Question about making Semi Full Tang handle

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Sep 27, 2014
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Hi,
I was given a Helle temagami blank for Christmas that has a "semi full tang." I have only made a couple handles and both had scales. This one is going to require a solid handle that has a groove for the tang. I have some ideas on how to cut the groove. Like a couple passes on the table saw, or across my router table. But I haven't really wrapped my mind around the curve of the tang.

Cut the shape of the handle, turn it upside down. Set the depth and use the curve of the handle to shape the curve of the tang?

I would appreciate some ideas or tips so I don't screw it up.
Thanks
Randy
 
The easiest way to do it is with a 3-piece handle, like this one:
482515_457378120998576_1388212552_n.jpg

Assemble and shape the handle first, then put the blade in.

- Chris
 
Randy,

I'm not sure if I understand you concern about screwing it up, since I don't know what you're afraid to screw up. But here's how I would do it:

Find a nice, squared up block of wood. Trace the blade, holes and tang, and draw a straight line across the bottom of the tang from the lowest point in front (ignoring the curve down to the edge) to the lowest point at the back of the tang. Measure from this line up the highest "hump" of the back of the tang. Now slot the wood with a table saw to that depth plus some extra for sanding. The difference between the lower tang curve and the straight cut won't matter as you'll fill that channel with epoxy, and the butt of the handle will be in full contact with the wood, hiding this crude fitting method.

Use the edge of a narrow file to get that tight curve of the front bottom of the tang slotted into the handle. This slot only has to be pretty where it ends - where you can see it when looking at the edge.

Now mark the profile of the final handle shape you want and cut that shape with a coping saw. Do it oversized; you want to leave enough material to sand away down to the exposed tang after gluing. Completely finish shape and sand the front of the handle - the part that the blade/ricasso disappears into. This is the "guard" or "bolster" area of the handle. This should be the last time you sand this part of the handle.

At this point you should be ready for gluing. But some scotch tape on the blade where it comes out of the handle and put the handle on. Using an razor, cut the tape using the finished front of the handle as a guide. Pull the handle off and peel just the tape that was under the wood. The tape that's left will keep epoxy off the exposed blade. Tape up the finished area of the front of the handle for the same reason. After the glue has set, whatever leaked out the front between blade and handle will only be sticking to tape and will peel right off.

Rough the tang up a little with course sand paper and degrease with alcohol. Fill the handle slot with epoxy as well as the tang holes. I like the long cure stuff for extra strength. A single clamp is fine - high pressure isn't going to make the bond better with epoxy. Wipe off the extra, but don't worry about it.

After it has completely cured, peel the tape. Start your sanding by bringing the wood on the back and butt of the tang down to the tang metal. Expect to finish sand both together for a perfect finished look. You don't need pins with this type of tang, but if you want them, use your traced template at this point to locate the holes. I'd recommend using undersized pin material so your hole locating doesn't have to be perfect. The purpose of the pins is to tie the two handle sides together - they will run though the epoxy in the tang holes. Epoxy them in. Don't peen them - that will just stress the wood. Cut them off when cured, shape during sanding. Brass and copper pins are good for this because they sand easily. If you wanted a lanyard hole in the wood under the tang, drill that now, too.

The rest of the work is done with a dremel sander or by hand. Hold the handle frequently as you shape it until it feels perfect. Then sand by hand for smoothness and beauty. The top and butt of the tang and the pin ends should blend right into the wood. Everything else should be hidden inside. Hopefully you finished the front of the handle enough that you don't have to go anywhere near the blade with sandpaper, but tape the blade just in case until you're done.

Linseed or other oil finishes are great, simple wax ain't bad.
 
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An answer and question.

Fear of screwing it up...I realize that I can fix most problems and start over. It's that I have a nice piece of wood I found after a number of months looking out in the forest. Beautiful grain and rays. But it is just big enough for one handle. If I mess it up there isnt another. I'm pretty partial to it so I want to have a reliable process for making a handle for this type of tang.

Thanks for both replies here. Detailed and easy for me to figure out.

Question about peening. I was wondering about it stressing the wood. I would hate to have a piece break or crack because of it. So how necessary is peening when you use scales? Or does the epoxy and pin still work fine?

Randy
 
Chris,
Do you put pins in your handles like the one in picture you posted? If not, what keeps the handle from coming off over time? Will good epoxy be enough?
 
Question about peening. I was wondering about it stressing the wood. I would hate to have a piece break or crack because of it. So how necessary is peening when you use scales? Or does the epoxy and pin still work fine?

Randy


The purpose of the pins is to tie the two handle sides together - they will run though the epoxy in the tang holes. Epoxy them in. Don't peen them - that will just stress the wood. Cut them off when cured, shape during sanding. Brass and copper pins are good for this because they sand easily. If you wanted a lanyard hole in the wood under the tang, drill that now, too.

Just like with the tang, rough sand and degrease the pin material, then use epoxy. You can peen into a counter sink, but controlling how the pin deforms so it is only forming into the countersink is challenging, and does more possible damage for an extremely questionable increase in holding tension on the wood.

The old way of making knives involves a lot of dry mounting, riveting and peening - but wood changes shape and dries over time, so these methods aren't great in the long term. Epoxy is magical - as long as it has enough surface area to act on. Anza's file flats have so much surface area that the maker epoxies the scales on without holes or pins. With a semi-full tang handle and holes in the tang, I'd seriously consider skipping the pins altogether if it is such pretty wood.
 
Epoxy isn't the "magical" thing you think it is. Properly peened pins will hold forever. Epoxy might.
 
Epoxy isn't the "magical" thing you think it is. Properly peened pins will hold forever. Epoxy might.

The pins or peened tangs will last forever, but that doesn't keep the wood from rattling around and failing to support the tang when it dries out.

Epoxy also has limitations, but the increase the surface area that attaches wood to metal. For the OP's purposes, epoxy and glued pins are going to out last tension peened rivets. Especially if the rivets aren't expertly peened and the wood cracks.

Which might have something to do with the popularity of corby rivets and other non-peened pins.


No disrespect - just my opinion.
 
Finishes were mentioned in one of the replies here.

Linseed oil and possibly wax. So do most knife finishes on wood use some form of oil? Is lacquer or poly a possibility too? Or are there problems with poly and lacquers?
Randy
 
Linseed oil is not the choice., and you'll need a base under whatever wax you might use. Your wood choice will determine(to an extent) what oil you want. More than likely, Tung oil will be what you want. Apply 4-8 light coats with a light sanding between each(600-800 grit), then a decent paste wax... maybe.:D

-Peter
 
The easiest way to do it is with a 3-piece handle, like this one:
482515_457378120998576_1388212552_n.jpg

Assemble and shape the handle first, then put the blade in.

- Chris

Some time back a couple of years ago some friends of mine asked me to re-handle a kitchen knife that was their favorite knife. Their little knife wasn't worth the trouble but they are good friends and the knife was their favorite so I re-handled it for them anyway.

I used the three piece method much the same as you but this being a kitchen knife I used Micarta and the tang was odd shaped and I couldn't insert the tang after the handle was inserted. I left the three handle pieces over size with the center piece thicker than the tang and I drilled alignment holes well outside the finish handle area. Temporary alignment rods (welding rods) kept the handle pieces in alignment while I shaped and finish sanded the end of the handle pieces adjacent to the ricaso.

When the handle pieces were ready for glue up I glued one scale, the center piece and the tang using the welding rods to keep the pieces in alignment. After the glue had cured I ground the center piece of handle material down to the same thickness as the tang, drilled the holes for the Corbys and then I glued the second scale to the handle using the welding rods to keep everything in alignment and finished drilling the Corby holes through the second scale.

After the second glue up had cured I proceeded with shaping and sanding.
 
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Here's the blade we're talking about:
1491.jpg


Here's what it look like assembled with a slotted one piece handle:
IMG_6177.JPG
 
A mortised handle would be the best IMHO. take scales, remove half the thickness of the tang from both pieces, only where the tang is, glue and corby…
 
Here's the blade we're talking about:
1491.jpg


Here's what it look like assembled with a slotted one piece handle:
IMG_6177.JPG

Yep, That's the blade. So the finished one in the picture. Will that finish be some form of oil (like Tung)or will it be topped with poly?

Randy
 
I bought 2 of these Helle semi tang blanks to learn handle making/shaping.
last night's work
not the best but my first real try
i basically attempted to copy the Helle handles design
I have large hands at 6 ft tall so this seems to work for me

I can still put 30-60 mins more of hand sanding to improve the shape and blending and I will do that
I used Nick Wheeler's guidelines and it was very helpful. (http://www4.gvsu.edu/triert/cache/articles/nw1/scales1.htm)
The filler is some G10 I had left over from another project, it was within a few thousands thickness of the Helle blank
I'm not sure what the wood is, maybe pistachio?
there are several amateur mistakes on it with inspection and this certainly wouldn't be able to sell in the marketplace! but it was enjoyable learning

I'm new at this so go easy on me guys.... :-)

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finished the outside work just before the Newport Beach sunset!

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I think I might have burned part of the wood rushing

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I nicked the top of the blade with the belt but I think I can smooth it out

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685DBD44-79F5-46B6-A71F-49A80E76BA5B_zpse2rovbte.jpg
 
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