Question on Recondo

Crayola

Crayola

Joined
Sep 23, 1999
Messages
3,831
First of all, that is a very unique knife! It is a uniqueness I like. I think that clipping a tanto pointed blade defies the functional purpose of the tanto point but in this case it is a modern interpretation of the SOG bowie (right?) so it makes great sense! Good Job to all at SOG.

Here's my side line though, and I know there was a thread on this already, but combo edge only!!!!!???? Educating the sheeple and non-knife nuts should take care of that and it is our responsibility colectively to do that,.... oh geez, I'll save that speech for some other time!!
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Here's my question: How thick is the steel? Simple question yet I have to ask it in as complicated a manner as I could!

I shall add at this point that when I look at the Recondo I ask myself, "Self, wouldn't a nice set of green canvas micarta scales look great on that handle?" I further answer myself by saying, "Self, I think you are right. Rag micarta would look great too, as would yellow or some other fancy variety. Self, it is a good thing you bought that drill press a couple of months ago and got that grinder for x-mas"

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"Come What May..."
 
Hi Crayola,

Thanks for the kind comments relative to the Recondo.

X-42RECO.jpg

http://www.sogknives.com/new_products.htm

I'm not sure, though, what you mean by "clipping a pointed blade defies the functional purpose of the tanto point." From what I understand, the functional purpose of a tanto is point strength. I held a Tsunami (a tanto bladed SOG of similar size) and the Recondo side-by-side, and I can promise you, there are equal amounts of steel on the Recondo leading all the way to the tip. This has a very thick tip! Also, due to the shape of the pyramid-like tip, penetration should be better than a standard tanto. Now for the steel. Most tantos are AUS6 (or similar steel). The Recondo is BG-42 with a Rockwell hardness of 62-64! Between the design and the materials of this knife, it should easily out perform most every tanto in its class.

I understand the comment about the combo edge. Some knife nuts do prefer a straight edge only. But sales statistics for SOG show an overwhelming desire for the combo edge. So we aim to please.
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(If you like the Vision, check out the straight edge Vision post.)

Blade thickness: .160"

For the knife enthusiast who can craft handles from from G-10, wood, Micarta, or whatever ones choice might be (or even wrap it in cord), the handles on the Recondo are designed to be easily removed and replaced with a material of their choosing.

If you have any other questions, ask away!




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Ron Andersen
Consumer Services Manager

Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
Thanks for the info Ron. Great idea having the handle scales removable.

My point about tanto tops is in relation to their function and construction: In order to have a STRONG tip you need a lot of mass at the tip of the blade to back up the point. Daggers aren't as strong at the tip as most, if not all other tip designs (this is all relative, of course.) If you look at the tip of the Cold Steel Tantos you'll see my point.

http://www.coldsteel.com/untitled2.html

The thickness of the spine remains the same up until the last, less than an inch section of the tip. This is very strong, although not as penetrative as a dagger. Any steel removed from this thick spine portion will weaken it to some degree. This was my sole point. The spine of the Recondo looks like it has a clip to it (the spine thickness isn't like on the CS tantos) but I do believe that it thickens at the point. I have seen the Recondo only in pics form a few angles but I do believe I remember this. Thickening the point liek that does increase strength. And, your steel choice is excellent- very tough! All I am saying is that Tantos were designed to have a tough point, period. Clipping the spine has been a design attempt at making penetration better and also I believe for aesthetic purposes- make them tantos look REAL COOL and they will sell better. A thickened point and your choice of steel are steps that bring the tanto closer to the strong tip portion of the spectrum yet you retain the aesthetic/penetration capabilities too.

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"Come What May..."
 
Hi Crayola,

Thanks for your comments. Have you seen a Recondo in person? With SOG only have been shipping them for a couple of weeks now, not many people have had the chance to handle them. What the picture does NOT show is that the final downward swoop to the point is VERY flaired and THICK! Kind of pyramid shaped.

Put it side-by-side with most tantos on the market, and you will see equal amounts of steel thickness at the tip. No point strength loss here and there is no comparison with it to a dagger (or other thin-pointed knife) relative to thickness.

Ron@SOG

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Ron Andersen
Consumer Services Manager
SOG Specialty Knives, Inc.

Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com


[This message has been edited by Ron@SOG (edited 10-23-2000).]
 
Hey Ron. I haven't seen them in person yet. Our knife shop in town isn't all that great. I'll be in Calgary in 2 weeks though and I'll be looking in display cases for it!

I get what you mean by the pyramid tip and I can't wait to see one of these great blades in person!



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"Come What May..."
 
Hey guys,
I have one and it is an awesome knife. Very good feel in the hand. The guard/thumb ramp proximities feel kinda like an Emerson. It has great balance centered slightly forward of the forefinger. With a BG-42 blade you really can't ask for much more. The sheath is functional but rough and could use some improvement. For under 100.00 it is an excellent buy. I will be using it hard for the next three months and will report back on it's abilities. Now I've been known to snap a knife before, but think this stout knife will give me a run for my money. Also, in your hand it is much larger than the pictures. So far, I highly recommend it.
Mike

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Sworn to defend the Constitution
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I just ordered mine, I have not seen one in person as there are not any knife shops around here. After seeing the pictures and hearing everyone's responses I just could not resist buying one. I've been wanting to get a knife with BG-42 for sometime after all the raves coming from it. I think this will be exactly what I want in a low profile knife. I will tell you when I get it.
 
Hi All,

Mike, thanks for the kind comments. We are very excited about this knife. Could you comment on the tip thickness from your perspective for Crayola? When I turn the knife and look directly down on the spine, I find the last 1.5" toward the tip are among the thickest part of the blade. How would you compare its visual thickness and potential durability at point strength compared to other tantos? (I understand that your field testing will be the true proof.)

Thanks Sig for your enthusiasm (and your order).
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I've had a Recondo on my desk for some time now, finding myself playing with it while talking with customers or while in meetings (playing with knives is a business perk). It is really a hard knife to put down.

Crayola, I really hope that you can get your hands on one soon. I'm sure you will quickly wish to add it to your collection. I wish I knew a store which carried them to refer. I know House of Knives in the BC area carries a number of our products.

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Ron Andersen
Consumer Services Manager
SOG Specialty Knives, Inc.

Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
With eager ears I will wait, flash!

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"Come What May..."
 
Crayola,
In my opinion the Recondo tip is designed to perform pretty different tasks than classic Japanese sword tip. Here I have tried to show the difference in the drawing.
View

Saying "tanto" we are often speaking about somewhat "americanized" traditional Japanese sword's blade tip. This one was designed to pierce when whacking but not when stabbing. I'm not too knowledgeable about traditional Japanese sword fighting techniques but as to my knowledge the straight stabs are not common there. The main kind of blows is whacking with entire blade or with the tip only (let someone correct me if I'm wrong). Both tips (main and secondary) are working in this whacking making two points of load concentration what hit target one closely after another. This caused that both main and secondary tips are supported with pretty amount of steel in the maximal load direction (see drawing). However this kind of tip is not good for straight stabbing, probably because it is not designed for.

The Recondo tip is designed for straight stabbing and it is supported in this direction. The blade has almost full thickness (3,3 mm) at just 15 millimeters behind the tip and full thickness 4 mm at 28 millimeters behind the tip directly in stabbing direction.
The secondary point here is not necessary and - please note - it is not too pronounced. In my honest opinion the blade would lose nothing even with rounded secondary tip or without this one at all. However I'm going to round this point on mine as far as it will be possible without thorough regrinding.

This is the main difference from Cold Steel tantos which being knives at the same time are imitating sword tips.
Please take into consideration that real Japanese tanto knife blades are shaped pretty differently from both SOG and CS knives. You can see the knife shaped very closely like traditional Japanese tanto on the Tactical Knives May'2000 cover. Yes, this knife is designed for stabbing instead of common americanized tantos.

And here are my very first impressions on the Recondo.
Nicely balanced knife, ideal for piercing. This blade design seems to join penetration abilities close to double-edged dagger with near-tanto tip strength. It literally asks me to stab something. I'm going to test on the plastic drum I have in my garage and something else, then I'll share my impressions.
The handle fits my hand very comfortably in saber and reverse grip, a small bit worse in hammer grip. It seems to be designed for the hand somewhat larger than mine, this could cause the difference.

Very versatile sheath. I have found one interesting detail: the knife can be put into the sheath both for right-hand and for left-hand carry.
Though I'm not too partial to dedicated fighting knives Recondo would be one of my very first choices if modern fighting knife would be required.

My main complain is serration. It is far too shallow to work anyway. I'm going to deepen them with round diamond files although I'm expecting this could be somewhat tricky on BG-42 blade. However the plain edged version would be my choice if would be available.
And what about the version with clip point blade?

Unfortunately my photo camera (old Russian ZENIT) have kicked the bucket literally some days before I have received my Recondo. I'm going to publish my review on Knife Review & Testing Forum as fast as I will restore my camera or buy new one (this last is more probable). Also I'm going to update it after some stabbing and cutting tests.

 
Sergiusz: Thank-you very much for that great info. How you make such great pictures is a pleasant mystery too! I shall now re-think my ideas on "tanto" tips, both traditional tantos, CS tanto tips and the Recondo tanto tip. And of course any other tip I see inbetween!

By the way, as far as I know stabbing in Japanese sword art systems isn't uncommon at all, but the majority of strikes is with slashing type movements utilizing primarily the tip.

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"Come What May..."
 
oh boy
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This puppy is a stabber indeed.To be specific, Sergiusz's picture says it all. In the time since my last post, I've tried the stab action on a few different materials and with different densities behind the surface. To elaborate,
50lb sack of corn, 3\16 in. plastic water barrel- filled, and 12in vinyl roll. The water barrel and Vinyl were the real test. In a foward saber grip strike the plastic barrel was easier than I expected. I was able to insert the blade in the vinyl roll up to my thumb with a little more force than used on the barrel. The barrel is much tougher than any skin you might encounter. As you can tell, I expect this knife to be used for chores besides any defensive possibilities. I removed the lanyard even though it is of high quality, it's just a personal preference.
The shape is like a BM Stryker on steroids. the tip is very thick and left a sizable channel. As for looking into the knife from the tip, it appears to be thickest at the tip but in an illusion because it is closer to your eye and appears to bulge. Using a caliper I found that the bulge at the tip is slightly less thick than the spine at the thumb ramp. Mine measured .112 and is located .4 in. from the tip. The swedge is thicker towards the tip. The tip angle is more accute than the stryker adding to the ease of penetration.
The picture dosn't show the striations on the pommel either. These are excellent for the reverse grip and my thumb fits comfortably there. The scales were functional and will not slip when wet.
Next will be slash and cutting test.
What is written on the pommel?
Mike
 
Sergiusz Mitin:

Nice elaboration on the differences between a Japanese-style sword tip and that of the Americanized tanto.

However, you did forget the yokote in that drawing and the spot of the mitsukado isn't very well defined I think
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but in either case, the 1/3 or so of the blade nearest the tip is the main striking area and is referred to as the monouchi, and is used to cleave. The tip style of shinogi-zukuri is intended to help that cleaving motion. Remember you're not trying to slice at your opponent, you're trying to cut through them.

Tsuki/thrusts were/are actually rather common, but are not as emphasized as much for obvious reasons.

Nice job in differentiating the difference though.

Shinryû.
 
Hi Mike,

The writing on the butt portion of the Recondo is the knife designer's signature: Spencer Frazer.

Thanks again everyone for your great comments.

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Ron Andersen
Consumer Services Manager
SOG Specialty Knives, Inc.

Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
Well I finally got one from my supplier. I've been waiting for these since I saw them at the Blade Show this past summer. What a great looking knife!!! Way to go SOG. This should be a great seller for all of your dealers.

Any word on the release date on the switchpliers? If they are out, which distributors have them? I would like to pick some up for my customers before Christmas.

Thank you,

Phil

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www.2thehilt.com

[This message has been edited by 2thehilt (edited 10-26-2000).]
 
Hi Phil,

I always have a couple knives on my desk to "play" with. This Recondo just may never leave!
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(By the way, my desk work knives, and I have several of the same, are the Air-SOG...I know you didn't ask.) Thanks for your warm comments. After you have had a chance to "play" with it, come back and comment. We'd love to hear; maybe under the Knife Reviews and Testing area?

The SwitchPliers have just started production and some initial orders have started shipping. It will take a couple weeks to have our production completely geared up and we certainly hope to have most or all orders filled for the Christmas rush!
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Dealer issues are not my personal department and I do not know the allocation process. If you are interested, contact your supplier. These are worth the wait and a must have item!


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Ron Andersen
Consumer Services Manager
SOG Specialty Knives, Inc.

Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com

[This message has been edited by Ron@SOG (edited 10-27-2000).]
 
Uhh.... what IS a switch-plier? I've seen the pic and read a few posts but not enough to know its key, super duper features that make it different from other multi tools.

Thanks!

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"Come What May..."
 
Well, mine just came. This is one sweet feeling knife and with the option of changing the handle material. I don't think you could go wrong getting one. I have to say well done Sog. For the price, this is one excellent knife, one I'd expect to sell closer to $200.00 . You people have out done yourselves.
I will give a more in depth opinion of this knife after I have carried it for awhile. I will probally make some wood handles for it just for fun when I get more free time from work. When I do,I'll see if I can find someone who can post the pics for me.
I do have a question that I was hoping a few of you can help me with as I don't have any experience with BG-42. What would be the best way to sharpen this material. I currently use ceramic rods, and was curious as to the best sharpening angle with this knife. Does anyone suggest a different method of sharpening for this knife.
 
Unless life has changes considerably, I think SOG knifes are hand sharpened at the factory. This means that the angle has slight variations for each knife. With something as hard as BG-42 you will definately want to use a ceramic, or diamond sharpener.

When sharpening, for the first couple of passes, what I do is look at the angle very closely so that my sharpening pass matches the edge angle of the knife. It is pretty easy to see if you look carefully. The grind of the edge should sit flat against the sharpener. Run it this way, a few times to get the feel, and you should be fine.

Incidentally, in some of the back issues of Blade magazine, Wayne Goddard has some excellent descriptions of how edges are formed and how to sharpen them.
 
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