality by saying something like, "well, it's easy to fix an uneven edge by re-sharpening" – maybe so, but should a customer buying a $285 knife have to sharpen it before they even use it – heck no! I expect the quality to be present when I buy anything, and I don't want to waste time fixing something brand new that should have been right to start with! If you buy a new car, and it runs a little rough or maybe there is a bad spot in the paint, are you going to explain it away and just fix it yourself? If so, that only encourages the poor quality to continue.

On the bright side, I have bought quite a few Golden and Taichung Spyderco models recently, all with nice edges and otherwise good quality too, so I will continue to buy those, but I'm done with buying the Seki knives.
It's going to be a long time until I get back into Seki stuff again after that Massad Ayoob. For the price of a beater in VG10 I might as well get two voyagers or something.

Taichungs always treated me well, infact I should get more.

Goldens are in my experience the best ones for action and centering, but sharpening has been inconsistent.
I'm not always a fan but I'll always be a glutton for punishment since there is really no other way to get say a 4" quality (when lucky) folder in some exotic steel. To be fair after my usual fiddling to make it mine the M2 is probably the best folder I've ever handled in a long time I'm sure I'm going to be enyoying it for a long time.
 
I recently returned a Microjimbo 15V sprint to the vendor because the blade was crazy off center.

My hard rule anymore is that if I wouldn't walk out of a brick and mortar store with the knife, it's going back.
If the blade rubs the scales it's a big no no for me. If it's any better I might try to get it right but if I can't it goes back, and I don't even feel half bad about it.
 
Hi Vinvman,

I appreciate the thread and comments. I also appreciate our interest and support. I too am OCD in many areas.

We offer what we think is one of the best performing knife cutting tools available, but I didn't see any comments on how well they cut?

As an aside, we are a production house and we try to offer good quality for fair prices. For those that are seeking perfection for the price , may I suggest you contact a Custom knife maker, of which there are many very good ones world wide. See what they would charge for a perfect folding knife in the steels we offer. I think you might be surprised?

sal
 
Hi Vinvman,

I appreciate the thread and comments. I also appreciate our interest and support. I too am OCD in many areas.

We offer what we think is one of the best performing knife cutting tools available, but I didn't see any comments on how well they cut?

As an aside, we are a production house and we try to offer good quality for fair prices. For those that are seeking perfection for the price , may I suggest you contact a Custom knife maker, of which there are many very good ones world wide. See what they would charge for a perfect folding knife in the steels we offer. I think you might be surprised?

sal
Hi Sal,
I appreciate you checking in, it's an honour.
I think that nowadays we're all kinda spoiled by the immense variety of supersteels and performance edge profiles for every single kind of cutting we may need, and I'm definitely no exception to the rule.

Please understand that it's pretty normal for people to go online and vent about what at least they think is a problem, big or small, and you'll always find more of that rather than praise. Truth be told there is lot of praise as well for Spyderco products and for good reason, but naturally the rules of the consumer world still apply... I've just read the whole 75 pages of the "Military 2 discussion" over at the official forums, and as expected I found many comments of people complaining about either centering, action, grind problems, and many other "blemishes" that I would have never noticed even with a microscope and a box of adderal.

Of course that did not phase me, you can see the same exact thing happening say at Apple or Porsche forums, because the Internet is mostly populated by the most extreme enthusiasts. We're outliers, and sometimes there's no other way to say it: we get annoyed by the pettiest things, and I know because I'm guilty myself. However I'd also add that it's also a little bit because of some of the very most annoying ones of us that some unicorns like the amazing BBB 15V become a reality, and the fact that there is a big brand name that not only listens to our mad rants but actually MAKES such things is a little bit of a miracle to me, and definitely something I'll always be grateful for, don't get me wrong.

However I can walk and chew gum at the same time, meaning I can also understand the frustration of a customer that has to somewhat fiddle with a knife to make it "right" (whatever that may mean in his or her devious mind). I understand that something like say an M2 in 15V will have to be sharpened at some point, and I feel legit pain for each of these beauties that will never see another edge besides the factory one and will live for the rest of its days in a safe. I can also see how for some of us the idea of giving a new edge to a freshly bought knife can be anything from daunting to at least slightly annoying, let alone taking it apart to work on the action or centering.

Ultimately tho I see what you mean when you talk about your focus on performance: after all a Spyderco with a slightly funky bevel, a subpar centering or some rough action - hell even one with all of the three - will still perform when it's time to cut stuff, and will do so as well or better than many more expensive customs even: this shouldn't be underlooked. Please also understand that some of us individuals that are so OCD about cutting stuff well - so much so that we don't mind spending 320€ for a cutting tool - may have some of that same OCD trickling down into other aspects of their lives...hell, it's actually more likely the other way around now that I think about it ;)
 
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I personally feel that if a $20 Milwaukee fastback from home depot can have even bevels I would expect a knife costing 10 times as much to as well. When they are *noticably* uneven it makes me think what other corners may have been cut.
 
I have a lot of Spyders.
Of what has bothered you seems small to me.
I’ve had 3 that were so off center that the blades wouldn’t close, just hit the scales. I have worked on them and fixed 1 out of three. They are better but I am more cautious on closing them.

I really don’t like returning things, so I have them.
One of these has been in my pocket for two weeks straight. And is one of my favorites despite being a bad example:p
 
I don’t expect perfection from the Japanese or American made Spydercos. The J models all have lock rock, and the A models usually have some kind of grind imperfections, but I never felt it necessary to return one.
My Tiawan made knives are very well put together.
My first POLICE model (around 2000) was stainless perfection.
I grew up with Case, Schrade, Buck etc. Even with the imperfections of the modern knives, they are so much better than the old ones.
 
Haven't seen anyone discuss this yet, so - for the issues you describe and pics posted, I would probably be ok with all but the Ayoob, for the prices I'd be paying here in the US, in $.

You mentioned the 15V Military 2 was €300, though - looks like that's around $350 currently, and that's a lot more than I paid for mine. Assuming the your other examples have similarly higher prices in Euros, I would likely have similarly higher expectations and might feel the same as you about uneven bevels, or unfinished grinding marks on liners.


As it is I usually find Seki models in upgraded steels to be good value for the price and I'm loving the thin tip on my 15V Military 2. But, I realize we're not coming from the same place. Ultimately up to you to decide where your appropriate performance/finish/value balance lies.
 
Hi Vinvman,

I appreciate the thread and comments. I also appreciate our interest and support. I too am OCD in many areas.

We offer what we think is one of the best performing knife cutting tools available, but I didn't see any comments on how well they cut?

As an aside, we are a production house and we try to offer good quality for fair prices. For those that are seeking perfection for the price , may I suggest you contact a Custom knife maker, of which there are many very good ones world wide. See what they would charge for a perfect folding knife in the steels we offer. I think you might be surprised?

sal
Sal, this is a discussion about fit and finish, not cutting ability.


To suggest that those of us that take issue with quality control problems that should be easily caught and fixed at the factory should count our blessings that we aren't paying custom prices......well, it's out of touch.



Your response here does not make me feel like you take the issue of quality control as seriously as I previously thought Spyderco did. As someone who has seen you post many well-considered and humble responses on this forum and your own Spyderco forum, I am surprised at the aloof and unconcerned nature of this one.




These are legitimate problems that cannot be brushed aside by simply saying your knives cut well and customs would cost more.




Just my take.
 
Sal, this is a discussion about fit and finish, not cutting ability.


To suggest that those of us that take issue with quality control problems that should be easily caught and fixed at the factory should count our blessings that we aren't paying custom prices......well, it's out of touch.



Your response here does not make me feel like you take the issue of quality control as seriously as I previously thought Spyderco did. As someone who has seen you post many well-considered and humble responses on this forum and your own Spyderco forum, I am surprised at the aloof and unconcerned nature of this one.




These are legitimate problems that cannot be brushed aside by simply saying your knives cut well and customs would cost more.




Just my take.


Sal has dedicated almost half a century to the pursuit of getting high performance knives available to the public for a reasonable price.

It's okay to share criticism but please have some decorum and take that into consideration.
 
Sal has dedicated almost half a century to the pursuit of getting high performance knives available to the public for a reasonable price.

It's okay to share criticism but please have some decorum and take that into consideration.

I am well aware, and I have a lot of respect for Sal and his company. I am being nothing but polite.


I don't believe in celebrity.


Thanks for your concern.
 
Hi True North,

Thanx for sharing your thoughts. I and my staff are always concerned about QC and are always trying to improve same. I disagree that I am out of touch.

sal
 
Hi True North,

Thanx for sharing your thoughts. I and my staff are always concerned about QC and are always trying to improve same. I disagree that I am out of touch.

sal

Beautiful. Why not say that to vnvman then, instead of talking about how he should check out custom pricing and essentially brushing off the QC concerns in the OP by deflecting to cutting ability?



No disrespect intended, of course. It's well known you guys take your knives seriously. The only reason I'm commenting is because this response is not what I expect from the Glessers.



Take care. Thanks for your time.
 
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