Quasi "tanto" wilderness blades????

JD Mandrell

JD Mandrell

Joined
Apr 20, 2001
Messages
18,423
OK,I admit, I don't get it, I have a hard time grasping the choice of this style of blade tip for a wilderness blade.

First it was Myke Hawke's "Hellion", and now Joe Teti's "Surv-Tac 7".

TantoWilderness_zpsb2bf06c8.jpg


Is this just an appeal to the Rambo wannabe military minded crowd, or is this a good concept for a woods blade.

Am I missing something?
 
At this point, I'm not even sure what a "tanto" is anymore so if you're missing something, I don't have it.

I always thought a tanto was more of a trailing point with a very forward belly. The "quasi" in the title is well placed. I'm not sure what those are.

If I had to give an answer I'd say it's a case of someone blurring the line between wilderness survival and just plain old survival (urban, maritime, combat, Christmas with the in-laws, etc.).
 
It's television, which means companies have no doubt lobbied very hard to get their products featured. I'm sure at some point, the conversation went something like this - "I know, I know, this isn't the knife you'd choose, but we're getting big bucks from these guys, so make it work."

In my humble opinion, tantos are a poor choice for general use. They are a specialized tip, designed to do some specific things well, but sacrificing decent performance of many other general tasks in the process.
 
Smithhammer said:
In my humble opinion, tantos are a poor choice for general use. They are a specialized tip, designed to do some specific things well, but sacrificing decent performance of many other general tasks in the process.
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You are talking about the American ized Tanto.

Actual Japanese Tantos were utility knives with a curve all the way up to the tip. They worked very well on fish & game.
 
CWL said:
You are talking about the American ized Tanto.

Actual Japanese Tantos were utility knives with a curve all the way up to the tip. They worked very well on fish & game.
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Yup - I'm referring to the currently fashionable tactical/Americanized version, as pictured.
 
The only tanto the I have used as a bushcraft/wilderness knife is my Entrek Jag. It has a rounded tanto tip. holds an edge and the spine sparks like crazy. While I do respect people like Mykel Hawke and Joe Teti, their style of knife is not my cup of tea...
 
I often carry American tanto as a utility knife as a maintenance director and find it very effective in that area. I really like them in the shop at home too. I could make it work in the bush and the tip is actually useful for gutting fish and game. Most of the tantos I have carry more of a drop point on the spine. They use like a cross between a whancliffe and drop point. In fact, the American tanto would be a good urban survival choice for me along with a multi-tool. Great utility, great chisel, great penetration, great pry-bar which are common uses in urban survival.
 
You are missing something, indeed. The apex where the primary edge and the front edge meet is an amazingly precise and powerful tool. You have to use it to appreciate it, and it's not for everyone. I think it's sort of like the serrated edge. So many people for so long have been saying it's useful for only certain things that most people just take it as gospel and spread the misinformation to others and the cycle continues. Neither of the two knives mentioned appeal to me, but others with the magical apex have, and I have used them (and serrations) to good effect in many ways, including bushcraft. You just have to understand how they work, as a tool and it all comes together.

They are not the best at everything, but they are better at enough things to make them worth trying out if you're interested.
 
scouter27 said:
You are missing something, indeed. The apex where the primary edge and the front edge meet is an amazingly precise and powerful tool. You have to use it to appreciate it, and it's not for everyone. I think it's sort of like the serrated edge. So many people for so long have been saying it's useful for only certain things that most people just take it as gospel and spread the misinformation to others and the cycle continues. Neither of the two knives mentioned appeal to me, but others with the magical apex have, and I have used them (and serrations) to good effect in many ways, including bushcraft. You just have to understand how they work, as a tool and it all comes together.

They are not the best at everything, but they are better at enough things to make them worth trying out if you're interested.
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Just watched a couple vids on this one and it is actually well thought out. Every part of the knife has a purpose. I met Hawke at Blade and was very impressed with his application of survival technique. I saw the hellion at blade, but never payed attention to it until I read this thread.
 
Another thing often overlooked is the difference between bushcraft and survival. Bushcraft is about style, survival is just staying alive. Nothing wrong with either.
 
scouter27 said:
You are missing something, indeed. The apex where the primary edge and the front edge meet is an amazingly precise and powerful tool. You have to use it to appreciate it, and it's not for everyone. I think it's sort of like the serrated edge. So many people for so long have been saying it's useful for only certain things that most people just take it as gospel and spread the misinformation to others and the cycle continues. Neither of the two knives mentioned appeal to me, but others with the magical apex have, and I have used them (and serrations) to good effect in many ways, including bushcraft. You just have to understand how they work, as a tool and it all comes together.

They are not the best at everything, but they are better at enough things to make them worth trying out if you're interested.
Click to expand...

What is an example of one you like or that has worked well for you? Just out of curiosity.
 
I'm actually torn as I don't think it's the knife design as much as the technique and skill used. The "American-tanto" has been heavily marketed to the military and they have a lot of use in Neanderthal hands doing obscene and horrific tasks never meant for knives. Of course, any knife design could have done those same tasks, but the pseudo reputation took hold. Most in the military adapt, so given any blade, they'll make it work even if it isn't optimal.

The only advantages these “tanto” designs have are that they are often about a quarter-inch thick and serve mostly has pry bars than dedicated cutting tools. There is a lot of marketing success for these designs and “looks” will always stir the masses.

I have a lot of respect for the late Ron Hood and he used a 9” bladed TOPS tanto-designed brute very effectively. I know that was early in his evolutionary journey with knives, but it does point out that they can be used for “bushcraft” type tasks even if they’re not the most optimum. I’ve seen similar designs used very effectively in the outdoors and I even have a few stuffed in the bottom of my knife drawer. For me, I’ve found I appreciate more traditional designs when working with wood or similar tasks, but I hesitate to criticize those who are actually using these tanto-blades for outdoors tasks as the goal is to be outdoors and actually use your tools and improve your skills and techniques.

I’ve never really found any concrete evidence to substantiate the effectiveness of the American-tanto design. There are probably some attributes such as the have the acute, flat angles, more robust tip (although that has been debunked with proven use of conventional tip profiles) that can be used for chiseling very effectively (as I’ve done in the past).

ROCK6
 
kic said:
stupid concept...not even a good military or "tactical" knife.
i don't understand fascination with mall ninja knives where there is so much good knives on the market.
it is just a new trend that you can only survive in wilderness if you are ex. sniper, navy seal, Abrams gunner or raptor f-22 pilot...
next survival tip on discovery channel would be to put a mini nuke bomb in altoids tin in case of zombies...
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I suppose because hollow handle survival knives aren't popular that Lile and Randall had some stupid concepts too? The actual intended use was that pilots could put a kit inside the handle for survival if their aircraft went down. Good thought behind it and it pioneered future concepts. But, Rambo used one. You can't tell me that they don't have a strong enough tang, because I couldn't even break the tang on an Aitor Jungle King. Cheap copies are a diferent story though.

Concerning the knife above. If you actually watched the video demo. It has some positive uses. This knife, the Beck Tracker, hollow handles and all the concepts people call stupid are and were pioneers for some popular designs now. Plastics were stupid too, but now they're stronger than steel.

I'm glad America still has people that are willing to sit, design and think stuff up.
 
My whole point was innovative thinking and the development of new concepts. We shouldn't shoot them down because they are not popular. I'm a serious knife user and experinced woodsman and have used a tanto outdoors. I've been in the field for almost twenty years. American tantos are excellent at cleaning fish (Look up the japanese eel skinner. That is were the American Tanto originated). Used them on large game too. I've only started experimenting with tantos, but I'm accomplishing the same bushcraft. About the saw. Well, I used them both and guess what? Faster results with a longer saw because you're able to use longer strokes. Not the first time I used a saw of the Tops design. Those teeth have been around on wood files long before tops came into the picture. I've been in classes were people couldn't get an altoid tin open because their hands were so cold. So, what's your point?
 
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