quench marks on my blade?

W

willy m

Joined
Nov 27, 2007
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the title to this thread pretty much says it all. every time i quench a blade it comes out with raindrop looking splotches in the steel on the surface of the blade. im using regular motor oil to quench. could this be my problem? what would be a more suitable quench? although i cant afford to send away to buy a commercial quenching solution im hoping to find a quench oil that will work ok till i can afford it. i heat the oil by heating a scrap piece. is the steel getting to hot? in a fairly decently lighted room it appears to be about an orange-red colour. thanks,willy:confused::eek::(
 
It could be the motor oil, I had that trouble years ago when I used the cheap stuff too. My suggestion is to buy a gallon of Mineral Oil at the Farm/Ranch store and try it again. I like Tough Quench from Brownells but the mineral oil will work fine and costs less.
 
thanks im not sure what the steel is i got it from a crosscut saw blade.right now its all i got,i just ordered some 1095 from jantz.had to wait till i had some money. but i didnt want to wait to make the knife.im on my 6th knife from saw steel and have the same problem with all. i will try the mineral oil and just hot enough to be non-magenitic. i think it was too hot from the way the steel looks.its kind of like mabey its liquidy when it was quenched. thanks,willy
 
Just a wild and crazy thought......But, have you considered that the problem might be the steel?
Stacy
 
willy m said:
thanks im not sure what the steel is i got it from a crosscut saw blade.right now its all i got,i just ordered some 1095 from jantz.had to wait till i had some money. but i didnt want to wait to make the knife.im on my 6th knife from saw steel and have the same problem with all. i will try the mineral oil and just hot enough to be non-magenitic. i think it was too hot from the way the steel looks.its kind of like mabey its liquidy when it was quenched. thanks,willy
Click to expand...

It could be the steel. (Stacy is usually always right):D
Saw blade steel could be anything and may always cause trouble without a precise control on the heat and a very fast quench. You should just stop using it IMO.

The 1095 is a shallow hardening steel and requires a very fast quench. It isnt for beginners. A better choice would be 5160 or O-1 for ease of consistant results without digital equipment.
 
Thanks Bruce.

If this is 1095 (a likely choice), then :
the shallow hardening ,
plus who knows what type of manufacturing quality control over the original billet,
and the improperly matched (and probably contaminated) quenchant ,
or the likelihood of surface corrosion and contaminants (chrome plating?),
adds up to a good reason to use a known steel and a matching quenchant.
Stacy

If you are up to an experiment:
Take the blade and scribe an "X" over each spot.
Sand the blade with 400 grit to remove the spots, but not the "X".
Re-do the HT and see if the spots appear at the "X's".
If they are still in the same spot, it is the steel.
If they are present at different spots, it is most likely the HT or the quenchant.
If they are gone - Who Knows???
Stacy
 
I think your steel is WAY to hot.
For 1095 you will need a much faster quench like Parks 50.
Good luck.
Mace
 
the reason i ordered the 1095 was i read here it was better to start with the simple steels and that is the only of the simple steels that jantz carries. i used the saw steel cause thats all i had and im just begining at making knives and didnt want to spend a bunch untill i had a bit more practice. i also didnt know which of all the steels would best suit my needs. i only have the jantz catalog. which would be better o-1 or 5160? jantz carries 0-1 but i dont know any of the other supply places to get other varieties? any suggestions as to a easy to deal with supply house other than jantz?thanks,willy
 
Splotches or spots coming out of the quench that the steel didn't show at all before the heat treating operation- this is an eaiser trouble shoot than many. Either adjust your atmosphere in heating or replace your quenchant. If an oil designed not to do this is out of the price range now, spend what you do have on the extra abrasives and beer it will take to rub those spots away. Afterwards add the houry wage to it and do some soul searching on the budget allocations.
 
A lot of speculation. A couple good photos would sure help.

How much are you grinding after heat treating? Are these spots showing right out of the quench or after finishing the blade???

From my past experience, old cross cut saws make fine knife blades but being pretty thin stock, I bet you are over heating it by a lot.

My suggestion is, get a better quench oil and work on your temps. Nothing wrong with the steel if you lean to HT it properly.
 
Pay attention to Kevin's advice,beyond that,

If you're doing relatively small knives and forging get some of the 1084 1 inch by 1/4 inch that Mace and Aldo sell, heat it just a little over nonmagnetic (I soak it 10 minutes at 1550 in my electric kiln, or if I am using the gas forge I see what color it is that it goes nonmagnetic and try to keep it around that color for about 10 minutes) then quench in olive oil heated to about 120, other than that, get some O-1

-Page
 
gene: what is a pm? i read that the 1095 i already ordered was a "shallow quench" what is that. if the 1095 is complicated to ht ill send it out. who are mace and aldo? do they sell knive supplies? if not who are some reputable supply houses? thanks for all your help,willy
 
Aldo Bruno sells 1084 for a very reasonable price. The 1095 you purchased will work but it will need a faster quench. It is actually a great steel and like everything it is a learning curve. 5160 is available from Admiral Steel. They are in your area too which will cut down on shipping prices. They also have O-1 and a selection of others including SS. As far as what quench oil to use. I was a died in the wool user of peanut oil until I tried a "real" quench oil. As Kevin points out, it pays for itself really fast since all the Testing has been done for you. Darren Ellis has been supplying small quantaties of parks #50 which is by far the most popular. Well worth the investment. PM is private mail. Use the tab in the upper right hand of the page.

Chuck
 
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