Randall and Blackjack 1-7 Observations

[t1mpani]

randalls are forged. thus stronger & probably more durable. however blackjacks [current prod.] hold a better & longer edge. my brother has one of largest collections around [142 at present] some dating to 1950s. we own & use many brands in field. one thing we know is randalls are heat treated at a med r.w. hardness.the knives are nearly unbreakable but cutting performance is not as impressive as many other brands.
our comment: randalls have world wide mystique, known from russia to venszuela. even recog in mongolia. collector interest is strong but the cutting perm. is outstripped by many brands.i carried a randall along with my ka-bar for 4 yrs. in u.s.m.c. i never saw a ka-bar broken from calif. to phillipines. edge perm. was about the same.stake your life on what you desire;however we know randalls are'nt the greatest cutting performers. as an investment product the randall are hard to beat.

Do a search through this site on "forged versus stock removal." The "forged knives are stronger" thing is a myth when talking about the modern alloys and tool steels people are making knives out of today---steels which are forged under hundreds of tons of pressure, and then cut into bar stock which is then sold, and then ground into knives. Don't get me wrong, hand forging is extremely cool and along with the mystique of doing things the way they used to be done, there are also some shapes and designs (distal tapers, etc. ) that are actually much easier to do by a master with a hammer than somebody who is grinding exclusively.

Here's one thread on it, there are many, many, many, many others.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=288176&pp=20

My thoughts---Randalls have a great history and very nice build quality. They also, to my mind, under-harden their knives, and the type of edge holding that many people are accustomed to with modern hi-end knives just simply doesn't come out of them. It's true that there are trade-offs to knives being harder, but in general, the industry has moved on from the mid 50s HRC.

That said, I have a few and like them very much.

 

[DennisStrickland]

in all fairness to bruce,our randall uses are mostly based on the 01 steel
stainless steels have been formulated in last20 plus yrs. that have great edge durability.
almost all our randalls we have used were carbon
randall to our knowledge was still using s.s. which was not like the newer alloys
however the forging & randall heattreat could have made a difference in edge quality,
i do'nt doubt that 440b & 440c would show great improvement with a nitro. quench;perhaps a triple temper.
we maybe wrongly assumed since these were'nt randall procedures, carbon would preform better.the other gent is correct that forging doe'st make a better blade .
in earlier days forging was about the only way to get diffential hardness levels
times have changed & with exception of [art] knives modern blades & modern alloys give as good performance with stock removal
in fairness to randall they are still one of my favorite "safe" knives.

 

[bruce]

Wasn't there a recent thread in this forum about an evaluation of both a Busse and a Randall chopping cinder blocks? The Randall came out very well.

 

[shunsui]

As 2manyknives and kwackster pointed out, the current Blackjack Classic Model 1-7 is A2 tool steel. I believe it's a Mike Stewart (Bark River) production these days.

http://www.knivesshipfree.com/BlackJack-Classic

 

[DEAVERS]

I just purchased the commando, excited to get it in!

 

[Gaston444]

The Randall has a hollow ground blade and the Blackjack is convex. Also, the Randall knife has silver solder in the guard joint.

Very nice comparison, both of these blades are classic. Thanks.

Convex/hollow grind: By far the biggest difference between the two knives, and it doesn't get mentioned by the OP...

The Blackjack is slightly thinner edged initially (not by much), but over time a hollow grind does not get thicker, so over many sharpenings the Randall will retain its cutting performance easier and better.

Out of the box the Blackjack is sharper, but the sharpness potential over time is more with the Randall. To me the issue with the Randall is if the point is well ground, because I have had to send two back to re-grind a boat-like point... My Model 12 w/14 grind was much better in symmetry, and infinitely better in point geometry (which was perfect), than my 18 and 14...

Gaston