Question about and advice needed on a northwoods.

Trout Hound said:
I don't know about you guys, but when I'm working in the garden and I'm holding one thing in one hand and a knife in the other hand and maybe something else in my mouth, I may only have one finger free to snap the blade shut. If that's gonna be a problem, then it means the knife won't get used. I totally understand that knives will have individual imperfections, many of which I am happy to accept, but that would be a deal-breaker for me personally, at least if I intended to actually use the thing. To each their own.
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If you're actually using the knife, you'll need to sharpen it and it will go away. When you get a knife and it hits the backspring leaving a little mark or roll in the edge and send it back to be fixed, what do you think they do? They don't break the knife apart and do something magical to it, they rework the edge until it doesn't hit any longer. Simple as that.
 
J_Curd said:
You'll struggle with Trads if you have lofty expectations (or be paying dearly for "near perfect" customs)...these aren't CNC machined moderns; virtually all production Trads have a flaw if one looks hard enough.
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I don't expect custom quality in a production knife. However, I do expect a functional knife, and to me, when a blade knicks upon closing, that's not functional. Sure I'd accept a minor function problem in a low end knife (think Rough Rider) but I wouldn't call a Northwoods a low end production knife.

I have production slip joint knives of many eras and prices and their blades don't hit the backspring. Some of them are designed so that if you even push down on the blade's spine they don't touch the backspring. Well, I had a big honkin Paki lockback, the "Bullet", that hit the spacer with the tip, it was demoted to car knife. I put a piece of paper under the tang to keep it from happening. The thieves who stole my car have it now :)
 
Jsega51 said:
If you're actually using the knife, you'll need to sharpen it and it will go away. When you get a knife and it hits the backspring leaving a little mark or roll in the edge and send it back to be fixed, what do you think they do? They don't break the knife apart and do something magical to it, they rework the edge until it doesn't hit any longer. Simple as that.
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This is something that I know to be true. I've had knives that I've liked, but the blade hit the spring and rolled the edge. I knew that if I used them and sharpened them the problem would go away. The problem is, they never got used because the flaw made me not use them. I know I could have just sat and ground the blade down enough that it didn't happen, but that's something I wouldn't enjoy doing at all. Not because of the work, but because for the most part I try to sharpen my blades as little as possible so that they'll last. Again, I know that the blades will last longer than I will, but it's a thing. In the end I ended up moving all those knives along to new homes with full disclosure.

I think we're all willing to accept flaws in a production knife. It's just a matter of which flaws are problems for each of us individually, and which we're willing to overlook. A blade hitting the backspring is one that causes problems for me. I'm sure that there are some flaws that I can overlook that would be a dealbreaker for others. For instance, I'm not nearly as concerned with gaps as most here seem to be.
 
Cory... I'm not at all afraid to "use up some blade" by sharpening out the contact area. You're afraid of using up some of the blade, but in reality, the blade is too wide as it is. When you sharpen it to minimum clearance, it will be the fullest blade that will fit in that knife. If you buy a knife with no contact, it may have lost a years worth of sharpening at the factory with the new guy trying to get an even grind. Let 'er rip.
 
idahoguy said:
Cory... I'm not at all afraid to "use up some blade" by sharpening out the contact area. You're afraid of using up some of the blade, but in reality, the blade is too wide as it is. When you sharpen it to minimum clearance, it will be the fullest blade that will fit in that knife. If you buy a knife with no contact, it may have lost a years worth of sharpening at the factory with the new guy trying to get an even grind. Let 'er rip.
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^^

This is my perspective as well. I sharpen my knives and I appreciate getting the maximum amount of blade.

Some folks may prefer everything already set for them. And in a recent discussion, a lot of folks said that they never sharpen their knives at all. People will have different opinions. Personally, I'd rather get too much than too little. Underbladed knives bother me. It's like buying a new knife that was already used up.

This is not directed at Cory or anyone specifically. Just saying that I share a similar viewpoint to idahoguy.
 
Well, it could be that you're sharpening it down to the proper full blade that it should have come from the factory with. It's also possible that the kick is improperly shaped, so it's not stop the blade from hitting the backspring. Either way, I know in my head that sharpening is the correct solution to the problem. I just don't like doing it. It goes against my nature. I'd much rather have to take a hammer or vise to a knife to eliminate blade wobble than have to grind a portion of the blade off to prevent it hitting the backspring. I recognize that this is a personal thing, and I don't doubt that many people would be more comfortable with the sharpening.

I was just trying to point out that just because the blade hitting the backspring is a trigger for some people doesn't mean that they're overly picky. They might let other things slide that would bother somebody that doesn't mind this particular issue. It's a matter of personal preference. It's been beneficial for me to recognize the things that really bother me and learn to avoid patterns that tend to have those issues. Likewise, I've learned what doesn't bother me and have found some patterns that are plentiful on account of many people passing them over because of issues that don't bother me at all.
 
I agree Cory. It could be partly the design of the kick. I don't have this particular knife so I can't test it.

One thing that is not clear to me is whether closing a knife against your leg and letting it snap shut should be considered normal use by the manufacturer. Ed linked to a previous discussion where some folks thought it was inappropriate. If the knife doesn't hit when it's closed gently, should that be good enough? In my opinion, yes.
 
supratentorial said:
I agree Cory. It could be partly the design of the kick. I don't have this particular knife so I can't test it.

One thing that is not clear to me is whether closing a knife against your leg and letting it snap shut should be considered normal use by the manufacturer. Ed linked to a previous discussion where some folks thought it was inappropriate. If the knife doesn't hit when it's closed gently, should that be good enough? In my opinion, yes.
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I seem to recall Macchina offering a solution to build up a kick....
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...appointing-missing-kick-FIXED!?highlight=kick
 
If the design of the kick is not optimal as Cory suggested and the snapped blade is overtraveling then a broader kick may be the best solution.

A taller kick may or may not be an alternative to sharpening. I don't have the knife and I don't know how well the tip is buried. A taller kick may or may not expose the tip. Along the same lines as Macchina's solution.... "peening" the kick will also increase the height (The tangs are annealed). Charlie (Waynorth) did this on a knife (don't remember which brand). I don't have a link handy but a search of his posts might bring it up.
 
supratentorial said:
If the knife doesn't hit when it's closed gently, should that be good enough? In my opinion, yes.
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That's one of those questions where my philosophy and my experience don't jive. In my head it should be good enough for a knife to not hit the backspring when closed gently. In reality, I know that that knife will get left behind in favor of a knife that I don't have to worry about. Having a knife in my pocket is all about convenience. I carry a knife so that when I need one I don't have to run to the kitchen or desk or junk drawer. The less convenient a knife is the less likely I'm going to have it in my pocket.

This doesn't mean that I don't think they're good knives or that I don't enjoy playing with them. I just don't end up carrying them and thus they end up getting rehomed to somebody that can appreciate them more than I do.
 
Jake, I had a knife that I had Evan (Esnyx) peen the tang on the main blade to bring it up some. The main sat low in the handle causing it to hit the spring but it also hid a good portion of the long pull behind the secondary pen blade. He peened it and it took care of the problem.

I can see the points making this an issue for some but in all seriousness, if you're not going to "use" a knife, and it's just a collector piece, then don't let it slam closed. If it's a knife that you're going to carry and use, and eventually need to sharpen anyway, then do that. Just use it, sharpen it, oil it, and eventually the roll won't happen anymore and you'll have a knife that has seen some miles that you can pass down. Don't worry about sharpening too much. 99% of us won't use a knife to its maximum capacity anyway, so there's no need to worry about running out of steel.
 
The good folks at ksf offered to replace it, have it fixed, or refund my money. Just wanted to make sure everyone knew that.

I elected to keep it. I do like the knife. I want it in my pocket even with that. I will probably take some blade off using my lansky to prevent it. Shouldn't take much. I don't mind that especially when I'll be getting paid when doing it lol
 
Cory Hess said:
That's one of those questions where my philosophy and my experience don't jive. In my head it should be good enough for a knife to not hit the backspring when closed gently. In reality, I know that that knife will get left behind in favor of a knife that I don't have to worry about. Having a knife in my pocket is all about convenience. I carry a knife so that when I need one I don't have to run to the kitchen or desk or junk drawer. The less convenient a knife is the less likely I'm going to have it in my pocket.

This doesn't mean that I don't think they're good knives or that I don't enjoy playing with them. I just don't end up carrying them and thus they end up getting rehomed to somebody that can appreciate them more than I do.
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Some folks might not like gently closing the blade on a Madison Barlow. Some might not mind. I will also slam the blade closed against my leg on a user if my hands are full. But I don't really view it as normal use. I do appreciate that it matters to some that they snap the blade closed. In this case, I would just sharpen the blade down until it didn't hit. Those that aren't comfortable sharpening it themselves might want to send it in to GEC for them to do it or pay for a sharpening service. Or just sell the knife (with full disclosure).

If the kick isn't optimal, GEC might consider making it broader in the future. Based only on photos, it does look sorta narrow for such a large blade.

What is the manufactuer's responsibility? It's not clear to me. For comparison, the modern Benchmade axis lock folders aren't supposed to be slammed open and closed. I had a Griptilian with a note that said slamming it open would void the warranty.
 
I don't find that this is something I would take back to the manufacturer. I'd assume that they don't intend to make a knife where the blade hits the backspring. I view it the same way I do a stockman that has blade rub. It's not ideal, but it's going to happen on a certain percentage of knives. They need to be aware if it's happening more than it should, but I'm lazy and assume that somebody else will handle that. :p
 
SVTFreak said:
I emailed ksf this morning but I think I'll just keep it as is and use it. Maybe even get out the grayco and take a bit off to stop it.

Thanks everyone!
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Did you realize that is the owner of KSF that addressed you?

FTR, those words Derrick said is what separates KSF from others. You bought a used knife, had a problem, the owner of the brand addressed you, and will still stand behind his product.
 
HST said:
Did you realize that is the owner of KSF that addressed you?

FTR, those words Derrick said is what separates KSF from others. You bought a used knife, had a problem, the owner of the brand addressed you, and will still stand behind his product.
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Yes I realize that. Thanks though.

Also, was a new one. Not used.

I'm about to order another from them but I'm very torn. Red micarta 77 or a jigged bone or stag something. Just can't narrow it down.
 
I've had this happen on more than one knife. Has not happened in a long time. I have never messed with the springs. Just sharpened my knives. Sorted it's self out.
 
Trout Hound said:
I don't know about you guys, but when I'm working in the garden and I'm holding one thing in one hand and a knife in the other hand and maybe something else in my mouth, I may only have one finger free to snap the blade shut. If that's gonna be a problem, then it means the knife won't get used. I totally understand that knives will have individual imperfections, many of which I am happy to accept, but that would be a deal-breaker for me personally, at least if I intended to actually use the thing. To each their own.
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Agreed it will shorten the life of the knife significantly and be a pain in the rear for sure
 
A message to the guys that claim this to be an absolute "deal breaker":

Please don't buy knives and intentionally slam them closed just to see if it rolls the edge and don't use this method to find out if you need to return them or not. You're abusing the products and creating a headache for the vendors as these knives can not be put back up for sale. They need to be fixed by GEC, or whoever else, so that they can be then re-sold to someone who appreciates them.
 
SVTFreak said:
Yes I realize that. Thanks though.

Also, was a new one. Not used.

I'm about to order another from them but I'm very torn.
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I was reading quickly and obviously inferred wrongly or read way too quickly.

Good luck and have fun picking your new pocket knife. I'm on my phone replying to quotes, so if I've missed something again, that's why.
 
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