Rats and Dogs are obviously not on the same learning and interest level as us hogs.

Cobalt said:
So this was originally a satin LE. It was then blued(blueing has no copper that I know of). I then soaked it in vinegar and wiped it with paper towels. Not sure where that much copper would show up.
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Perma Blue and others contain Cupric Sulfate. AKA copper.

You should probably run the test again with a different blade.
 
rcb2000 said:
Just curious, what would be the significance of copper in a knife steel composition? Never heard of it... or is that what it strange about it?
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Typically it will aid in corrosion resistance like nickel.
 
Sethrotull said:
Perma Blue and others contain Cupric Sulfate. AKA copper.
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This is true, and a good point. While I wouldn't think there would be residual copper in the surface, I suppose it is possible. Over 1/4% is a pretty decent amount though.

Cobalt, if you want to re-run the test and need some virgin Satin SR-101, let me know and I'll get something to you.
 
Cupric sulfate is 39% copper and it makes up 3% of perma blue. So you are looking at it being 1.2% copper of a coating. The coating was etched 10 hours and scrubbed. The analyzer actually is an xray machine that hits the bare metal and goes about 1/8 inch deep to get reflections of the different elements. A surface element would come as a tiny percentage in the .01% range. 0.274% is huge so I am betting that the element was in the steel not on any coating. As for retesting. These tests are not cheap. And I try to space them out, because they charge me a lot less than if they did it officially. But I am pretty confident that there is no way that much copper would have shown up on a coating that was removed.
 
Cool! I didn't think these tests were surface only, but wasn't 100% sure. Since they're not, I would agree; No way a 1.2% surface layer would add up to that amount of copper.

Thanks Cobalt! :thumbup:
 
SpyderPhreak said:
Cool! I didn't think these tests were surface only, but wasn't 100% sure. Since they're not, I would agree; No way a 1.2% surface layer would add up to that amount of copper.

Thanks Cobalt! :thumbup:
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Also the test was done on both sides of each knife.
 
Ah, so similar results then? Definitely wouldn't get that kind of number twice unless it was really in there. :thumbup:
 
Thanks for sharing Cobalt! :)

Sorry I hope you don't mind but I'm a nanotechnologist by trade and I just wondered if you could very kindly let me pick your brain to fulfil my curiosity:

- Of the elements you have found what combinations of compounds did you find? Were the majority of the impurities carbides for example?
- What geometry were the impurities? I work with/make carbon composites and impurities with larger aspect ratio like carbon nanotube like the ones found in wootz steel (the original damascus steel) tends to make the composite (in this case steel) harder.
- Did you find the distribution of impurities to be more homogeneous or agglomerated? (I think from my limited knowledge and what I have learnt from everybody here it might be called pearlite and martensite but not sure...)
- Did you find any surface functionalisation on the impurities? I've found that at nano scale, surface chemistry has a monumental influence on the way they behave and I wondered if that plays a role.
- Do you have any pretty pictures like SEM of the cross section? If you have any please share them with us. I think I speak for everyone when I say we would love to see them!

Again I really hope you don't mind me asking. I am truly fascinated about learning something new especially from an expert like you. If you have time please let us know what you think.

Thanks :)
 
kaizo said:
Thanks for sharing Cobalt! :)

Sorry I hope you don't mind but I'm a nanotechnologist by trade and I just wondered if you could very kindly let me pick your brain to fulfil my curiosity:

- Of the elements you have found what combinations of compounds did you find? Were the majority of the impurities carbides for example?
- What geometry were the impurities? I work with/make carbon composites and impurities with larger aspect ratio like carbon nanotube like the ones found in wootz steel (the original damascus steel) tends to make the composite (in this case steel) harder.
- Did you find the distribution of impurities to be more homogeneous or agglomerated? (I think from my limited knowledge and what I have learnt from everybody here it might be called pearlite and martensite but not sure...)
- Did you find any surface functionalisation on the impurities? I've found that at nano scale, surface chemistry has a monumental influence on the way they behave and I wondered if that plays a role.
- Do you have any pretty pictures like SEM of the cross section? If you have any please share them with us. I think I speak for everyone when I say we would love to see them!

Again I really hope you don't mind me asking. I am truly fascinated about learning something new especially from an expert like you. If you have time please let us know what you think.

Thanks :)
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Kaizo, I am sorry man, I never intended to portray myself as an expert. I just have a business that is willing to run their machine on the side for me. They usually charge big bucks for this due to safety etc. However, the next time I get something tested I will try to see if they can provide answers to some of your questions, as long as it doesn't end up costing me a lot more.
 
Cobalt said:
Kaizo, I am sorry man, I never intended to portray myself as an expert. I just have a business that is willing to run their machine on the side for me. They usually charge big bucks for this due to safety etc. However, the next time I get something tested I will try to see if they can provide answers to some of your questions, as long as it doesn't end up costing me a lot more.
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Ah I'm incredibly sorry Cobalt it was a mistake on my behalf and I hope I didn't offend you. I'm pretty sure you have a plethora of knowledge far beyond mine and I would still love to learn from what you share here. If you do come across any more info please let us know! :)
 
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