Questions about 3v heat treat

[Willie71]

Plenty of well know makers do not use cryo and follow the data sheet protocol for 3v and their customers are not complaining but raving. I understand that cryo and low temp tempering can provide a better edge but at a certain point besides the uber knife nerd category the average users will never notice a difference. It seems to be that the vast majority of the general public suck at sharpening knives, they will take a thin geometry knife and will never sharpen it or will sharpen it but with a more obtuse secondary bevel and thus eliminate some of the advantages that a tweaked heat treat can provide. At one point our forefathers used chipped rocks as their cutting tools and they seemed to survive.

the difference in the edge geometry you can use with either protocol is quite noticeable.

 

[samuraistuart]

I jumped right to page 2 and was about to type this, then I saw Nathan already covered it on page 1.

The "average user" who actually uses their knife WILL be able to notice a difference. And to see for yourself, just search this forum for Nathan Carothers and 3v performance. There is either photo evdience/video evidence/both (I don't directly recall) where he tested what we might call Crucible's "industry standard" HT vs the "Delta 3v cryo with low temper". See for yourself.

 

[Seedy Lot]

Plenty of people out there use 3v knives with the standard boring heat treat and swear it is the best knife steel they have ever used, the maker i know who uses 3v is over 5 years backlogged and all his users swear how good his heat treat is, this is with knives ground with 12 dps geometry and beat on by the bushcraft community. While i personally find 3v to have micro chipping issues with the geometry i like and the actual field use that my knives sees i also know countless numbers of people who actually use there 3v knives with zero issues.

MY knives i use, and i do use knives as i live on a farm , successes hunter often fielding butchering large animals deep in the mountains, and outdoors person spending more time outside than most the people in this county, are 4v and M4 with a high temper heat and i am running thin geometry and low 60s hardness and i have zero issues and i am not know one to be easy on my tools.

I understand that with a low temper protocol that a knife can be designed with thinner geometry and reaping all associated benefits yet if a maker can not use cryo, or does not want yo, it does not mean the knife is going to be noticeably inferior in actual use.

 

[Willie71]

Plenty of people out there use 3v knives with the standard boring heat treat and swear it is the best knife steel they have ever used, the maker i know who uses 3v is over 5 years backlogged and all his users swear how good his heat treat is, this is with knives ground with 12 dps geometry and beat on by the bushcraft community. While i personally find 3v to have micro chipping issues with the geometry i like and the actual field use that my knives sees i also know countless numbers of people who actually use there 3v knives with zero issues.

MY knives i use, and i do use knives as i live on a farm , successes hunter often fielding butchering large animals deep in the mountains, and outdoors person spending more time outside than most the people in this county, are 4v and M4 with a high temper heat and i am running thin geometry and low 60s hardness and i have zero issues and i am not know one to be easy on my tools.

I understand that with a low temper protocol that a knife can be designed with thinner geometry and reaping all associated benefits yet if a maker can not use cryo, or does not want yo, it does not mean the knife is going to be noticeably inferior in actual use.

Using inferior geometry is making an inferior knife. I really don’t understand using a super steel and leaving 20% performance on the table.

 

[Seedy Lot]

Using inferior geometry is making an inferior knife. I really don’t understand using a super steel and leaving 20% performance on the table.

I want to start by saying i compete respect your work and knowledge Willie71, you are a breath of reason on this forum.

20 percent gain in performance according to what? If actual use of knife is 20 percent performance gain will it be noticeable in actual use?, slipping into Cliff Stamp territory.

Many of you are makers for the kitchen. I made a knife for a friend who is CIA chef out of Portland, steel is A2, which seems to be a steel high in RA and in need of at least sub zero if not cryo, he swears by the knife and not on nostalgia but performance, and no cryo.

We can strive for perfection and should with our craft but i really question at what point is perfection above reality.

 

[Seedy Lot]

Using inferior geometry is making an inferior knife. I really don’t understand using a super steel and leaving 20% performance on the table.

I want to start by saying i compete respect your work and knowledge Willie71, you are a breath of reason on this forum.

20 percent gain in performance according to what? If actual use of knife is 20 percent performance gain will it be noticeable in actual use?, slipping into Cliff Stamp territory.

Many of you are makers for the kitchen. I made a knife for a friend who is CIA chef out of Portland, steel is A2, which seems to be a steel high in RA and in need of at least sub zero if not cryo, he swears by the knife and not on nostalgia but performance, and no cryo.

We can strive for perfection and should with our craft but i really question at what point is perfection above reality.

 

[Seedy Lot]

Using inferior geometry is making an inferior knife. I really don’t understand using a super steel and leaving 20% performance on the table.

I want to start by saying i compete respect your work and knowledge Willie71, you are a breath of reason on this forum.

20 percent gain in performance according to what? If actual use of knife is 20 percent performance gain will it be noticeable in actual use?, slipping into Cliff Stamp territory.

Many of you are makers for the kitchen. I made a knife for a friend who is CIA chef out of Portland, steel is A2, which seems to be a steel high in RA and in need of at least sub zero if not cryo, he swears by the knife and not on nostalgia but performance, and no cryo.

We can strive for perfection and should with our craft but i really question at what point is perfection above reality.