Question re: Millie and Benchmark steels

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ulmus_fulva

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Mar 1, 2009
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I just want to start off by saying that after lurking around here for a bit I decided to join because I was impressed at how helpful (and quite well spoken) the board members have been when replying to questions that can sometimes be quite newbie-esque.

Which brings me to my question(s).

I'm relatively new on the knife scene but I've taken it upon myself to do a whole heck of a lot of reading and video viewing (mainly for the three dimensional views... and I'm not even going to come close to mentioning any reviewer names :D). I've always tended to be well informed in any of my tech/gadget/toy purchases and would usually opt for something of better quality (at a higher price), knowing that the item will be looked after and what might seem a little pricey to some becomes a bargain after years of use. This won't be just a one-time purchase sort of thing though, since I've developed a pretty nice wish list... and I'm just on folders at the moment.:)

I'm waiting on delivery of a couple small folders and one medium sized one... all of them are priced pretty low. I'm dying to get my hands on a Griptilian and so I'll be placing an order later tonight (551). The purpose of this thread is to get a bit of help in choosing a slightly larger folder, in the 4" range. Or rather, help in choosing a steel for the folder. It seemed that the first obvious choice for a larger folder is a Military and I quite like the price for the standard G10/S30V model. I also like having the choice of Carbon/BG42 and Carbon/S90V. After crunching some numbers the BG42 model carries a 30% higher price than the S30V while the S90V is a whopping 55% more. I'm pretty sure BG42 and S90V are sprint runs which should make the knife more appealing if I ever had to trade/sell it, no? What advantages would one type of steel have over the other? Would they be better suited to different uses? I'll be getting the Spyderco sharpening kit and plan to put in the time to develop that skill but are any of these choices too difficult to do myself?

Come to think of it, in the price range of the upgraded steels it brings me into Benchmade 710/740/930 territory... which brings in 154CM and D2... and more choices. I'd like to get most, if not all, of these eventually so it's not a matter of only choosing one of out them all. I'm kind of leaning to the Military to get first but I'd love an honest opinion/suggestion from anyone reading this. There's only so much I can gather from looking at charts and lists of properties of steels which is why I'm asking those of you who've had experience with any of these. As far as uses go, besides having it in my pocket in a just-in-case scenario walking outdoors at night I'd like something suited to a wide range of day-to-day uses along with hard use (whatever that means to you).

This is already becoming a long post so I'll leave it at that. Thanks for reading.
 
the bg42 and s90v millies are sprint runs. the bg42 models are much more difficult to come by, as the s90v models are still stocked at many places.

nothing wrong with s30v. it is a good steel and will serve you well. and as you mention, the price is right.

i own millies in s90v, bg42, and d2. d2 is one of my favorite all around steels. i find it takes and holds a very fine edge. i like steels with rc hardnesses in the 59+ range for folders, less frequent sharpening, and longer edge holding (at least in my experience). s30v is a bit softer, and i can't get the same edge as i can with the other three.

in this category, bg42 is my second favorite, only slightly behind d2. my s90 millie is fairly new, so the verdict is not in yet. though it has kept the factory sharpness after about three weeks of carry and soft-med media cutting. very impressive so far.

if you can find one, the d2/foliage green military should be in the $140 range (it was also a sprint run, but seems to still be available at retail prices).
 
S90V is my personal favorite. It is more time-consuming to sharpen, as the steel has excellent wear resistence. The edge will last though more cutting than the S30V or D2.

BG-42 is a very nice steel, much easier to sharpen than S90V and holds an edge longer that anything that easy to sharpen has any right to. It was running about even with the CPM D2 Military as my favorite until the S90V came along and kicked them both out of my pocket.

Ingot D2 such as Benchmade uses is a little less corrosion resistent than the CPM D2 that Spyderco used in the Military and Parmilitary sprint runs, but it is still a nice tool steel.
 
Buying a knife to use and then expecting a better price when selling it just because it's a sprint run won't work. The different steels will give you different performance but they aren't all that different, especially if you aren't stressing the blade beyond ordinary cutting. All this to say you'll probably do fine with the S30V.

I have the S30V and the BG-42 and I haven't carried the BG-42 yet, being happy with the S30V. You can get a lot out of S30V with the Sharpmaker, especially if you take the trouble to polish the edge with the fine rods.
 
Thanks for the info so far.

When I mentioned a sprint run as more appealing I didn't mean dollar value. I tend to think something that is no longer available or 'limited edition' would pique someone's interest a bit more than a model you can get pretty much anywhere. I don't foresee being in a situation where I get down to having to sell it so it's not a concern for me.

If the BG42 indeed is noticeably easier to sharpen than S90V (which sounds a bit intimidating) I think it would be a better fit for the time being while I'm still developing my sharpening skills.
 
I don't know about the S90V, but the BG-42 has very nice carbon fiber scales. BG-42 is also the steel used by Chris Reeve for many years in his Sebenza before he switched to S30V.
 
BG-42 is easier to sharpen then S90V.

I missed the run of BG-42, so if you know where they're still stocked.... ;) Let me know.

I'd start off with a S30V model. I prefer Spyderco over Benchmade (for a lot of reasons I won't discuss on the board), so I'd stick with the Military.
 
The Griptilian is a great knife, just great, and some of the variants are really interesting ... the Ritter Grips, colored handles, D2. Like Josh K, I prefe Spyderco but in my case it's probably just a matter of style. I usually find them more comfortable to carry and handle.
 
Hmm, I wonder why CR would make the switch to S30V... was it new at the time?

The S90V does come with the carbon handle as well:D

I'm excited about getting the Griptilian, but I think my only options for the handle are black, black, and uh, black. Blade is 154CM... the D2 I only see for the higher priced models (that are available to me).

I do like a whole whack of the Spydercos and can see myself ending up with a plethora... I want to try to spread out my knife purchases so I don't get carried away though. And all I have in mind right now are folders... once the weather warms up I'll be looking for fixed blades to use outdoors too :D
 
I absolutely agree you should study what's available and try to pick up different models from each company that impresses you. Using the different styles is the only way to know what works best for you under what circumstances.

Chris Reeve worked with the manufacturer to develop S30V.

I like to repeat what a knifemaker once told us, that there are only two steels: high carbon and alloy (stainless). There are really 3: carbon, alloy and high-tech alloy. The better stainless steels are signficantly closer to carbon steels in performance, with other advantages thrown in.

But which steel is "best" is often a matter of "best for what". Factor in how close performance among them all will be, the cost of the steel, the different costs of the manufacturing processes, and how much you're willing to pay for small increments of performance in a knife with a more prestigious name and superior fit and finish.

Better isn't always better. A Swiss Army Knife, Ka-Bar Dozier, Boker Subcom, or Kershaw Leek are all inexpensive, well-designed, effective everyday carry knives.

But good enough is never enough! :D
 
ulmus_fulva said:
Hmm, I wonder why CR would make the switch to S30V... was it new at the time?

The S90V does come with the carbon handle as well:D

I'm excited about getting the Griptilian, but I think my only options for the handle are black, black, and uh, black. Blade is 154CM... the D2 I only see for the higher priced models (that are available to me).

I do like a whole whack of the Spydercos and can see myself ending up with a plethora... I want to try to spread out my knife purchases so I don't get carried away though. And all I have in mind right now are folders... once the weather warms up I'll be looking for fixed blades to use outdoors too :D
Click to expand...

You will love the Grip. I started with one and now I have six! I just can't get enough of a good thing. If you ever want to walk on the Griptilian 'wild side', check out Aeromedix for the Ritter Grips.

For me, the Military is one of the best folders produced. I have them in CPM D2, S30V, BG-42 and S90V. My personal preference is the CF BG-42, as I have found that BG-42 is relatively easy to sharpen and takes an extremely fine edge. Truth be told, they are all great steels, which you owe it to yourself to eventually try out.

@ Josh K. - See my sig. :)
 
The Military is a fine choice. I personally believe that it is the most versatile folder ever made. Not nearly the strongest or toughest, but the most versatile. You won't be doing any prying with the Millie, unless you like broken blade tips. The Millie has a real splinter picker of a tip, allowing it to do jobs that you'd normally only be able to do with a small thin bladed knife.

I really like the basic S30v Military. Decently tough, nicely abrasion resistant, and holds an edge for a fair amount of time. But if I had the chance, I'd definitely go for the BG-42 or D2. BG-42 is a positively wonderful steel. D2 has awesome edge holding, but is definitely not stainless. I'm not sure if I'd even consider S90v, is it seems to be a bit too brittle for a knife as large as a Military, with that thin of a tip.

The Benchmade 710 is definitely a competitor. It has a stronger tip, a stronger lock, and a better pocket clip. But IMHO, it's not nearly as versatile as a Military. The scales of the 710 aren't nearly as grippy, and the thumb stud can be hard to get your thumb on. The 710 isn't nearly as ergonomic as the Millie, and it has no finger choil to choke up on. I'd take the Millie over a 710 every time, for my needs.

Here's a comparison I did many years ago.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241702
 
Esav Benyamin said:
Better isn't always better. A Swiss Army Knife, Ka-Bar Dozier, Boker Subcom, or Kershaw Leek are all inexpensive, well-designed, effective everyday carry knives.

But good enough is never enough! :D
Click to expand...

My lil' Dozier is on its way... looks like a wonderful bargain. I still need to spend some time looking for a nice Swiss Army Knife or multi-tool and I'm not familiar with the Subcom... although I have seen a fair share of Boker claws on here. The Kershaw Leek is already high on my list (in S30V) and it looks like a nice sort of small, light carry knife to give as a gift too.

A.P.F. - I have a feeling I'm going to end up with one of each of the Military... is there a support group I can join after I do? :D

Buzzbait, thanks for the link... I haven't read it yet but I noticed you also threw in the large Sebenza too? That's a pretty sweet knife... it's 3.5", no?
 
Esav Benyamin said:
Our Spyderco forum ... but they're more like enablers than a support group. :)
Click to expand...

Seriously. :D

USPc40mags001.jpg


From: http://spyderco.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35395 :thumbup:
 
wow.... just wow.:eek:

hmm... could either of you pick a favo(u)rite? and how far back do those go? i see some older ones.
 
Mine go back to ATS-34 and 440V (I'm still a little unclear on which is older) but the only duplicate in that picture is a second S90V. Be advised that:
1) I'm in building maintenance, so my knives get used hard. As in, cutting out damaged drywall among other things.
2) I've been freehand sharpening on diamond hones for over twenty years. Vanadium carbide doesn't scare me.

I love the S90V Military, but for a novice sharpener, I'd suggest a BG-42 model if you can find one. The ATS-34 is very nice steel, but those have gotten very hard to find, and expensive when you do.
 
ulmus_fulva said:
wow.... just wow.:eek:

hmm... could either of you pick a favo(u)rite? and how far back do those go? i see some older ones.
Click to expand...

The Military was originally produced in ATS-34, but alas, I don't have one. Yab does though. ;)

My personal favorite is the S90V one. I sharpen on my Sharpmaker's Fine rods, and I plan on getting a set of UF ones to bring my edge up just a little. Sharpens fine, cuts like a laser. The stuff is hard, and you can definitely tell when you're sharpening it that it's going to take some time and effort.
 
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