Randall No. 11-5 Initial Thoughts

[Mannlicher]

my wife bought me this Model 11 back in 1993. It has processed a lot of deer/hogs/gators and small game. Currently its retired, as I have found other knives that I like better for those tasks.

 

[TC]

Thank you for that. I can see his points, I don't dislike the guards as much as he does, I do like them to hang down a little because I absolutely loath integral guards. It's one of the reasons I got away from nives made by three of the companies I used to work for; TOPS, RMJ Tactical, and stopped carrying Fiddleback Forge knives even though I love everything else about Andy's knives. And it's one of the reasons I've declined testing and reviewing some knives online over the years, especially if the knife was presented as being a tactical style knife.

I fractured my pinkie twice on older TOPS knives doing tip work in frozen wood in Michigan in 2013 when my hands were cold.

I never had any such issues with the Spartan Defensa doing the same things and more

And I knew I wouldn't because I didn't have that issue in 2010 when I repeatedly punctured a fuel tank with a Spartan Hunter for a T&E article I did for Tactical Knives Magazine

I think Bill Harsey is among the few who sees the dynamic the same way I do.

One of the reason the RMJ Tactical Perefrine has the handle it has, is because when Jonathan was designing his first knife, I said "let me give you a little input" And I fixed a 2x12 on the wall of the shop, and stabbed the hunter into it full force in a reverse overhand grip. Then pulled it out and handed it to him and said now you. And he did.

Then I handed him another of my favorite knives, made for a completely different purpose, a Fiddleback midtech Kephart and said now this one. He looked at the knife and lack of guard, looked at the target, looked at me, handed the knife back and said "I get your point".

The Peregrine is a a fine combat knife in my opinion, and does well in bushcraft. But then I love recurves in the bush also.

Liking soldered brass, stainless, and nickle silver gueards is one of the reasons I paid as much as I did for this knife and for the EMK Rio Real I bought that was right at $500. I see them as more complete and more functional than most knives woth slab scales and integral guards.

But as you can see with the EMK Martin Rio I also wouldn't mind the guaed being just a little bit shorter. So after the sentimentality wears down a little I may remove a little of it.

But even with my bushcraft knives I may do tip and boring work with, I prefer the handle scales come further down around my forefinger and spread the pressure across my entire finger instead of just pushing on an integral guard.

LOL my dad started my training with a Buck 119 and in the field I just had to learn to pull the cutting board tp the edge of the picnic tables around Tampa Bay that we cooked on in the 70s, so it would work better in food prep. Where there is a will, and an appetite, there is a way

Thanks for all the background information and stories. Just a bit more information I've picked here up for (mental) storage and later use.

 

[TC]

my wife bought me this Model 11 back in 1993. It has processed a lot of deer/hogs/gators and small game. Currently its retired, as I have found other knives that I like better for those tasks.

Uh-oh. Cerebral conflict, unresolveable. Meat-Knife-Meat-Knife-Meat-Knife-Meat... aborting process, shut-down imminent. Process aborted; return to work.

 

[Mistwalker]

Thanks for all the background information and stories. Just a bit more information I've picked here up for (mental) storage and later use.

No worries. The whole point is to share thoughts and gain and knowledge from others as we go

 

[Mistwalker]

my wife bought me this Model 11 back in 1993. It has processed a lot of deer/hogs/gators and small game. Currently its retired, as I have found other knives that I like better for those tasks.

Very nice! Actually I did not get the No 11 to serve me as a dedicated hunting knife, or honestly eveb a hunting nife at all unless inadvertently. I wanted a Randall that I could field in my classes and workshops because I've always loved the look and always wanted one. In this instance what I wanted most was a Randall that had the look to the handle and sheath I wanted, but had a blade more suited to woodslore and herblore than fighting, BUT that could still cross that line with style if needs be. When my bible study partners showed it to me, I knew that was the one I wanted.

 

[Mistwalker]

No idea what's up with the images. I've sent an enquiry to Fotki to find out

 

[Mannlicher]

Mistwalker

Very nice! Actually I did not get the No 11 to serve me as a dedicated hunting knife, or honestly eveb a hunting nife at all unless inadvertently. I wanted a Randall that I could field in my classes and workshops because I've always loved the look and always wanted one. In this instance what I wanted most was a Randall that had the look to the handle and sheath I wanted, but had a blade more suited to woodslore and herblore than fighting, BUT that could still cross that line with style if needs be. When my bible study partners showed it to me, I knew that was the one I wanted.

I find that the Model 11 has a very thin edge at the bevel. The blade material is only about 5/32 inch at the thickest. The Randall catalog says .25 stock, but that just isn't the case with my knife. The edge of the blade just above the bevel is 1/32 thick. I don't find this thin a blade good for anything afield other than processing game. I loaned the Model 11 to my lad a few years back, and he nicked the edge on a deer bone while processing a buck. Took me some time to fix that.

 

[KiljoyKutlery]

Thank you for that. I can see his points, I don't dislike the guards as much as he does, I do like them to hang down a little because I absolutely loath integral guards. It's one of the reasons I got away from nives made by three of the companies I used to work for; TOPS, RMJ Tactical, and stopped carrying Fiddleback Forge knives even though I love everything else about Andy's knives. And it's one of the reasons I've declined testing and reviewing some knives online over the years, especially if the knife was presented as being a tactical style knife.

I fractured my pinkie twice on older TOPS knives doing tip work in frozen wood in Michigan in 2013 when my hands were cold.

I never had any such issues with the Spartan Defensa doing the same things and more

And I knew I wouldn't because I didn't have that issue in 2010 when I repeatedly punctured a fuel tank with a Spartan Hunter for a T&E article I did for Tactical Knives Magazine

I think Bill Harsey is among the few who sees the dynamic the same way I do.

One of the reason the RMJ Tactical Perefrine has the handle it has, is because when Jonathan was designing his first knife, I said "let me give you a little input" And I fixed a 2x12 on the wall of the shop, and stabbed the hunter into it full force in a reverse overhand grip. Then pulled it out and handed it to him and said now you. And he did.

Then I handed him another of my favorite knives, made for a completely different purpose, a Fiddleback midtech Kephart and said now this one. He looked at the knife and lack of guard, looked at the target, looked at me, handed the knife back and said "I get your point".

The Peregrine is a a fine combat knife in my opinion, and does well in bushcraft. But then I love recurves in the bush also.

Liking soldered brass, stainless, and nickle silver gueards is one of the reasons I paid as much as I did for this knife and for the EMK Rio Real I bought that was right at $500. I see them as more complete and more functional than most knives woth slab scales and integral guards.

But as you can see with the EMK Martin Rio I also wouldn't mind the guaed being just a little bit shorter. So after the sentimentality wears down a little I may remove a little of it.

But even with my bushcraft knives I may do tip and boring work with, I prefer the handle scales come further down around my forefinger and spread the pressure across my entire finger instead of just pushing on an integral guard.

LOL my dad started my training with a Buck 119 and in the field I just had to learn to pull the cutting board tp the edge of the picnic tables around Tampa Bay that we cooked on in the 70s, so it would work better in food prep. Where there is a will, and an appetite, there is a way

Can you post pictures or examples of Integral Guards that you don't like? I assume your talking about a full tang with the guard designed into the knife, and the handle slabs don't cover the protruding metal. Thanks

 

[Mistwalker]

Can you post pictures or examples of Integral Guards that you don't like? I assume your talking about a full tang with the guard designed into the knife, and the handle slabs don't cover the protruding metal. Thanks

Yes, it was supposed to say exposed integral guards, thank you for pointing that out I will fix it. Here is what I am talking about.

The feeling of just the width of the steel against my forefinger is what I don't like

 

[Quiet]

Yes, it was supposed to say exposed integral guards, thank you for pointing that out I will fix it. Here is what I am talking about.

The feeling of just the width of the steel against my forefinger is what I don't like

What is that first knife pictured? I don't recognize the maker's mark on the blade.

 

[Mistwalker]

What is that first knife pictured? I don't recognize the maker's mark on the blade.

It's the American Tomahawk "Rifleman"

 

[Quiet]

It's the American Tomahawk "Rifleman"

Thank you, sir! That is a gorgeous knife to my eye, I'll have to try to track one down. I also love your Randall, don't get me wrong! I'm enjoying watching your journey with it, as I always do! But that Rifleman....something about it speaks to me. Keep up the great photography, it's a genuine joy to see.

 

[KiljoyKutlery]

Yes, it was supposed to say exposed integral guards, thank you for pointing that out I will fix it. Here is what I am talking about.

The feeling of just the width of the steel against my forefinger is what I don't like

Yup, and I agree, generally, this is not an ideal grip design. Some smaller knives, I will allow, but if I think I will be doing anything requiring moderate or above "force" it's a NO GO

 

[Mistwalker]

Thank you, sir! That is a gorgeous knife to my eye, I'll have to try to track one down. I also love your Randall, don't get me wrong! I'm enjoying watching your journey with it, as I always do! But that Rifleman....something about it speaks to me. Keep up the great photography, it's a genuine joy to see.

It's not the knife's profile I dislike, I think the overall profile is excellent. It's the handle that I cannot stand. If the handle came around a little further on most other knife disgns especially handmade knives I would love it. But I also don't really care for shadowboxed tangs like these either. I can still remember when Ryan said at lunch one day something to the effect of his goal was to eventually produce knives all CNC, with the least amount of handwork possible. And then the beginings of that could be seen in the UCAP, The Combat Africa, and the original iteration of the Utsidihi. I am assuming, based on his work on the Peregrine and Wyvern, that Jonathan was largely responsible for the handle of the Utsidihi Gen 2.

I've bought more of Ed Martin's knives than I have anyone else;s because he is one of the few that make user knives with hilts and guards, and provides nice well made leather sheaths with them as well. And I trust Ed's heat treat as much as anyones. So, whatever else I may have on me in the field. I'll probably have one of these 3 on me as well.

 

[eveled]

Mistwalker
I find that the Model 11 has a very thin edge at the bevel. The blade material is only about 5/32 inch at the thickest. The Randall catalog says .25 stock, but that just isn't the case with my knife. The edge of the blade just above the bevel is 1/32 thick. I don't find this thin a blade good for anything afield other than processing game. I loaned the Model 11 to my lad a few years back, and he nicked the edge on a deer bone while processing a buck. Took me some time to fix that.

I think Randall would say it’s a purpose built knife made for professional use.

Most manufacturers are afraid to make really thin skinning knives because they don’t want to warantee broken blades.

 

[Mistwalker]

I think Randall would say it’s a purpose built knife made for professional use.

Most manufacturers are afraid to make really thin skinning knives because they don’t want to warantee broken blades.

It's definitely purpose driven, but It works perfectly for clearing game trails trails of the big @$$ brier vines the deer duck under, with minimal movement and noise. So I'll keep it within reasonable uses for the design other than emergency uses. That said it has spline small pine knots for demonstrating wet weather firecraft, so far it's doing wonderfully with no issues and is holding a good edge.