RAT v.s. Ontario?

sanddragger28 said:
Thats good marketing Walmart does it all the time. Sell something at a loss and make a bigger profit on something else because mentally you belive this store is the cheapest and will continue to go back. As you see here people are tlking about it so people are looking at what they have to sell so cheap. I like the Idea personally. I guess thats why Im in marketing!!!!!!!!!!!! LOL.
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:eek: Wow that makes sense.
 
I haven't looked through the rest of their site to see what the prices are on what else they are selling, but I guess it's lucky for us that RAT knives are their loss leader! :thumbup:

Chad
 
Get the Ontario Rat 3! It is the same quality as the RC 3. Any minor superiority that the RC 3 might have is not worth the large price gap. The only actual difference is that the RC 3 handle is longer. I like the shorter one-it depends on how large your hands are.
 
rg598 said:
Get the Ontario Rat 3! It is the same quality as the RC 3. Any minor superiority that the RC 3 might have is not worth the large price gap. The only actual difference is that the RC 3 handle is longer. I like the shorter one-it depends on how large your hands are.
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:foot: ;)
 
Wow, you've now increased your posts to #5. How long before they figure out your are just a troll.

Hmmm it would seem that Ontario employees have about the same amount of intelligence as they due QA/QC.....Sorry but that BS ain't going to go down here my fiend...

I'm calling you out!
 
rg598 said:
Get the Ontario Rat 3! It is the same quality as the RC 3. Any minor superiority that the RC 3 might have is not worth the large price gap. The only actual difference is that the RC 3 handle is longer. I like the shorter one-it depends on how large your hands are.
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The knives are made by different companies and receive a different heat treatment.

The Ontario does not have liners under the handle slabs to prevent corrosion - a significant benefit with a 1095 blade.

The F&F are better on the RC.

The handle on the RC is longer.

Sheaths different.

Other than that, they are identical. :rolleyes:
 
Again, whatever anyone wants to carry is fine with us and it absolutely does not upset us if someone carries something other than a RAT Cutlery knife. In fact, we have always welcomed posts here about other knives and manufacturers. We're all one big happy family here, and we all share a great common bond of enjoying good knives and knife tactics. Again, welcome to our forums.
 
Wait, so just because I like the Ontario RAT knives that I have, you think I work for Ontario?! Wow, did I just enter the church of RAT Cutlery? I thought that this was a forum where people asked questions to which they wanted an honest answer. You seem to like nothin but the RAT versions-does that make you a RAT employee; or perhaps you are sucking up to RAT Cutlery, hoping for a free blade! Just enter your email on the RAT site like the rest of us, and wait.

And wow, other than the length difference that I mentioned they have different sheaths and handle liners! Now I see the error of my ways, I'll pull out the extra $100 bucks for an RC now.

Don't worry, I'm not going to ruin your RC love-fest any more.
 
Thank you - your sarcasm rings true. I don't have a problem with you liking your Ontario rat. I have a problem with you coming here and questioning why somebody would pay extra dollars to buy a knife with guarenteed quality and not one that is a stolen design.

So we see eye to eye.
 
You should read my posts, I have no problem with paying more for a cause. I was answering the question that was posted "RAT vs. Ontario?". You are the one who jumped on me because I said I would get the Ontario version becasue it costs less.

I'm sorry, but the way I feel about Ontario as a company does not change what I think about the quality of their products.
 
Do you know what a handle liner is?

What $100 difference?

Would you care to address the heat treatment issue?
 
Okay - I will apologize for calling you a troll. I see from your other posts that you are responding to more complex aspects. Perhaps you can see where some of us sensitive types might be coming from as well. Compromise is always about perspective isn't it?

Truly, I have read your posts. When it comes down to it, I personally am a buyer who buy's into the integrity of a product as much as a product itself. Part of why I invest in RC-cutlery is because of the excellent knives they make. Part of why I invest in RC-cutlery is because I believe in Jeff and Mike as stand up guys and a truly American company.

Hell, I don't even believe in half their politics, but they strike me as honest individuals who have a conscience. They invest in us as users by their presence and advice. They are sincere. I also give my loyality a number of other makers on these forums who I think are personally stand-up individuals. That is how I am.

I have also had experience with multiple Ontario blades as I have suggested in my previous posts. Some were great, and some were not good at all. Every RC-blade I have handled has been of great quality.

I promise not to be interactive with your posts anymore.
 
Thomas Linton said:
Do you know what a handle liner is?

What $100 difference?

Would you care to address the heat treatment issue?
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OK, explain to me how the different heat treatment done by Ontario and RAT effects specific aspects of the 1095 blade, for example the ability to handle latteral forces (if you know what that means, that is)!

And by the way, if you are not sure how to prevent corosion on a 1095 blade, perhaps you should just go with the D2, or ask some of the other members for advise.
 
I tried to give you a peace offering and then you go and give someone like Thomas, with more than 7000 posts to his name, a hard time. Sorry but I rescind my apology. Troll you are.

Differential heat treat. The edge is harder than the spine. This is a design improvement in the RC-blades over the original Rat blades. Differential heat treat improves the knives ability to withstand lateral stresses. I.e. it doesn't break in half when you try to pry with it. Yes the edge wants to break, but the spine, being softer and tougher resists the urge to snap. Obviously there are limits to this. After all the RC-4 did snap under a step test. But the method, in terms of design attributes, has been tested and demonstrated in countless instances in several knives. RC-blades are differentially heat treated with the intended purpose to give their knives this particular attribute. Ontario knives are not.
 
rg598 said:
OK, explain to me how the different heat treatment done by Ontario and RAT effects specific aspects of the 1095 blade, for example the ability to handle latteral forces (if you know what that means, that is)!
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Heat treat is everything.
RAT knives, particularly RAT-7s have been known to break while batoning, especially in cold weather. This was more of a problem with the D2 models -- seems they ran a batch with a bad heat treat, but has happened with the 1095 blades as well. Personally, I've never had a 1095 Ontario (Spec-Plus knives, RAT-7, machetes) break on me. I've had them too soft, but not too brittle.

Consistent heat treat,a nd the right heat treat for the application are key. RC has this. You can take all the arguments about edge geometry, grind angles, scandi vs convex vs flat vs hollow grind, this steel vs that steel, and throw them out the window -- they mean nothing if your heat treat is wrong. A good heat treat can make a cheap piece of steel (and let's face it, 1095 is cheap steel. You don't use it because it's the best, you use it because it's the least expensive that is appropriate for the task at hand.) into a fabulous blade. Or, you can take the best steel and turn it into a piece of crap with a bad heat treat.

FACT: Ontario has been hit and miss on their heat treat, as the norm.
FACT: I heard of ONE RC blade with a heat treat problem (too soft I think) and RAT Cutlery replaced it. It was an aberration, not the norm.

rg598 said:
And by the way, if you are not sure how to prevent corrosion on a 1095 blade, perhaps you should just go with the D2, or ask some of the other members for advise.
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D2 is overrated. In fact, I'd say it's near the bottom of my list of blade steels. it tends towards hardness, and thus, brittleness. As a tool steel, it was designed for hardness and shape (edge) retention at the expense of toughness -- D3 is even more so. If seen D2 rust to complete sh*t in no time flat. A2 or O1 are better choices for knives.
 
I agree about the D2. However, RAT only gives the two options.

As far as heat tratment, I don't think it ruins the knife, it only makes it fit for one purpose over another.

I do however think there is a significant difference between types of steel. That is why hight quality swords, where the forces on the blade have much more impact, contain different types of steel in different areas.

By the way, KGD, relax! I wasn't actually asking for information. My comment to him was designed to be as condescending as his.
 
:grumpy::grumpy::grumpy: I hopped on here hopping to find out some new info about some upcoming RC products and all I see is this new dude running to every thread that mentions onatrio bringing up the same subject. I respect your point of view, and I admire your use of freedom of speech, but what you are doing is running into the republic convention talking about how great hilary and obama is. Now if you want to bitch and complain about something please do us all a favor and stay in 1 thread.
 
Sorry! I just thought that a post titled "RAT vs. Ontario" would be about RAT vs. Ontarion, not about updates to RAT knives.

I didn't know the forum was dedicated to the love of RC knives. If you look at my second post, you will see that I asked if there was some implied rule about not openly discussing these issues. I though that these was a place that could handle an honest conversation about knives, but I see that most people here are too emotionally invested and can not accept any differing opinion.

Again, I apologize for ruining everyone's time, but I must say, I honestly didn't know that this was the "RC convention". You should realy put some sort of warning on the forum, especially if you are going to allow such questions to be posted.
 
:D I forgive you,

and as far as RC love and the RC convention well yeah this is basically what this forum is for it is the RAT Cutlery Company which is RC.
 
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