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quality control with knives made in U.S.A.
- Thread starter rprocter
- Start date
- Joined
- Sep 2, 2006
- Messages
- 486
Knifeworks and WildDeals are two other vendors that are good with this. I've never gotten a knife with less than excellent F&F from either two.
- Joined
- Dec 26, 2006
- Messages
- 288
75% failure rate is not acceptable in any country. I don't know if i'd say it was the 'Made in the USA' factor that hits that bad of an acceptance rate. Without knowing the retailers used, i'd first assume that you bought from the lowest bidder, using some price search tool, and ended up with everyone else's rejects...it makes sense since you said 4 purchases all from different dealers, although if you kept getting bad knives I can understnad why you'd want to change.
Like I said, I don't know what retailers you used, but i'd be a little more interested in the return policy of my next vendor if I was in your shoes.
schiesz
Like I said, I don't know what retailers you used, but i'd be a little more interested in the return policy of my next vendor if I was in your shoes.
schiesz
- Joined
- Oct 29, 2005
- Messages
- 18,769
Apples and Oranges. Although there are apparently a few locks that "look" like an Axis lock, no other lock functions exactly the same way so you can't really compare between a back lock and a Axis lock.
===
I have had great luck with American made, Japanese made, Italian, Taiwanese made, and even a few Chinese made
(yes it is true). Sorry you had such poor luck original poster. 
- Joined
- Aug 22, 2006
- Messages
- 135
I've always said that before the internet, there was a sucker born evey 10 seconds, now there's a sucker born every 15 seconds...Hey, it's an improvement, meaning that the average person can now do a great deal of research that they couldn't do before, such as right here.
This means that companies that don't offer a good "Value", will have less places to hide, regardless of their price range or where they are made. But it will take a few more years before facts totally replace marketing gimicks.
I wonder when Toyota will start making a S30V 4" 4Runner?!
This means that companies that don't offer a good "Value", will have less places to hide, regardless of their price range or where they are made. But it will take a few more years before facts totally replace marketing gimicks.
I wonder when Toyota will start making a S30V 4" 4Runner?!
problems with the 3 knives (all folders), 2 failed a gentle spine whack test (liner locks), 3rd, exsessive blade play when open. i find it odd that throughout this forum some folks are unnecessarily aggressive in their posts.
one suggests i couldn't be a medical doctor because i used lower case for m.d. i do this because i have always felt that being an m.d. is no big deal. it makes me neither better nor worse than anybody else. (check mcgill university grad class 1972, i'm there)
one suggests i couldn't be a medical doctor because i used lower case for m.d. i do this because i have always felt that being an m.d. is no big deal. it makes me neither better nor worse than anybody else. (check mcgill university grad class 1972, i'm there)
you say my posts do not equate to the level of a medical doctor. how so ? my training (anesthesiology) and 30+ years of experience has taught me a great deal about people and their illnesses and injuries, but nothing about knives. i am on this forum so i can learn.
Sal Glesser
Moderator
- Joined
- Dec 27, 1998
- Messages
- 11,714
Hi Rprocter,
Welcome to the bladeforums. Sorry for your disappointment.
While I can not speak for all USA mfrs, I can speak for Spyderco. But I would guess that my comments would be true for all.
Making a quality locking folding knife is far more difficult to do that most imagine. The skill cannot be taught in schools and there are many details that require experience, testing and focus on detail.
There are very few products made where little bits of hard steel have to fit well, resist forces and still continue to perform well. This concept becomes even more unique when one couples this with a sharp and potentially dangerous edge.
I believe that all USA mfrs do try to make good product, but we find that very small details are often critical.
The interface between a linerlock and the blade tang is still a very difficult area to "get right every time" and different companies have their own specific "tricks" to try to maintain high quality and long term performance levels. Wear is a particulalry difficult area given angles, surface changes, hardness differences and of course the sometimes rough "use" a knife must endure.
Knarfeng is accurate in his analysis of US mfr. We've not given this area enough attention in the past 25 years or so. I know that we at Spyderco work very closely with the makers we work with to constantly teach each other the "tricks" we learn. This is especially important as we get into new design concept areas (linerlocks, ball bearing locks, compression locks, etc.) But we have a factory here so we're more involved in those details.
I think in the end, you will end up with several companies that you trust more than others, and you will always keep an eye out for potentials.
Many companies (like Junglee) are not owned by "knife afi's (aficianados) and must rely on the knowledge and experience of their subcontractors. Design is also a difficult area. Just drawing a "picture of a knife" is simple, right?
The Seki makers have a 1000 years of tradition and experience and much can be learned from them.
sal
Welcome to the bladeforums. Sorry for your disappointment.
While I can not speak for all USA mfrs, I can speak for Spyderco. But I would guess that my comments would be true for all.
Making a quality locking folding knife is far more difficult to do that most imagine. The skill cannot be taught in schools and there are many details that require experience, testing and focus on detail.
There are very few products made where little bits of hard steel have to fit well, resist forces and still continue to perform well. This concept becomes even more unique when one couples this with a sharp and potentially dangerous edge.
I believe that all USA mfrs do try to make good product, but we find that very small details are often critical.
The interface between a linerlock and the blade tang is still a very difficult area to "get right every time" and different companies have their own specific "tricks" to try to maintain high quality and long term performance levels. Wear is a particulalry difficult area given angles, surface changes, hardness differences and of course the sometimes rough "use" a knife must endure.
Knarfeng is accurate in his analysis of US mfr. We've not given this area enough attention in the past 25 years or so. I know that we at Spyderco work very closely with the makers we work with to constantly teach each other the "tricks" we learn. This is especially important as we get into new design concept areas (linerlocks, ball bearing locks, compression locks, etc.) But we have a factory here so we're more involved in those details.
I think in the end, you will end up with several companies that you trust more than others, and you will always keep an eye out for potentials.
Many companies (like Junglee) are not owned by "knife afi's (aficianados) and must rely on the knowledge and experience of their subcontractors. Design is also a difficult area. Just drawing a "picture of a knife" is simple, right?
The Seki makers have a 1000 years of tradition and experience and much can be learned from them.
sal
- Joined
- May 20, 2006
- Messages
- 1,596
A second for Knifeworks.com as a good place to buy. Roger there was more than willing to take a look at a couple of knives that I had ordered to make sure they were not defective. He is a great guy. Regardless of any manufacturer's QC, if you develop a good relationship with a knife store owner you should always be ok.
I've never gotten a bad Spyderco, especially a liner lock. Mr. Glesser has shown that his company is one who tries harder than most to get them right, and it shows.
rcprocter, liner locks are a skilled labor proposition. Some knock them out with no problem, others have no clue what the interrelationship is between ramp angle, liner angle, materials, liner length, liner thickness, and engagement angle. In the worst case, a short, thin stainless linerlock approaching a steep ramp engagement just makes it a delayed action closer.
The hard part is, some inexpensive oriental importers bring in gems, and some American mass producers put out junk. It gets confusing to sort out which models are best, and expectations sometimes get trashed by a bad example from an otherwise reputable maker.
I only buy framelocks now, because certain design aspects prevent failure from being possible - as much. But my interest is in performance, not beauty.
rcprocter, liner locks are a skilled labor proposition. Some knock them out with no problem, others have no clue what the interrelationship is between ramp angle, liner angle, materials, liner length, liner thickness, and engagement angle. In the worst case, a short, thin stainless linerlock approaching a steep ramp engagement just makes it a delayed action closer.
The hard part is, some inexpensive oriental importers bring in gems, and some American mass producers put out junk. It gets confusing to sort out which models are best, and expectations sometimes get trashed by a bad example from an otherwise reputable maker.
I only buy framelocks now, because certain design aspects prevent failure from being possible - as much. But my interest is in performance, not beauty.
to mr. sal glesser
thanks for your explanation of the challenges with folder locks. i am quite new to this forum but it is obvious already from the many posts i have read that spyderco rarely (or never) disappoints a customer. as i said earlier, the one "perfect" knife i received is a BG-42 military. my son (a power lineman) will be visiting soon and today i ordered a poliwog as a gift for him, feeling quite sure this knife too will work exactly as intended. thank you for your post and great knives.
thanks for your explanation of the challenges with folder locks. i am quite new to this forum but it is obvious already from the many posts i have read that spyderco rarely (or never) disappoints a customer. as i said earlier, the one "perfect" knife i received is a BG-42 military. my son (a power lineman) will be visiting soon and today i ordered a poliwog as a gift for him, feeling quite sure this knife too will work exactly as intended. thank you for your post and great knives.